Casual december game

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Originally Posted by Cape90

Yes and yes. Literally both.

I remember you, I very much wolfread you in FAM2 lol

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You were one of the few people suspecting me who talked to me rather than about me and I really appreciated that at the time. You're being a lot less tunnelly this game than I would have expected. How do you feel you've evolved as a player in the months between?

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Originally Posted by Logic

Out of game Visor: "logic is super easy to read. I don't think I've ever gotten him wrong.
In game visor: "Logic obvious wolf"

When I'm villaging, if visor calls me scum with certaity, he's scum himself. I say this with confidence, because I don't think I've ever been wrong in this before. (Sample size, 5? games)

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Are there other players in this game who you think should know about Visor being good at reading you?

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Originally Posted by hollowkatt

Also luv2 is a wolf.

vote: luv2spooge

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Is this based on more than that he's putting you as a top town and you feel you haven't earned that spot yet so he must have tmi?

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Originally Posted by EnderWiggin

I think Logic is fully in wolf meta.

But I also am noting no push back against the wagon, like almost zilch.

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This is what I was referring to when I said Logic is either town or being bussed. And it would make sense in a game with a lot of strong town that if one of your team gets caught in an unfortunate start that you'd rather let them go and try to get some towncred than that you'd risk losing two members.

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Originally Posted by Boquise

What's funny tbh?

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It's obviously not Dale. If Spooge is who I think it is then we've played exactly one game together that also had at least two other players who are here.

I like Totally not Taffy's posting right now, they can be town.

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Originally Posted by EnderWiggin

Taffy is moderately likely town unless I'm misreading my own notes on her play.

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Can you compile your reads for me real quick, please?

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Originally Posted by Vulgard

Can you compile your reads for me real quick, please?

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Given I'm halfway to sleep right now unfortunately not. I don't know how much of it I remember off the top of my head.

Taffy town, Logic wolf, Amy maybe town, Vul maybe town, Pizza ?????????????????????

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Originally Posted by Vulgard

Fwiw, if ATPG flips mafia, I would strongly consider clearing Ender and Amy, even though ATPG said he was more than happy to leave distancing spew. And if one of Ender/Amy flips mafia, probably give ATPG some time and see if he dies for it (because by his own admission, he should).

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I disagree with this, Ender's scumread on Asks was equally premature and based on stuff he should know is NAI as I think Asks' read on Ender is. They could both be wrong town, or it could be distancing since, if Asks is a wolf, he can't expect to endgame so he needs to do that right from the start.

Nothing can ever truly unpair me and Pizza. We have done some epic distancing in the past.

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Originally Posted by EnderWiggin

Given I'm halfway to sleep right now unfortunately not. I don't know how much of it I remember off the top of my head.

Taffy town, Logic wolf, Amy maybe town, Vul maybe town, Pizza ?????????????????????

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Why do you have me as town and why did your mind about ATPG change? I thought you had him as a wolf earlier, or was I misunderstanding?

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Originally Posted by Vulgard

Why do you have me as town and why did your mind about ATPG change? I thought you had him as a wolf earlier, or was I misunderstanding?

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I had him as wolf then agreed my take that leaned him wolf was uncharitable and dropped it since I rail about others using that read.

I had you as town fairly early? The whole "Logic towny... wait no wolf?" Bit

I wish I knew how to read ender but I always get him wrong when I try

I also think pizza is firmly in both metas rn. He hasn't done anything I think is strictly villagery or strictly wolfy

Ender, did I miss you telling us who the second obvious wolf was at the start?

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Originally Posted by dyachei

I wish I knew how to read ender but I always get him wrong when I try

I also think pizza is firmly in both metas rn. He hasn't done anything I think is strictly villagery or strictly wolfy

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To be fair there's not many who can read me well consistently.

What is your gth take on me?

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Originally Posted by Totally not Taffy

Ender, did I miss you telling us who the second obvious wolf was at the start?

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Yes

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Originally Posted by EnderWiggin

To be fair there's not many who can read me well consistently.

What is your gth take on me?

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I still have you as null. I see some similarities to the TS game but I think they're easy enough to fake as a wolf. I do better reading you off of spew

Unvote

I need to spend lots of hours doing more analysis but right now it's prepping dinner, dinner, kids and family time, kiddo bedtime, and then my schedule is still booked solid until deadline.

Everything has to be done overnight for me, please excuse me I gotta be not here and not thinking about the game.

I don't even know what's happening in the game so it's going to take hours to reconnect and reformulate leans.

Couldn't follow through, hope you all have this in my absence.

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Originally Posted by Vulgard

Ngl if Logic's town we wasted this entire day phase.

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If Logic's town we just yeet visor for funsies. prob dya as well.

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Originally Posted by Csargo

If Logic's town we just yeet visor for funsies. prob dya as well.

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Why them?

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Originally Posted by Vulgard

Why them?

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Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

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Originally Posted by Logic

I just spent the last 14 hours playing a 24-year-old Video game, AMA

Anyway, to more relevant thoughts, Visor voting for me is the only one I would call an indictment.

There are a handful of people that can soulread me correctly every time, and visor is on that list.

Ladd I think should be able to read me correctly by now, but I can forgive him at this point.

Pizza having sus but not committing to it is about right for him, so I'm giving him a day pass (as if I could be the pebble that brings down a mountain on him)

Dya being comfortable? on day 1 I think is their wolfy meta.

TLDR
After I flip villager, nuke visor.

Vote: Visor

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Originally Posted by dyachei

i feel like exactly the people i would expect to be wolf read pre-rand are the ones people are most concerned about

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just me being simple, but I'm okay with it

I think visor/dya are town currently and logic is just a woof tbh

I also wonder why pizza just ignored(?) Logic for the most part and didn't put them on their woof leans

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Originally Posted by Vulgard

I wrote a big wallpost about it not long after that post.

Logic, what's your opinion on Spooge? That's my current alternative to your wagon.

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Spooge had a single post that pinged me as scummy, but has not made an impact on me otherwise.

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Originally Posted by Totally not Taffy

This is what I was referring to when I said Logic is either town or being bussed. And it would make sense in a game with a lot of strong town that if one of your team gets caught in an unfortunate start that you'd rather let them go and try to get some towncred than that you'd risk losing two members.

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Ok, so if I'm being bussed, who do you think are most likely my partners?

And if I'm town, who do you think is wrong town, and who do you think is opportunistic wolf?

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Originally Posted by Totally not Taffy

Are there other players in this game who you think should know about Visor being good at reading you?

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In order of most likely to know

Pizza

Monty
Csargo

Big gap

Dya (maybe)
Amy (maybe)

i dont think i can soulread u correctly bronana (thats gh) :P

in any event, ignoring that, who seems wolfy and villagery to u

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Originally Posted by Logic

In order of most likely to know

Pizza

Monty
Csargo

Big gap
Ladd

Dya (maybe)
Amy (maybe)

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Edited to add Ladd in the crew
(By way of an additional post)

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Originally Posted by Logic

In order of most likely to know

Pizza

Monty
Csargo

Big gap

Dya (maybe)
Amy (maybe)

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I only remember Zack's game where you subbed in and were a woof.

Looking at those posts Visor never used words that exuded confidence in your alignment imo.

If you're town I do think you post high quality analysis, so the visor can soulread me angle is sort of odd tbh.

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Originally Posted by Csargo

I only remember Zack's game where you subbed in and were a woof.

Looking at those posts Visor never used words that exuded confidence in your alignment imo.

If you're town I do think you post high quality analysis, so the visor can soulread me angle is sort of odd tbh.

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oh i was p confident he was a wolf in that game tbf

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Originally Posted by Visor

oh i was p confident he was a wolf in that game tbf

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Okay, I also don't really think that game is a good barometer of what Logic's saying tho. And I don't recall any other games in recent memory.

logic, most games i've been in with you, I've let GH read you

but I do still think you're wolfy at a baseline to most people

logic part of the issue is your posting is all reactive atm instead of proactive - you're already assuming u r dead and are saying kill x for reading me wrong instead of finding the actual wolves and villagers in the ppl reading u

idk - i think its something we can get caught up in, its not going to change peoples minds, you need to show some solving

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Originally Posted by Csargo

I only remember Zack's game where you subbed in and were a woof.

Looking at those posts Visor never used words that exuded confidence in your alignment imo.

If you're town I do think you post high quality analysis, so the visor can soulread me angle is sort of odd tbh.

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I thought you knew Visor can soulread me as well as GH can. And what makes you think he doesn't have confidence in the read?

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Originally Posted by Visor

logic part of the issue is your posting is all reactive atm instead of proactive - you're already assuming u r dead and are saying kill x for reading me wrong instead of finding the actual wolves and villagers in the ppl reading u

idk - i think its something we can get caught up in, its not going to change peoples minds, you need to show some solving

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I always do some solving regarding how people treat my slot. It's why I have said time and time again that I work better under pressure.

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Originally Posted by Logic

I always do some solving regarding how people treat my slot. It's why I have said time and time again that I work better under pressure.

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I just have to do the "solving regarding my own slot" early because I came under fire for treating a casual game in a casual manner.

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Originally Posted by dyachei

logic, most games i've been in with you, I've let GH read you

but I do still think you're wolfy at a baseline to most people

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All of this sounds like town Dya.

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Originally Posted by Logic

I thought you knew Visor can soulread me as well as GH can. And what makes you think he doesn't have confidence in the read?

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I have a pretty bad memory, so I didn't know that. I also had no idea gh could soulread you tbh.

He seemingly has confidence in his read here, which I can understand, even though he didn't really explain why(?) I don't think. I was talking about the other game, but I was wrong :bow:

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Originally Posted by Logic

I just have to do the "solving regarding my own slot" early because I came under fire for treating a casual game in a casual manner.

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i dont think ppl are wolfreading u for treating the game casually - ppl are wolfreading u for the content of your posts

i found some of your phrasing and post construction wolfy - felt disjointed to me

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Originally Posted by EnderWiggin

No thought on me despite me being one of the loudest proponents of pushing you Logic?

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@EnderWiggen
I saw you voting for me, and thought the reasoning I spotted was sound albeit wrong.

But I've also skipped a bunch of posts, so of you got somethingyou specifically want my attention on, feel free to tag me with some postnums.

I do hope you'll forgive me for missing something you wanted my attention on. (And I don't mean "forgive" in a game sense; I'm saying this because I've potentially been rude by ignoring something you've said.)

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Originally Posted by Logic

@EnderWiggen
I saw you voting for me, and thought the reasoning I spotted was sound albeit wrong.

But I've also skipped a bunch of posts, so of you got somethingyou specifically want my attention on, feel free to tag me with some postnums.

I do hope you'll forgive me for missing something you wanted my attention on. (And I don't mean "forgive" in a game sense; I'm saying this because I've potentially been rude by ignoring something you've said.)

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@EnderWiggin

Vote:Kage :whip:

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Originally Posted by Visor

i dont think ppl are wolfreading u for treating the game casually - ppl are wolfreading u for the content of your posts

i found some of your phrasing and post construction wolfy - felt disjointed to me

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I'm used to being either misyeet, IC, or oracle; I'll take those odds.

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Vote:Kage :whip:

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This seems out of nowhere.
Especially since you were considering me, as far as I could tell.

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Originally Posted by Csargo

I have a pretty bad memory, so I didn't know that. I also had no idea gh could soulread you tbh.

He seemingly has confidence in his read here, which I can understand, even though he didn't really explain why(?) I don't think. I was talking about the other game, but I was wrong :bow:

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Is GH playing this game?

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Vote:Kage :whip:

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Someone joining my mystery wagon huh tbh!

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Originally Posted by Logic

This seems out of nowhere.
Especially since you were considering me, as far as I could tell.

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Everyone is within consideration, there are multiple woofs after all. I would have considered visor as well, but I don't see what the motivation for burying you would be.

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Originally Posted by Boquise

Is GH playing this game?

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:shrug:

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Originally Posted by Ampharos

logic's super pessimistic about his wolf game, there's definitely a world where w!logic gets hard discouraged after being the thread's First Big Wolfread tm and just asks to be turbobussed

at which point i think the least logic-aligned person would probably be boquise, who i otherwise think looks like the obvious level 0 logic partner lmao

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Had I randed wolf, this would be 90% correct.

I have one skill in my wolfgame, and it's that my iso is not useful in finding my teammates. It's certainly a useful skill considering when I'm a wolf I live no longer than d3.

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Originally Posted by Vulgard

Ngl if Logic's town we wasted this entire day phase.

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Not if you follow my legacy of "nuke visor after I'm dead"

okay but find the actual wolves logic

dont just say cause i wolfread u i must be a wolf and to kill me

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Originally Posted by Totally not Taffy

I have a dislike of going with consensus especially D1 because it often lands on town and it provides easy cover for wolves. If we're all throwing a lot of reads/observations around, then they are forced to do so as well and the D5 conversation can be better than "you voted Logic - well so did you - yes but my reasons were more genuine than your reasons".

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I am firmly of the opinion that a D1 misyeet (myself included) is better for info on later days than accurately yeeting a wolf.

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Originally Posted by Visor

okay but find the actual wolves logic

dont just say cause i wolfread u i must be a wolf and to kill me

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I'll find who I find in my own time.

You don't like it? Yeet me.

I'm looking at everyone talking about me, because there's far more of than than talking to me.

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Originally Posted by Logic

I'll find who I find in my own time.

You don't like it? Yeet me.

I'm looking at everyone talking about me, because there's far more of than than talking to me.

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i mean we have 7 hours left

so your own time needs to be p soon

esp if you want to kill someone you think is actually a wolf

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Originally Posted by Visor

i mean we have 7 hours left

so your own time needs to be p soon

esp if you want to kill someone you think is actually a wolf

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Lol
You must have missed where I said a D1 town yeet is preferable to long term games.

I am also looking for towns to try and veto a yeet there, assuming my wagon falls apart (not likely.) So far I have a couple I think are consensus (cape and Boq looking towny to me) and I'm liking what I see of Dya and Vulgard.

My pool of suspects include Amy, you, and Csargo.
I've already reiterated my stance on you plenty; no need to rehash it.
Amy looks stilted and uncomfortable; she could be due for some pressure.
Csargo dancing around suspicion of me and then dropping a vote on someone I only saw a single post from has me doing the :fry:

I love waking up to 6 new pages to read

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Originally Posted by Vulgard

I wrote a big wallpost about it not long after that post.

Logic, what's your opinion on Spooge? That's my current alternative to your wagon.

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this one?

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Originally Posted by Vulgard

Speaking of my reads, I ought to compile them.

I have dya V for her approach to my slot and to the game in general, they're just chillin'. This is the type of read I'm somewhat likely to be wrong about, so I don't want to attribute too much weight to it, but I feel good enough about dya for now.

I also felt good about Csargo when he was posting. The read on him is dropping a bit because of recency bias, but it's still there.

I had a dumb read on Visor/ladd that they were V/V for ladd explaining his wolfread on Logic in a very memeworthy way and Visor V reading him for it immediately, then them entering banter. I felt like that was the type of thing villagers do with each other as they find each other but neither feels like making a show of it.

Ender/Amy/ATPG is a weird group that contains a wolf IMO. I currently think the wolf is most likely ATPG, but I also think that ATPG is the most isolated-in-thread of these players, and I want to respect his reads a bit, which is why the two people he sussed the most openly are also in this grouping. Basically, he's either a wolf pushing town (Ender and Amy) or he's right on at least one of them is the way I see the situation. Not exactly helpful to see it this way because it doesn't allow determining which one to vote, but it does narrow down the focus a bit, I suppose. I currently think ATPG is the wolfiest, but I have some concerns about this belief considering how big of a role he's played so far and how few people have actually talked about him in a meaningful way. Though on the other hand I don't know if him not being talked about in a meaningful way by most players (by meaningful, I mean with actual conclusions in regard to his alignment) makes him town, it could just make him a wolf lol (imagine knowing and applying consistent principles for catching wolves). Kinda tempted to move my vote there, but. Fwiw, if ATPG flips mafia, I would strongly consider clearing Ender and Amy, even though ATPG said he was more than happy to leave distancing spew. And if one of Ender/Amy flips mafia, probably give ATPG some time and see if he dies for it (because by his own admission, he should).

Logic just feels like a slot everyone has silently agreed is mafia and I'm probably okay with yeeting him.

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If so thanks, if not can you point me to it?

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Originally Posted by Ampharos

yeah ok fine

i don't like how logic went straight to "visor is a wolf" without even trying to engage with the read on him

if someone i thought had a really good read on me (e.g. dya) was incorrectly wolfreading me, i'd do everything in my power to figure out where the read is coming from and whether it has a good foundation before i'd write them off as a wolf. not once in my life have i been so confident in someone else's amy-reading abilities as to jump straight to "if X is wrong on my alignment, they're wolfing" without any intermediary steps

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why not though? like at some point if you're town and you're convinced that someone else is reading you wolf when they should, by history/experience/whatever, be reading you town or at worst null isn't the logical conclusion "this person isn't pushing me in good faith"?

Like sure you said you've never been "so confident" in someone elses ability to read you but Logic appears to be stating Visor should be able to do that correctly (intimating So Confident) which makes that leap to "visor is a wolf" more of a legit conclusion than what you're arguing.

Logic (5): Amy, Ender, Vulgard, Ladd, Visor
Visor (2): Montmo, Logic
Kage (2): Boquise, Csargo
HK (1): Taffy
Luv2spooge (1): HK
ATPG (1): luv2spooge
Renata (1): Kagemusha

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Originally Posted by luvs2spooge

Well you see, I read posts and I determined that on the sum of the posts that I read these were the most likely alignments for each player.

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Originally Posted by luvs2spooge

No, I am not. And you are town. And you are an easy read. So don't vote me just because you're an easy read Hollowkatt.

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somehow I'm less concerned with how you got to your reads and more concerned with how easily you're handing me a town read.

When I asked why you had those reads I expected at least a small blurb about a few of them like "I like this post, or tonally they're free and easy" not "I read their posts and this is the ordering" which makes me wonder if your reads list isn't basically scraping the thread for consensus and then saying "these are my reads"

Lets talk then about just a couple of your reads:

Ampharos Town - why is Ampharos town?

Taffy - Sorta Wolfy - why is Taffy sorta wolfy and what does sorta wolfy mean?

Vulgard Wolf - why is Vulgard wolf?

Heya hollowkatt.

Talk to me about me, if you will. Or anyone that's made a read on me and your thoughts on it.

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Originally Posted by Logic

Lol
You must have missed where I said a D1 town yeet is preferable to long term games.

I am also looking for towns to try and veto a yeet there, assuming my wagon falls apart (not likely.) So far I have a couple I think are consensus (cape and Boq looking towny to me) and I'm liking what I see of Dya and Vulgard.

My pool of suspects include Amy, you, and Csargo.
I've already reiterated my stance on you plenty; no need to rehash it.
Amy looks stilted and uncomfortable; she could be due for some pressure.
Csargo dancing around suspicion of me and then dropping a vote on someone I only saw a single post from has me doing the :fry:

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

just me being simple, but I'm okay with it

I think visor/dya are town currently and logic is just a woof tbh

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:rolleyes:

I mean, I don't feel like I've been acting as you say. Just cause I didn't drop my vote on you and call it a day. I've been trying to find you, if you're town, while exploring other possibilities.

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Originally Posted by Csargo

:rolleyes:

I mean, I don't feel like I've been acting as you say. Just cause I didn't drop my vote on you and call it a day. I've been trying to find you, if you're town, while exploring other possibilities.

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"Just a wolf"
"Trying to find you"

You don't see the dichotomy there?

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Originally Posted by Logic

"Just a wolf"
"Trying to find you"

You don't see the dichotomy there?

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from last night to this morning no not really. I engaged you about visor and who he was with and why last night. To now where I've continued to try and engage with you.

I was backreading, but the amount of pizza walls
Attachment 26178

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Originally Posted by Csargo

from last night to this morning no not really. I engaged you about visor and who he was with and why last night. To now where I've continued to try and engage with you.

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Where are you at today, on a scale of 0-10 in confidence level?

If I'm town, who is also wrong? Who's taking advantage of my wagon?
(Feel free to ask these of yourself and not answer them publicly)

by imperial decree

i now no longer think logic is a wolf

(if the wolves really encouraged logic to go all out there, props to them)

time to shift wagons folks

Vote: Boquise

Ill try to be around at least a bit before eod

Sorry, i knew i wasnt gonna have much time until the 11th but didnt think it'd be this bad

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Originally Posted by Logic

I am firmly of the opinion that a D1 misyeet (myself included) is better for info on later days than accurately yeeting a wolf.

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what a post to open the thread to tbh

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Originally Posted by Logic

In order of most likely to know

Pizza

Monty
Csargo

Big gap

Dya (maybe)
Amy (maybe)

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kinda surprised that you didnt have me in your read list here tbh

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Originally Posted by Csargo

:shrug:

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your post implied that tbh

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Originally Posted by Visor

by imperial decree

i now no longer think logic is a wolf

(if the wolves really encouraged logic to go all out there, props to them)

time to shift wagons folks

Vote: Boquise

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this unpairs visor with logic me thinks tbh

austria declaring war on sweden, we shall see who has sown his last potato after this brouhaha tbh

idk that logic would prefer he be an elim if he were a wolf

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Originally Posted by Boquise

your post implied that tbh

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Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Csargo

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Logic

I thought you knew Visor can soulread me as well as GH can. And what makes you think he doesn't have confidence in the read?

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I have a pretty bad memory, so I didn't know that. I also had no idea gh could soulread you tbh.

He seemingly has confidence in his read here, which I can understand, even though he didn't really explain why(?) I don't think. I was talking about the other game, but I was wrong :bow:

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How?

Surprised to have not heard much from monty so far

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Originally Posted by Visor

Surprised to have not heard much from monty so far

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i didnt even realize they were in the game

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Originally Posted by Csargo

How?

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Second sentence in first paragraph is about GH.
The next paragraph there is just a "he". Considering you most recently wrote GH, the logic of that language implies GH is the "he" lest another name would have been written first tbh. This is a misplaced modifier tbh

Your punishment is 10 laps around the school building tbh

Vote Ampharos

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Originally Posted by Boquise

Second sentence in first paragraph is about GH.
The next paragraph there is just a "he". Considering you most recently wrote GH, the logic of that language implies GH is the "he" lest another name would have been written first tbh. This is a misplaced modifier tbh

Your punishment is 10 laps around the school building tbh

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Should have wrote Visor instead of he, noted. I'll get to running.

town reads:
cape, vulgard

town leans:
visor, dya, hk, luvs

i am too tired after today smh

i had previously a weak town lean on Amy, as described earlier. I am reverting the read to a weak scum lean because of how Amy is approaching the game and me reminds me of how they have approached those things previously as mafia. Like super easily town read me earlier today for my responses. Amy is a prone Boqusher and is easily paranoid of me tbh. I expected her to feel like I was pocketing her and react to that, if she is town. I have previously misread Amy due to her town reading me and due to how I usually read their mood (it is very relatable tbh).

Also this post:

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Originally Posted by Ampharos

i have an immediate concern w/ how logic's reentered the thread but i'm gonna sit on it for a bit to see if it's self-correcting

mostly posting this because it's fun to watch logic squirm

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Feels like Amy hiding thoughts from the thread. It is hard for Logic to combat this post due to its secrecy. i have more words but they cant get out atm tbh


oh and i voted Kage because there was a post I disliked and I wanted to see how the thread reacted tbh

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Originally Posted by Boquise

town reads:
cape, vulgard

town leans:
visor, dya, hk, luvs

i am too tired after today smh

i had previously a weak town lean on Amy, as described earlier. I am reverting the read to a weak scum lean because of how Amy is approaching the game and me reminds me of how they have approached those things previously as mafia. Like super easily town read me earlier today for my responses. Amy is a prone Boqusher and is easily paranoid of me tbh. I expected her to feel like I was pocketing her and react to that, if she is town. I have previously misread Amy due to her town reading me and due to how I usually read their mood (it is very relatable tbh).

Also this post:


Feels like Amy hiding thoughts from the thread. It is hard for Logic to combat this post due to its secrecy. i have more words but they cant get out atm tbh


oh and i voted Kage because there was a post I disliked and I wanted to see how the thread reacted tbh

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how did the thread react and what do you think about it?