Sony gave me Crohn's disease

http://videogames.yahoo.com/events/p...speech/1336479

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July 21 1:53 P.M.

A California man who was banned from Sony's Playstation Network isn't going away quietly, reports Gamepolitics.
Resistance Censorship

Erik Estavillo has filed a lawsuit against the Playstation 3 maker, alleging that the company violated his right to free speech and caused undue pain and suffering.

According to the suit, the San Jose resident's problems began when he was banned from the Network due to his behavior in the online first-person shooter, Resistance: Fall of Man. Estavillo claims he was unfairly targeted by the game's moderators and believes his First Amendment rights have been ignored. From the suit:

"...the plaintiff was exercising his First Amendment Rights to Freedom of Speech in the game's public forum when he was banned from, not only the Resistance video game, but also banned from playing all other games online via the PlayStation Network."

He further asserts that by denying him access to pre-paid points stored in his Playstation Network Wallet Fund, Sony is also guilty of theft.

In addition to requesting that Sony end the practice of banning entirely, Estavillo is seeking $55,000 in punitive damages connected to his suffering from a variety of ailments exacerbated by the ban, including Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder, Panic Disorder, Major Depression, Crohn's Disease and Agoraphobia.

Sony hasn't commented on the matter.

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I was almost ready to accept the idea of a first amendment rights violation, but the excessive punitive damages and the link between Sony's ban and freaking Agoraphobia is where he lost me. I like video games but seriously, this person needs to get a little bit more fresh air. Being banned might be a good thing for this guy. Can I sue the United States government for polices which have exacerbated my unemployment?

Also, bit of advice:
Never exacerbate in the morning, it makes you drowsy.

So, being unable to obsessively play video games all day worsened his obsessive-compulsive disorder and agoraphobia? How would that work? Guy just saw an opportunity for a big payday here.

By the way, don't forums have the right to censor certain content? Freedom of speech only applies when you're not a guest on someone else's website. IMHO, the brutal and tyrannical rule of forum moderators and administrators is what makes our community a pleasant place to live, because the trolls and bots get turned into giblets.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

LONG LIVE THE MODERATORS!
LONG LIVE THE MODERATORS!
LONG LIVE THE MODERATORS!

By the way, can I get some of my warning points removed? Seriously, I don't think I deserve them and it's uber lame. I demand the right to appeal!

Well, one matter will be whether Sony can deny a person access to the network they've paid to access for - what? - vulgarity?

The listing of diseases just seems stupid, though.

CR

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Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit

Well, one matter will be whether Sony can deny a person access to the network they've paid to access for - what? - vulgarity?

The listing of diseases just seems stupid, though.

CR

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You don't pay to access PSN. Also, the Terms of Service states that certain standards of behavior are expected and they have full discretion on dealing with problems. This lawsuit is stupid and frivolous.

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Originally Posted by Xiahou

You don't pay to access PSN. Also, the Terms of Service states that certain standards of behavior are expected and they have full discretion on dealing with problems. This lawsuit is stupid and frivolous.

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Well in that case it ought to be thrown out with prejudice.

CR

I really hope this gets thrown out quickly. :inquisitive:

Somebody seriously needs to understand what "free speech" actually means.

Lesson #1: My house, my rules. No free speech here. Don't like it? Go away. Now.

It's quite telling when people of all political perspectives still think this lawsuit is junk and nonsense. That means you failed.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i205.photobucket.com/albums/...onroe-fail.jpg

Is that Rene Zellweger on the right?

No, she's on the left.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

No, she's on the left.

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ZING!

Someone didn't read the terms of service before accepting them I guess. :juggle2:

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Originally Posted by paragraph 5

Permanent bans can lead to several side effects, including but not limited to morbus crohn, kidney failure, AIDS and liver sausage.

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And this maybe should be in the backroom.

I might make a backroomish comment like "its my country, you don't have free speech here" associated with ATPG's house analogy. :grin:

In any case, people ought to read the TOS rather than click through it and then sue them frivolously.
He would also be hard pressed to prove that his medical conditions were a direct result of the banning rather than pre-existing.

While of course it is possible that TOS are sometimes invalid (as many EULAs are) even if you agree to them, I do not think that this is the case here.

Oh, and I imagine he's claiming 55,000 rather than the usual millions the average American claims to nudge Sony into paying him because their lawyers and associated loss of image may just cost more than 55,000.

In fairness to the guy, he did pay for the online service and there's nothing wrong with him appealing on those grounds. The freedom of speech thing is ridiculous though, it's a private business, you play by their rules.

As for the illnesses, he may not be making it up (apart from Crohn's disease, no idea what that is).I get the feeling his Playstation may be a big part of his life, and losing that can really upset things when you have OCD and such ailments.

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Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr

In fairness to the guy, he did pay for the online service and there's nothing wrong with him appealing on those grounds. The freedom of speech thing is ridiculous though, it's a private business, you play by their rules.

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Once again...he did not pay for the online service.
With PS3 you pay for the console and for the games....the online service is given free of charge by sony.

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Originally Posted by Ronin

Once again...he did not pay for the online service.
With PS3 you pay for the console and for the games....the online service is given free of charge by sony.

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Hmm sorry, well he had the pre-paid points anyway...

Another fine example of the need for tort reform. This is a frivolous lawsuit that not only jams the docket and delays the hearing of legitimate cases, but also wastes the taxpayer's & business's money thereby driving up costs for everyone. Judge Hosa's verdict: a fine for the accuser in this frivolous lawsuit to recover the court costs for the taxpayer and a disbarment hearing for the ambulance chasing lawyer. Bailiff, whack his pee pee! :smash:

He should have read the User Agreement.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

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Originally Posted by Playstation Network

COMMUNITY CODE OF CONDUCT

You must adhere to the following rules of conduct, and also follow a reasonable, common-sense code of conduct. Users are required to take into consideration community standards and refrain from abusive or deceptive conduct, cheating, hacking, or other misuse of PSN. Rights of other players should be respected.

The violations that are prohibited include but are not limited to the following:

* You may not engage in deceptive or misleading practices.
* You may not abuse or harass others, including but not limited to stalking behavior.
* You may not take any action, or upload, post, stream, or otherwise transmit any content, language, images or sounds in any forum, communication, public profile, or other publicly viewable areas or in the creation of any Online ID that SCEA, in its sole discretion, finds offensive, hateful, or vulgar. This includes but is not limited to, any content or communication that SCEA in its sole discretion deems racially, ethnically, religiously, or sexually offensive, libelous, defaming, threatening, bullying or stalking.
* You may not organize hate groups.
* You may not upload, post, stream, or otherwise transmit any content that contains any viruses, worms, spyware, time bombs, or other computer programs that may damage, interfere with, or disrupt PSN.
* You may not use, make, or distribute unauthorized software or hardware in conjunction with PSN, or take or use any data from PSN to design, develop or update unauthorized software or hardware, including but not limited to cheat code software or devices that circumvent any security features or limitations included on any software or devices.
* You may not modify or attempt to modify the online client, disc, save file, server, client-server communication, or other parts of any game title, or content.
* You may not cause disruption to any account, system, hardware, software, or network connected to PSN for any reason, including to gain an unfair advantage in a game.
* You may not attempt to hack or reverse engineer any code or equipment in connection with PSN.
* You may not provide anyone with your name or any other personally identifying information other than your own Online ID, or the name, password or personally identifying information of any other person or business through any means, including messaging, chat or any other form of PSN communication.
* You may not take any action that SCEA considers to be disruptive to the normal flow of chat or gameplay, including without limitation, uploading, posting, streaming, or otherwise transmitting any unsolicited or unauthorized material, including junk mails, spams, excessive mails, or chain letters.
* You may not introduce content that is commercial in nature such as advertisements, solicitations, promotions and links to web sites.
* You may not introduce content that could be harmful to SCEA, its licensors, or players, such as any code or virus that may damage any property or interfere with the use of the property or PSN.
* You may not upload, post, stream, access, or otherwise transmit any content that you know or should have known to be infringing, or that violates, any third party rights, any law or regulation, or contractual or fiduciary obligations.
* You may not impersonate any person, including an SCEA or third party employee.
* You may not provide SCEA or any third party company with false or inaccurate information, including reporting false complaints to SCEA Consumer Services or providing false or inaccurate information during account registration.
* You may not sell, buy, trade, or otherwise transfer your Online ID or any personal access to PSN through any means or method, including by use of web auction sites.
* You may not conduct any activities that violate any local, state or federal laws, including but not limited to, copyright or trademark infringement, defamation, invasion of privacy, identity theft, hacking, stalking, fraud, and the distribution of counterfeit software.

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Originally Posted by Playstation Network user Agreement

13. TERMINATION/ CANCELLATION

If SCEA determines in its sole discretion that you have violated any term of this Agreement, the Usage Terms, or any other terms and conditions connected with PSN or have otherwise injured or damaged the PSN community, SCEA may take all actions to protect its interests, including termination or suspension of your PSN account (both the Master Account and any associated Sub Accounts), automatic removal or blockage of the content, implementation of upgrades or devices intended to discontinue unauthorized use, or reliance on any other remedial efforts as necessary to remedy the violation. If your breach is in connection with content that you have downloaded, you must immediately cease use of such content and delete all copies from all of your devices. Upon termination for any reason, you will not receive a refund for items, value accumulated on in-game items or any unused balance in your wallet except as expressly provided in this Agreement and to the extent permitted by applicable law. Any game ranking or scores, or information in connection with PSN will not be retained or accessible by you or your associated Sub Accounts. SCEA reserves the right to bring legal action and to participate in any government or private legal action or investigation relating to your conduct, which may require the disclosure of your information. Unless as otherwise stated in this Agreement, SCEA, at its sole discretion, may indefinitely suspend, or discontinue any and all online access to content at any time, including for maintenance service or upgrades, without prior notice or liability.

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In online services there's no such thing as Free speech. You obey the code of conduct or you get banned, it's that simple.

This is yet another reason why xbox 360 and xbox live is the greatest. xbox live has had since its beginning millions of 8-12 year olds playing Mature (17+) rated games screaming profanities and racial slurs and Microsoft like the awesome company they are has taken the right route by letting these paying customers say whatever is ever on their mind as long as they don't admit they are a lesbian (http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2...-live-user.ars). I am disappointed in Sony for trampling all over this kids self proclaimed right to free speech on their personal servers and I hope he will join the xbox flock and be accepted into our large community of little kids calling everyone else *** and then crying and screaming when getting owned by a player with actual skills.

I can only hope that Sony gets it's head out of the clouds and stops enforcing these "laws" that makes their actions "legally sound" and realize that if they are going to compete with Microsoft and the cash cow that is xbox live, they are going to have to accept the valuable demographic of 10 year olds that call into question the size of the opposing player's genitals when getting owned.

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Originally Posted by a completely inoffensive name

This is yet another reason why xbox 360 and xbox live is the greatest. xbox live has had since its beginning millions of 8-12 year olds playing Mature (17+) rated games screaming profanities and racial slurs and Microsoft like the awesome company they are has taken the right route by letting these paying customers say whatever is ever on their mind as long as they don't admit they are a lesbian (http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2...-live-user.ars). I am disappointed in Sony for trampling all over this kids self proclaimed right to free speech on their personal servers and I hope he will join the xbox flock and be accepted into our large community of little kids calling everyone else *** and then crying and screaming when getting owned by a player with actual skills.

I can only hope that Sony gets it's head out of the clouds and stops enforcing these "laws" that makes their actions "legally sound" and realize that if they are going to compete with Microsoft and the cash cow that is xbox live, they are going to have to accept the valuable demographic of 10 year olds that call into question the size of the opposing player's genitals when getting owned.

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Somebody didn't read Wednesday's Penny Arcade... :clown:

if sony DID in fact give him crohns then he needs to smoke a joint and shut the hell up.

If this guy lives in California and he's whinging about crohns disease then i am REALLY mad.

you signed up for their service, you follow their rules.

Your 1st amendment right doesnt apply in something like this, YOU SIGNED A CONTRACT.

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Originally Posted by AlexanderSextus

Your 1st amendment right doesnt apply in something like this, YOU SIGNED A CONTRACT.

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Now that's just not true, a contract isn't valid if it violates the law.

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Originally Posted by HoreTore

Now that's just not true, a contract isn't valid if it violates the law.

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How did it violate the law?

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Originally Posted by a completely inoffensive name

How did it violate the law?

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In this case, not at all, I was talking generally ~;)

His first amendment rights would apply even if the contract said they didn't. But it doesn't apply here, simply because this case has nothing at all to do with the first amendment...

It would be funny if then, all American citizens under some kind of NDA, immediatly filed suits against their companies for infringing on their first amendment. >_>

Always good to start the day with reading a stupid story.
As others have stated, he signed a agreement that he would behave, he didn't so he violated his end of the deal.
Tough luck.

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Originally Posted by AlexanderSextus

if sony DID in fact give him crohns then he needs to smoke a joint and shut the hell up.

If this guy lives in California and he's whinging about crohns disease then i am REALLY mad.

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You obviously don't know much about Crohn's. It's an extraordinarily painful and humiliating disease that has no cure and for which medication is only marginally effective. The ability to get a prescription for medical marijuana for it in California doesn't even come remotely close to compensating for just how bad it is.

EULA. No free speech issue

Drinking gives you Crohn's disease...

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Originally Posted by TinCow

You obviously don't know much about Crohn's. It's an extraordinarily painful and humiliating disease that has no cure and for which medication is only marginally effective. The ability to get a prescription for medical marijuana for it in California doesn't even come remotely close to compensating for just how bad it is.

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Point Taken, however there is ample evidence that medical marijuana does alleviate the suffering significantly.

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Originally Posted by HoreTore

Now that's just not true, a contract isn't valid if it violates the law.

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It is entirely legal for a citizen of the US to waive their free speech right by signing a contract. Now this does not necessarily mean they are waiving it across the board, but if you, say, join the US army, that is one way to waive your freedom of speech, pretty much any contract that stipulates regulation of content waives your free speech right.

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Originally Posted by AlexanderSextus

Point Taken, however there is ample evidence that medical marijuana does alleviate the suffering significantly.

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Doesn't mean jack, son, so have a seat. I probably have Crohn's, it's in my family history and my aunt died from complications from it (and diabetes) a few years ago. Getting stoned does not alleviate pain much at all, no more so than getting drunk or hopped up on something else. This is experience talking here btw.

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Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr

Drinking Mexican Water gives you Crohn's disease...

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violently

What they should do, is have servers for 18+, where people can say what ever they like with a disclaimer stating that they do not take responsibility.

Then Microsoft can wash their hands of the matter and simply say "if you got a problem, go on our kiddy servers" and these kiddy servers are extremely moderated (mainly through automatic scripts). While this makes a two-tier system, it seperates the kids from the adults, so any objections won't be there unless you go into the objectionable area.

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Originally Posted by Beskar

What they should do, is have servers for 18+, where people can say what ever they like with a disclaimer stating that they do not take responsibility.

Then Microsoft can wash their hands of the matter and simply say "if you got a problem, go on our kiddy servers" and these kiddy servers are extremely moderated (mainly through automatic scripts). While this makes a two-tier system, it seperates the kids from the adults, so any objections won't be there unless you go into the objectionable area.

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Not really practical. Most jurisdictions have laws that prevent certain things being said/posted (ie child pornography or grooming, exhortations to violence, arranging of terrorist away-days etc) and hold the forum owners/ISPs jointly responsible - unless it can be shown they took steps to moderate the illegality.

A company cannot simply disclaim its legal duties.

Stupid claims... lol

I suggest this guy to start playing another games in free online network.... because playing paid networks is rather trash....

Well, his disease seems original, as he only sue the medicine bill ... :laugh4:

It is like Mc Donalds getting sued because some suicide bombers got a burger there before they did their activity. In the 18+ area, there is no children, thus no grooming, they can't exchange child porn, because it is voice/text communication. "Terrorist Away days" is completely uninforceable, so do you know that "let's go down to the pub" is a code-word to "Meet me under 5th Street Bridge"

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Originally Posted by Beskar

It is like Mc Donalds getting sued because some suicide bombers got a burger there before they did their activity. In the 18+ area, there is no children, thus no grooming, they can't exchange child porn, because it is voice/text communication. "Terrorist Away days" is completely uninforceable, so do you know that "let's go down to the pub" is a code-word to "Meet me under 5th Street Bridge"

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Perhaps. I didn't write the laws, but they exist and businesses have to abide by them.

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Originally Posted by Whacker

Doesn't mean jack, son, so have a seat. I probably have Crohn's, it's in my family history and my aunt died from complications from it (and diabetes) a few years ago. Getting stoned does not alleviate pain much at all, no more so than getting drunk or hopped up on something else. This is experience talking here btw.

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http://www.cannabismd.net/crohns-disease/


See, it aint about getting stoned. With Med. Marijuana it usually never is. It's about the beta-caryophyllene in cannabis that reduces inflammation by turning on your brain's CB2 receptors which reduces inflammation.

I know my stuff man.

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Originally Posted by AlexanderSextus

http://www.cannabismd.net/crohns-disease/


See, it aint about getting stoned. With Med. Marijuana it usually never is. It's about the beta-caryophyllene in cannabis that reduces inflammation by turning on your brain's CB2 receptors which reduces inflammation.

I know my stuff man.

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Inflammation is only one aspect of Crohn's. It's an immune disease where the body attacks itself. Reduction of inflammation is certainly nice, but it's not going to reassure anyone with a moderate to severe case. Once it gets beyond the mild phase, Crohn's results in numerous uncontrollable bouts of diarrhea per day. It is not uncommon for people to experience this 10 or more times per day, which makes leaving the house or going anywhere without easy access to a toilet very, very difficult. A reduction in pain and swelling doesn't do squat to make that any easier to live with. Nor does it help when the disease eventually forces you to get a colostomy bag because you've had a fistula that resulted in the removal of a large portion of your colon or lower intestine. Simply put, Crohn's causes symptoms which have a huge psychological impact on people that is often more devastating that the disease itself. Saying that someone with Crohn's is "whinging" about it is frankly insulting.

And I know my stuff too. I've probably smoked more weed in a single day than most people have in their entire lives. I've also sat and listened to a doctor tell someone I love that they have Crohn's disease.

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Saying that someone with Crohn's is "whinging" about it is frankly insulting.

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Ok, look i'll admit that i shouldn't have said that like that, in all reality i was mad that the person was blaming sony.

I didn't mean to offend you, basically i thought that Med. MJ alleviated more suffering than it actually does. Why didn't you just SAY that you had used it before?

In any event, look, i'm sorry.:oops: :sweatdrop: :shame:

My little cousin Jay has Crohn's. He never seemed to be as bad as what you're describing so i admit i do have limited exposure to it.

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Originally Posted by AlexanderSextus

Ok, look i'll admit that i shouldn't have said that like that, in all reality i was mad that the person was blaming sony.

I didn't mean to offend you, basically i thought that Med. MJ alleviated more suffering than it actually does. Why didn't you just SAY that you had used it before?

In any event, look, i'm sorry.:oops: :sweatdrop: :shame:

My little cousin Jay has Crohn's. He never seemed to be as bad as what you're describing so i admit i do have limited exposure to it.

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If it were nearly as effective as you're making it out to be, then doctors would be prescribing it instead of corticosteroids and other real anti-inflammatory meds and real peer-reviewed medical studies would support this. Neither is the case. The medical weed schtick is as old and tired and overused as the hippies that try to push it based on half-truths and half-assed 'studies'. I saw some of the links that were mentioned, and I could not find the actual study to read, but it seems to be yet another one of these "half-truths" where there may be some marginal effect, but the wording used to describe the study did not indicate to me that it was very scientific at all.

Don't get me wrong, I don't really care if people want to smoke up, hell I actually tend to think that legalization and taxation of it could have some real benefits. I'm in the same boat as Tincow, I did enough in high school and college to kill a herd of goats. It's just really damn annoying when people try to pitch the BS as some kind of miracle drug or as effective or a real alternative to modern medicine, when it's not.

Have you never gone to a witch-doctor? :inquisitive:

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Originally Posted by Whacker

It's just really damn annoying when people try to pitch the BS as some kind of miracle drug or as effective or a real alternative to modern medicine, when it's not.

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From my own personal experiences, conversations with some of my friends who are doctors, and conversations with my family's doctors, I do very much believe that marijuana is a very effective painkiller that avoids a lot of side effects of other medications. It also works effectively as a muscle relaxant. I agree it's not a miracle drug, but there's a lot of merit in using it for people with chronic pain problems.

It is true though that the medical marijuana argument is mainly used to boot strap to total legalization. Most people who argue for it don't really care about its medicinal properties.

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Originally Posted by TinCow

From my own personal experiences, conversations with some of my friends who are doctors, and conversations with my family's doctors, I do very much believe that marijuana is a very effective painkiller that avoids a lot of side effects of other medications. It also works effectively as a muscle relaxant. I agree it's not a miracle drug, but there's a lot of merit in using it for people with chronic pain problems.

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To an extent I'd agree, but there's also a big strawman in there begging to be set alight.

I have also spoken to friends and relatives in the medical profession about this, and yes I believe it does have some benefits, but they are not nearly as effective as their real medical brethren. The benefit one gains from what's inhaled burning into their lungs is not nearly as great as one would get from medically synthesized and modified opiates.

The pain relief part is the strawman, which to me is a total joke. One can get pain relief from a wide range of other means, from simple ibuprofin all the way up to other illegal crap like heroin. The key point is that there are much safer ways of getting pain relief without the harmful side effects. In the case of weed, the secondhand smoke could be harmful to others, when it's going to be harmful to the user.

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It is true though that the medical marijuana argument is mainly used to boot strap to total legalization. Most people who argue for it don't really care about its medicinal properties.

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Such is the same conclusion I've drawn over the years. I've never heard anyone argue for it that isn't a regular or semi-regular recreational user, and the majority have been varying degrees of ignorant. Such is my personal, anecdotal experience though, which could eventually change and should be taken for what it's worth and at face value.

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Originally Posted by Whacker

The pain relief part is the strawman, which to me is a total joke. One can get pain relief from a wide range of other means, from simple ibuprofin all the way up to other illegal crap like heroin. The key point is that there are much safer ways of getting pain relief without the harmful side effects. In the case of weed, the secondhand smoke could be harmful to others, when it's going to be harmful to the user.

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Marijuana is definitely not the best pain killer out there, but it does provide a much faster relief time than most other prescriptions simply due to delivery method. Pills take a while to digest and move through the system, while inhalation results in relief within a few seconds. The only thing I've ever seen that's faster is IV pain killers, but those don't tend to be prescribed outside of hospital or hospice. I've always wondered why drug companies haven't pushed inhalation delivery systems for pain killers for this reason. Surely they could just make a liquid version and stick it in something like an asthma inhaler?

:shrug:

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Originally Posted by TinCow

Marijuana is definitely not the best pain killer out there, but it does provide a much faster relief time than most other prescriptions simply due to delivery method. Pills take a while to digest and move through the system, while inhalation results in relief within a few seconds. The only thing I've ever seen that's faster is IV pain killers, but those don't tend to be prescribed outside of hospital or hospice. I've always wondered why drug companies haven't pushed inhalation delivery systems for pain killers for this reason. Surely they could just make a liquid version and stick it in something like an asthma inhaler?

:shrug:

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That's a very good question. My best guess is that it'd have to do with ease of access coupled with probability of dependency, i.e. abuse. There are psychological associations involved in swallowing a crap-ton of pills. Another possible explanation is that it's really hard to get certain opiates or solutions to work well in an aerosol type delivery mechanism.

:shrug: x 2.