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Just wondering, for all you Brits.
Can you go through the responses to this article and find any that don't really say **** off?
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...rds-fraud-cost
Or could you think of any arguement that wouldn't get a response of **** off?
Here's one:
Quote:
Originally Posted by contractor000
I just wish that Mr. 0% rise would just **** *** and take his slimey peers with him.
In principle I think ID cards are a good idea: the potential to combine a passport, driving licence, proof of age, and basic medical history in one place is a good idea.
There are some massive issues that would have to be addressed such as security.
To prove that any idea can be screwed up by the government, they've manage to ensure the cost is vastly more than planned and the uses are almost nil - what are they for exactly?
Making them voluntary is the last farcical play of the idea: it'll catch terrorists, criminals and asylum seekers who decide to purchase a £30 card and carry it with them... Hmmmm. Unless these three groups are suddenly overly law abiding and brain dead this isn't going to happen.
~:smoking:
ID card is for domestic use, or you can use a biometric passport for foreign use.
The idea is, however Rory, it is the opposite of your statement, it catches people without the card, not the people with the card. Making it voluntary ruins that whole idea.
"If you've got nothing to hide, you've got nothing to fear". So goes the mantra from the government.
I really wouldn't know where to begin. :book:
Yes, I know the only use is if everyone has one. And the government has made it voluntary. Hence why I think they've made it into a farce.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beskar
~:smoking:
I feel sorry for Brown.
I have an ID card...and I'm a slave... :shrug:
Also I have to ask young people for ID cards when they want to buy alcohol, I will remember all the info and hack it into a secret government database each night because the government...already has it anyway. If you can find any holes in this argument you may keep them.
Also if you got nothing to hide, then you got nothing to fear.
The early bird catches the worm and as the martians say a pound weighs less than a kilogram.
What I don't like a lot is that your cards can be read out from a distance, a piece of paper with text on it or a magnetic chip that can only be read with contact or near-contact sounds like a much better idea to me.
If you have nothing to hide, it means you have no life. No enemies, no conflicts, no physical or psychological handicaps, no mistakes in your past, no neuroses, nothing out of the ordinary that might be misconstrued by anonymous officials and used against you one day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Husar
Congratulations, you are officially a nobody. :balloon:
nvm, I worked tonight, and my mind isn't operational until after I've slept today....
my only response to Alan is: "get $#c&%@!"
I think ID card issue was nicely summed up by Kilroy Silk.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzZ86GYoxE0
"They must decide whether to Share or to Shaft"
Do you make them sit down so you can store their smell too? :shame:Quote:
Originally Posted by Husar
Just don't have the heart at present to go in depth about how mindnumbingly stupid the whole ID scheme is.
But it is a wasteful nonsense. The last time the UK required id cards was world war 2, national peril is the only time when any free society should acquiesce to such drastic measures. The potential for abuse by government, & by extension law enforcement, is simply too great that it should ever be considered acceptable.
The statement "I have nothing to hide" doesn't count for sweet FA when the corrupt or foolish decide you have.
Government should serve the people not hound & bully them. Goverment does not spend their money on unpopular enterprises like this, they spend mine. The only law the present unelected prime minister of the uk should pass is to enforce voting in elections.
But, there is national peril. Brown won't get re-elected! :clown:Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodigal
Thing is, we have ID cards anyway, such as driving licence and passport. If it replaces all of those, there is nothing wrong with it.
You're missing the point. It sets a precedent for other hair-brained governmental schemes. Frog in hot-water and all that. Wot, wot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beskar
As odious as it is, it's not the ID card that's the only issue. It's the database.
Indeed, at the moment it is several different databases and even then, lots of problems arise from it. The biggest concern will be the Data Protection Act, the fact there are all these different databases they want to merge could cause chaos and mistakes which brought the act into force in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneApache
"One Database to rule them all, and in the darkness, bind them!"
I added that just for your entertainment, I was hoping the following statements would make that very clear but maybe you thought they were serious as well. :oops:Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrian II
The whole rage seems stupid to me anyway since an ID card hardly has any very classified info about you, at least here. If you hide all your info from everybody else anyway then you're a nobody as well and nobody knows you. Try getting a wife when you won't even tell you your name or where you live since she might misuse that info... :rolleyees:
I hardly need my ID card and hardly show it to anybody, yet I bet you a lot of the info on it is known to quite a few people anyway, you even have to tell the government when you move elsewhere, there are birth certificates with your name and place of birth on them in some government storage/databank, in Obama's case the public even wanted him to make this public, then those same people complain about cards with some personal info on them.
If a police officer wants to abuse you, he doesn't need you to have an ID card, we already had a few topics about US officers doing that and IIRC they don't have ID cards in the US.
Thos whole thing about me remembering peoples' info was rather sarcastic, some people just hide their info, PIN etc from me like I would.
That is because you don't know what these ID cards entail. Admittedly, this hasn't even been brought up in the thread yet, I know I made some jokey posts but it even gets far darker then that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Husar
Other than all your details which are present on separate identity cards combined onto one card, the new card would have your finger print details, your iris scan details, DNA details, you will have to fill out questionaires, in the style such as political compass so things like your views (political and social) are recorded, with all your bank accounts, your driving, birth, national insurance, criminal record, health record and various other things.
Long live Orwell.
I see, thanks for the info.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beskar
I really didn't know there was going to be that much info on them and I agree that is quite a lot, too much I would say. Finger prints are one thing, you leave them on every glass anyway in case someone wants them, but bank accounts etc. should have nothing to do on an ID card, that's complete rubbish, I see an ID card as a way to identify yourself, and that's what it is here(and that comment posted earlier made me think the UK ones would be similar), not as a pocket wikipedia entry detailing your whole life. :inquisitive:
That's indeed very excessive.
What's wrong with iris / retinal scans and fingerprints?
First off I'm sceptical they'll have the infrastructure to collate this vast amount of info, then digitise on the card.
Second: utility. Who can read these things? Precious few. Those that can (i.e. the police) can get them anyway. In London they don't even just cause to detain thanks to the ongoing terrorism alert.
So, an example.
I get stopped. The police for some reason need to thoroughly check who I am. So I get detained at a police station whilst they try to get the information. I carry almost no ID of any use and as I'm not a criminal I've got no details on any system. It could take hours. On a weekday that means I've not got to work in time for my patients who will be extremely pissed off.
Or they pull me over, cross reference the card with my finger prints and most likely that is the end of it.
A police state doesn't need ID cards, nor is a free society utterly destroyed by their existence.
~:smoking:
Man, I agree with you, but seeing as they store all movements on oysters cards for over a year already, please excuse my paranoia; why? well, damn, I don't think the government needs to know where I am at all times. Course we're almost always on cctv, & they can triangulate your position if you're carrying a mobile phone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beskar
Personally I think thats enough of an invasion of my privacy.
They would have liked to have kept DNA records indefinitley, of anyone they arrest even if their innocent.
Now they want people to pay 5 million base + the cost of the card, so they can have more ways of tracking your movements via your ID card, which by the bloody way, if you're not carrying you can be arrested for, at which time thay can take your DNA!!!...Please...Enjoy your stay in Camp UK, Be Pure, Be Vigilant, Behave.
Now that's all really screaming heeby jeeby "they're all out to get me" stuff, and maybe I wouldn't think it was important, but I don't like hearing that people are still being found inocent of crimes they have not committed but have had to serve years in prison for!
Show me a perfect legal system, & they can police me anyway they like. But I for one think the police are very far for perfect, as are our laws & system of government, and as such they should be bloody well muzzled. And don't get me started on crime prevention, because that's where this is leading :yes:
I find it rather strange that people are willing to accept a biometric passport with no much fuss...
...but they are unwilling to accept an ID card.
My oppinion? Non biometric ID cards. Plain plastic ones, no chips inside. So you can prove you are above tobacco-alcohol age and you can take money off your bank account without having to carry a 60-page booklet WITH biometrics (passport). That would be a nice compromise.
Or you can give money to a guy in a trenchcoat in a back alley to supply you with fingers, irises, names, bank account numbers or any other info you like to put on any of your IDs he can also, helpfully, get for ya.
I can picture the conversation in the depths of Scotland Yard: "What do you mean criminals have FAKE IDs?!"
I'm curious: Will tobacconists and off licenses have iris scanning equipment? That's be cool. Maybe they can have a T-800 model for a bouncer too!
Does anyone else think that the british government didn't quite understand the plot of V for Vendetta? They thought it was quite a good idea! Probably have blocked off the tube line under Westminster. Someone should check...
Not V but they seem to think that 1984 and Animal Farm are a guide, not a warning, to governance.
That's what we have here I think.Quote:
Originally Posted by rasoforos
My travel passport seems to have my fingerprints in electronic form because it's required to enter the USA for example. If they're on a chip it's invisible though, meaning I can't make out any chip inside the passport, the normal ID card doesn't have a chip AFAIK(well, could be an invisible one that the secret freemason world government uses for thought control or something along those lines but I'm not aware that there is one) and is mostly used for exactly what you describe.
Yeah, but you guys have strange symbols on those "harmless" cards, according to this report.Quote:
Originally Posted by Husar
How much does it cost? The more technology in it, the more they'll charge you for having to have it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Husar
PS - The word million in my previous post should have started with a B, not an M
the register always writes pretty good articles on uk ID card plans:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07...ory_lib_plans/
Sorry. All the pictures look like a penis to me. :shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by KukriKhan
The travel passport 50EUR, the normal ID card I don't remember but it was cheaper.Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodigal
I told you I have a really nice boss... :devil:Quote:
Originally Posted by KukriKhan
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
That is the Feminist version of the Illumanti world government. Penis Dominance (aka, men)Quote:
Originally Posted by Vladimir
Gotta agree. When they asked what the picture reminded us of, Baphomet was second on my list.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vladimir
And there I am, mocking England, while as it turns out in the meantime the church-party is working on a system that would make the beards in Teheran blush with shame. Bloody christians, perhaps even worse than the socialists when it comes to ABSOLUTE CONTROL of each and every aspect of your life.