Infraction, multi-culture

Just got an infraction from our friendly mod: Banquo's Ghost

Reason why is the quote that follows posted in a thread about multiculturalism.

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Hmmm... This might be the first time ever I agree with Fragony.

I grew up as an anti-racist, but after having been in contact with the multicultural expirement I must say I have become... Well, not a racist, but a cultureist (is that even a word).

I don't think race has anything to do with the problems, cultures do.

Fragony is right about the rapes in Sweden. Norway just made a investigation public, it showed that close to 100% of the assault rapes were made by immigrants.

It is mainly the assault rape figures that have risen steadily in Sweden the last 10 years or so.

One might claim that Norway and Sweden is not alike, but let's face it... We dont have a swedish survey of this; as both the state and media do their best to block such info.

Also, looking at the rape-assault trials the offenders name isnt exactly Johan, Sven, Anders.. It's rather Mamhud, Nözzgul and so on...

In many areas Swedish women in their short skirts are seen as whores, and it's quite ok to gang-rape a whore, isnt it?

It went so far that "multiculture" is now slang for gang-rape.

People from ME-states and African nations are the largest group of sex-offenders (about 80%).



The immigration was on reason why I left sweden... I have double nationality, and I just like it better in Austria. Where I live now there are no black people drinking from the toilet and shitting in the bushes (no joke, I had a former neighbour straight from the djungle) and I can park my unlocked bike outside my house for weeks without it getting stolen. Where i used to live I couldnt even park it outside with heavy chains.



I am all for supporting people who have to flee, however, set up refuge camps in neighbouring countries, where the cultures are more alike. I would happily support such refuge camps. However, I do NOT want the western world to build up ghettos with immigrants behaving like orks from Tolkien.

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Can someone highlight the part that break forum rules?

I think there is a single obscenity in it.

which bit? :)

This should be in the Backroom Watchtower.

That aside, that post was edited by BQ:

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Last edited by Banquo's Ghost; Today at 09:44. Reason: Removed bad language and racist remarks

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The 11th paragraph is likely the cause of your infraction.

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Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV

Can someone highlight the part that break forum rules?

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Just gonna ballpark it here but I'd say it was your last two paragraphs. Please also note the obscenity in the second to last paragraph.

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However, I do NOT want the western world to build up ghettos with immigrants behaving like orks from Tolkien.

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I don't see anything racist here.

EDIT: Now I see it.

You mispelled orcs.

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Originally Posted by Strike For The South

You mispelled orcs.

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We'ze 'er to make 'i orky. Ain't no nob worri'in 'bout spellin!

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Originally Posted by Monk

We'ze 'er to make 'i orky. Ain't no nob worri'in 'bout spellin!

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But he stated orcs from Tolkien, not orks from Warhammer. ~:)

the part about shitting in the bushes or what?

Well, they did shit in the bushes..

the community had to open an "apartment school" to explain how a modern apartment works, and how to live a life in the modern society.

Nothing racist about it, statement of facts.

And the part about them shitting in the bushes was a major issue as the people with kids wanted the kids to be able to play in the park without running into shit behind every other tree...

The word you are using for the expulsion of fecal matter from the human body is also considered a swear word in the English language. You keep using it here and in the aforementioned thread. I would advise you to replace it with a more suitable phrase to avoid future infractions. "Taking a dump" is a popular one that, I believe, would be acceptable to the mods. Normally, a : daisy : would work, but Tosa has not yet made smilies functional.

Are you really asking what is wrong with depicting all black immigrants as primitives who steal bikes?

And the s-word seems pretty obvious as well.

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Originally Posted by Andres

Are you really asking what is wrong with depicting all black immigrants as primitives who steal bikes?

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Are you really accusing him of saying something he did not?

Drone, my bad English I assume... I didn't know "shit" was a bad word... Taking a dump sounds more vulgar in my foreign ears.

I mean, I can understand that people frown of the word when used out of context, but in context?

Very well then, although I have a hard time seeing how the use of that specific word can be worth an infraction?



Andres, you need to work on your reading comprehension if that's the bottom-line you drew from my post.

"all black" ?

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Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV

Can someone highlight the part that break forum rules?

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Well (as mentioned before) - here you are:

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Originally Posted by Kadagar

The immigration was on reason why I left sweden... I have double nationality, and I just like it better in Austria. Where I live now there are no black people drinking from the toilet and shitting [comment Ser Clegane: rather colorful language]in the bushes (no joke, I had a former neighbour straight from the djungle) and I can park my unlocked bike outside my house for weeks without it getting stolen. [comment Ser Clegane: the whole part is pretty ugly racial stereotyping] Where i used to live I couldnt even park it outside with heavy chains.



I am all for supporting people who have to flee, however, set up refuge camps in neighbouring countries, where the cultures are more alike. I would happily support such refuge camps. However, I do NOT want the western world to build up ghettos with immigrants behaving like orks from Tolkien.[comment Ser Clegane: could be interpreted as stereotyping of immigrants]

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Summa summarum (and considering the forum rules as well as the rules that are explicitly stickied in the Backroom) the infraction you received seems to do your post justice.

Sir Clegane:

1.

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rather colorful language

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Agreed, a friendly warning would be more expected to correct subtle errors when it comes to bodily wastes in the context of bodily wastes, no, specialy on a international board where not everyones English is top notch?

2.

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comment Ser Clegane: the whole part is pretty ugly racial stereotyping

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It isn't stereotyping. It actually happened, I have sources later on in the thread:) Again, in NO WAY have I ever said "all immigrants"... My point is that if you take people straight from the djungle, they have never seen a modern apartment, then is it strange if they see the toilet as a water-well? Again, sources is included in the thread, and in no way is it racial stereotyping.

And about my bike being stolen... I hope you are kidding? Again, is it stereotyping when I say a bike is much more likely to be stolen in a immigrant-ghetto than in a smalltown with barely any immigrants?

Mate, criminal rates kind of back me up on that one. Common sence too.

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[comment Ser Clegane: could be interpreted as stereotyping of immigrants]

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Again, the quote is an attack against the states failure to assimilate immigrants. I have never said "all imigrants behaves like orcs".

However, soem groups to, in specific, large parts of the immigrants who are forced to live in ghettos without a proper procedure to accumulate them to their new surroundings.



*shrugs*

I know the topic is taboo, i didnt start it though. i just answered, and I backed my claims up with facts.

Mods sometimes seem to be a little trigger happy...

Read the thread, re-read the post too for that matter... And I'm sure you'll see it wasnt racistic.

Unless i am a racist when I say immigrants commit more crimes than native swedes, but since I have a load of documenst to back that up, that feels like a moot point.

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Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV

Unless i am a racist when I say immigrants commit more crimes than native swedes.

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You are to the Swedish left.

*Grabbing coat*



:smash:

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Originally Posted by KarlXII

You are to the Swedish left.

*Grabbing coat*



:smash:

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Well, so is Martin Luther King ;)

He did even use the N-word... Swedish left would have him imprisoned and Banquo's Ghost would give him an infraction *lol*

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Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV

Sir Clegane:

1.

Agreed, a friendly warning would be more expected to correct subtle errors when it comes to bodily wastes in the context of bodily wastes, no, specialy on a international board where not everyones English is top notch?

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For your consideration, the backroom rules regarding language:

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Originally Posted by Backroom Stickied rules

All forms of bad language and profanity are prohibited in the Backroom. This hard line is because even the gentlest of curses can tip a ferocious discussion over into bad feeling and anger - usually leading to warnings all round and a closed thread. There's no need for adults to swear. If you feel you must (usually for emphasis) then all letters of the word must be asterisked out. This does not mean a starting letter plus asterisks to indicate what you really meant. Nor does it mean the "innocent" half of the word left in with a few asterisks. It means all. A Backroom tradition has grown up to use the smiley instead of a prohibited word - this is fine, and everyone will understand.

The odd instance of mild swearing will usually be edited out. If you repeat the behaviour often, you will get a warning. Foul language will likely get you a warning point straight away.

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The other side of the issue has been explained. All i can say is I read your post fully, and until the second to last paragraph I didn't notice anything wrong. My thoughts are pretty much in line with Ser Clegane's. When i read it, it certainly read like a stereotype.

I am just surprised you only received an infraction to be honest...

I personally find the use of colourful language a minor problem

However, the amount of racial slur and stereotyping you used was rather shocking (the fact that you do not seem to get what you did wrong is even more shocking though).

Also, quoting figures and statistics out of nowhere, and using them to support action against foreigners, is inciting hatred in my book.

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Originally Posted by rasoforos

Also, quoting figures and statistics out of nowhere, and using them to support action against foreigners, is inciting hatred in my book.

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Yeah Kadagar, remember that time where you said all immigrants should burn in hell after disrupting the perfect Aryan balance? I don't either.

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Originally Posted by KarlXII

Yeah Kadagar, remember that time where you said all immigrants should burn in hell after disrupting the perfect Aryan balance? I don't either.

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What is your point? Is it that, If a wrongful statement is not taken to the extreme then it can be excused? I hardly think so...

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Originally Posted by rasoforos

What is your point? Is it that, If a wrongful statement is not taken to the extreme then it can be excused? I hardly think so...

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I agree that the use of a swear word and exaggeration of an immigrant is deserving of an infraction, but it's a far stretch to say Kadagar is inciting violence against foreigners. The fact you don't think so worries me.

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Originally Posted by Strike For The South

You mispelled orcs.

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I lol'ed.

But yeah that second-last paragraph strikes me as racist. If I saw it posted on any of the other fourms I moderate I would've warned you.

Musta been a slow day at the ski lodge....

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Originally Posted by KarlXII

but it's a far stretch to say Kadagar is inciting violence against foreigners.

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Just for the record - I agree with this point. I think there is still quite a difference between Kadagar's post and inciting violence - and at no point did the infraction imply that this is how the post was interpreted.

Were I the attending Moderator at the time, I'd have taken identical action as Banquo's Ghost, for the same reasons given.

Repeating the violation in subsequent posts (not here, where it's academic; rather in the backroom) would have gotten a 2-point Major infraction from me, and a 3-day time-out.

However, from his posts in this thread, it is clear that the OP is unclear on the nature of his violation, thus Banquo's Ghost's leniency in his second award - with which I agree.

NEW TOPIC but same topic: I would have prefered not to get a second infraction for calling bodily wastes a more common name for bodily wastes...

I mean, As soon as I got the first infraction I PMed the mod asking what the problem was. At the time I assumed he had gone on some anti-nazi spree...

When this thread clarified it was about the commonly used word for bodily wastes coming out of the wider body opening (not the mouth), I at once stopped using that word.

So, to get a second warning before I had the chance to edit seems a bit over-kill...

I mean, the mod in question could just have answered my first PM so I knew what the offense was...

Or, he could have PMed me and asked me to edit my posts afterwards...

However, to get 2 warnings before I knew what the fuss was about seems a bit like over kill.

just my two florins :)

It's usually an idea to respond to the moderator in question too. I remember once getting in some confusion with Lemur and when he saw my reply, he just politely pointed me in the right direction. I am meaning to say this as a compliment to Lemur, as he nicely explained to me without any harshness or trouble. So even though I made a boo-boo, he acted professional at all times.

So I will stereotype in the sense that this is most likely the same for all the moderators and they I would say they would be respectful at all times if you nicely ask them what the trouble is, if you don't fully understand.

As for your post though, it is very stereotyping. I go to University with what you might call "students of other colours" and they are all civilised people. As for pooping in the bushes though, that is probably the Rugby team, nothing to do with skin colour. It is the fact you made out all "black" people drink from the toilet and use bushes and all it takes is to find one "black" person who doesn't do that to disprove your claim (should be quite easy).

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Originally Posted by Beskar

So I will stereotype in the sense that this is most likely the same for all the moderators and they I would say they would be respectful at all times if you nicely ask them what the trouble is, if you don't fully understand.

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Nearly every staff member keeps an open door policy and is willing to provide further clarification or discuss the logic behind their actions. Most appreciate PMs as the way to have such conversations. Just remember that we mods/admins are human too, we like to be treated with common courtesy the same as any .orgah and we're just as happy to return that kindness.

Racism is a pain in the ass. This guy can keep on claiming how he's not racist, but he sounds exactly like the white Canadians who support international humanitarian aid, but scornfully look down on the poverty-stricken First Nations who had been living on this continent for millenia before those superior white settlers arrived here.

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Originally Posted by Megas Methuselah

Racism is a pain in the ass. This guy can keep on claiming how he's not racist, but he sounds exactly like the white Canadians who support international humanitarian aid, but scornfully look down on the poverty-stricken First Nations who had been living on this continent for millenia before those superior white settlers arrived here.

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You might want to save that view for the Backroom mate :wink:

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Originally Posted by Megas Methuselah

Racism is a pain in the ass. This guy can keep on claiming how he's not racist, but he sounds exactly like the white Canadians who support international humanitarian aid, but scornfully look down on the poverty-stricken First Nations who had been living on this continent for millenia before those superior white settlers arrived here.

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so was this post meant to be ironic?

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Originally Posted by rasoforos

I am just surprised you only received an infraction to be honest...

I personally find the use of colourful language a minor problem

However, the amount of racial slur and stereotyping you used was rather shocking (the fact that you do not seem to get what you did wrong is even more shocking though).

Also, quoting figures and statistics out of nowhere, and using them to support action against foreigners, is inciting hatred in my book.

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i personally had no problem with the content of his post, it was a statement of fact that some non-western immigrants have no idea what a toilet for, and that local residents find the result of this ignorance very distressing. as long as it is clear that he is not referring to entire groups.

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Originally Posted by Furunculus

i personally had no problem with the content of his post, it was a statement of fact that some non-western immigrants have no idea what a toilet for, and that local residents find the result of this ignorance very distressing. as long as it is clear that he is not referring to entire groups.

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No I was not talking about his description.

I was talking about supporting that a specific group is to blame for a crime rise, without actually providing any evidence that they are indeed the ones who should be blamed.

And while we all can (and will) support our opinions on limited or non-existent evidence, doing so to demonise immigrants of a certain religion is not something I would agree with.

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Originally Posted by Beskar

It's usually an idea to respond to the moderator in question too. I remember once getting in some confusion with Lemur and when he saw my reply, he just politely pointed me in the right direction. I am meaning to say this as a compliment to Lemur, as he nicely explained to me without any harshness or trouble. So even though I made a boo-boo, he acted professional at all times.

So I will stereotype in the sense that this is most likely the same for all the moderators and they I would say they would be respectful at all times if you nicely ask them what the trouble is, if you don't fully understand.

As for your post though, it is very stereotyping. I go to University with what you might call "students of other colours" and they are all civilised people. As for pooping in the bushes though, that is probably the Rugby team, nothing to do with skin colour. It is the fact you made out all "black" people drink from the toilet and use bushes and all it takes is to find one "black" person who doesn't do that to disprove your claim (should be quite easy).

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I really get worried about the averages orgahs reading skill at this point.


Monk, that's funny, I havent yet recieved an answer from the times mods have Pmed me infractions, and I wrote back. Or there would have been no reason for this thread, as an example.

Rasoforos, are you STILL claiming their is no evidence in that thread? :dizzy2:

Everything I've written is backed up by sources.

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Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV

I havent yet recieved an answer from the times mods have Pmed me infractions, and I wrote back.

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Sorry - I have to work for a living. Please excuse me for not immediately responding.

You have a PM.

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Originally Posted by Ser Clegane

Sorry - I have to work for a living. Please excuse me for not immediately responding.

You have a PM.

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I didn't mean you! I meant historicly, not today :)

I dont mind waiting 48h or so :)

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Originally Posted by rasoforos

No I was not talking about his description.

I was talking about supporting that a specific group is to blame for a crime rise, without actually providing any evidence that they are indeed the ones who should be blamed.

And while we all can (and will) support our opinions on limited or non-existent evidence, doing so to demonise immigrants of a certain religion is not something I would agree with.

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Was that before or after he started inciting hatred against brown people? :oops:

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Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV

I really get worried about the averages orgahs reading skill at this point.

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Not really, it is more your explanation -

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Where I live now there are no black people drinking from the toilet and "pooping" in the bushes

You implied that is what black people do. So it isn't my reading skill, it is your skill of explaining. Did you put any control or limits in your statement?

EDIT: Nvm, I don't need another infraction.

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Originally Posted by Beskar

Not really, it is more your explanation -

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Where I live now there are no black people drinking from the toilet and "pooping" in the bushes

You implied that is what black people do. So it isn't my reading skill, it is your skill of explaining. Did you put any control or limits in your statement?

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Uh, no. He didn't say that there were no black people where he lived, he just said that they weren't doing [what he described]. It isn't racist simply because he isn't implying that the entire group of people does it. I do agree that his wording was certainly off and could use some fixing, or the post itself could have contained clarification.

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Originally Posted by Evil_Maniac From Mars

I do agree that his wording was certainly off and could use some fixing, or the post itself could have contained clarification.

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Yeah, he sure had me fooled. Black people in Sweden come straight from "the djungle" and go around "pooping in the bushes." :inquisitive:

I find that in general, black people from Europe are the shiz.

Example: The Stranger.

:2thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by Megas Methuselah

Yeah, he sure had me fooled. Black people in Sweden come straight from "the djungle" and go around "pooping in the bushes." :inquisitive:

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He didn't say all black people did so though. If a white person did the same thing, he would be within his grammatical rights to say that it was a white person.

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Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV

Rasoforos, are you STILL claiming their is no evidence in that thread? :dizzy2:

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It took pages and pages of discussion to even get you people to look for any evidence...

...you were quoting link upon link of racist leaning bloggers and publications that were linking one another as 'evidence'...

...so I still stand by my opinion that the demonization of a group of people based on no evidence is incitement to hatred.

Whether the 'evidence' is valid or substantial we can talk about in the backroom. This is not the place my friends :no:

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Originally Posted by rasoforos

Whether the 'evidence' is valid or substantial we can talk about in the backroom. This is not the place my friends :no:

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So why don't you, it's all there to be teared apart. We delivered, you ignored.

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Originally Posted by Fragony

So why don't you, it's all there to be teared apart. We delivered, you ignored.

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Hey, this is unfair. I will comment in due time. As I said I keep an open mind. Glad that my humble opinion is so eagerly anticipated :laugh4:

I have no established opinion about the subject though (I mentioned that from the start).

P.S You could have PM'd that :yes:

Of course I value your opinion, nothing is true unless a Greek has said it first.

oh man, the internet can be one scary place when people start talking about stuff that doesn't involve computer games!

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Originally Posted by alh_p

oh man, the internet can be one scary place when people start talking about stuff that doesn't involve computer games!

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:hide:

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So why don't you, it's all there to be teared apart. We delivered, you ignored.

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Hey Frag the "evidence" and the blogger were thoroughly torn apart, you just didn't notice.

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Originally Posted by Tribesman

Hey Frag the "evidence" and the blogger were thoroughly torn apart, you just didn't notice.

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No it wasn't, you can't just decide that something was torn apart, this isn't like laying out the party line like a coldwar apparatski, for something to be torn apart it has to be teared apart first.

So focus on the positive solutions.

All those who have survived living and working in jungles & modern cities raise your hands. :thumbsup:

After walking a mile in another's shoes then make a pronouncement.