HRTW Map

Here we will discuss our map. Deciding on the exe and the map are the two most important factors in where our mod will go.

We have plenty of maps to choose from I suggest this. By the way, everyone hope and pray that Ozman comes back! We need him for this!

Here is my map proposal:
Map: Mundus Magnus 4.0
Modifications: Cut it off right before India going east and right before Arabia going south, frees up at least 15-20 city slots, plus Saba and Mauryan Empire are really not needed. We also include special geographic features from Rome Total History, where you can navigate ships inside rivers etc.

Also we will be posting all city information here. In the OP we will have a list of each city and who it was historically owned by in 280 BC

Asgaroth and I are in charge of doing cities but if you have knowledge on any cities, or cities in general please let us know. Thanks and when I can I will start posting the cities

Key:
City (Region) - Faction Owner


ITALY

Rome (Latium)
Arretium (Etruria)
Ariminum (Umbria)
Genua (Liguria)
Mediolanium (Cisalpine Gaul)
Patavium (Venetia)
Capua (Campania)
Tarentum (Apulia)
Croton (Calabria)
Rhegium (Bruttium)
Ancona (Picenum)
Bononia (Aemilia)
Acerrae (Tribus Insubres)

SARDINIA, CORSICA AND MALTA

Caralis (Sardinia)
Aleria (Corsica)
Melite (Malta)

SICILY

Messana (Sicilia Romanus)
Syracuse (Sicilia Graecus)
Lilybaeum (Sicilia Poeni)
Agrigentum (Cameratum)

NORTH AFRICA

Carthage (Africa)
Thapsus (Byzacium)
Leptis (Tripolitania)
Cirta (Numidia)
Dimmidi (Gaetulia)
Nepte (Sahara)
Tingi (Mauretania)
Capsa (Capsa)
Hadrumentum (Zeugitana)
Utica (Utica)
Hippo Rhegius (Massylia)
Volubilis (Mauretania Tingitana)
Jol (Mauretania Oriens)

IBERIA

Bolskan (Taraconenis)
Mastia (Deitania)
Numantia (Celtiberia)
Asturica (Gallaecia)
Olisipo (Lusitania)
Corduba (Baetica)
Saguntum (Edetanus)
Emporion (Illergetium)
Malaca (Axarquia)
Ebusos (Baliares)
Gadir (Andalusia)

GREECE
Sparta (Laconia)
Corinth (Peloponnesus)
Athens (Attica)
Thermon (Aetolia Meridianus)
Apollonia (Epirus)
Larissa (Thessalia)
Thessalonica (Chalcidice)
Bylazora (Paionia)
Byzantium (Propontis)
Kydonia (Crete)
Rhodes (Rhodos)
Chalcis (Euboea)
Argos (Argos)
Elis (Pisatis)
Ambracia (Epirus Meridianus)
Corcyra (Aetolia)
Pella (Macedonia)
Amphipolis (Edonia)
Dyrrhachium (Illyricum)
Naxos (Naxos)
Samos (Samos)

ASIA MINOR

Nicomedia (Bythinia)
Pergamum (Phrygia)
Sardis (Lydia)
Halicarnassus (Lycia)
Ancyra (Galatia)
Sinope (Pontus)
Mazaka (Cappadocia)
Tarsus (Cilicia)
Amasia (Pontica)
Amisus (Pontica Oriens)
Nicaea (Pergement)
Gordium (Halys)
Smyrna (Ionia)
Heraclea (Cierus)
Mytilene (Lesbos)
Side (Pamphylia)

Navigable rivers? They are kind of buggy, specially in Mundus Magnus scale.

You mean actually cutting the map? Why don't we just erase the regions? Cutting india is no problem at all, but cutting the bottom will mess up with coordinate badly. We could use "natural barriers" a.k.a ground_types as barriers

Good point, maybe use Arabia as terra incognita?

Yeah we can use that, and to make most of the northeaster most regions a terra incognita too (unless we add a Yuezhi or chinese faction, wich i don't think so :P ) we can even use the terra incognita for all lands beyond the Indus, thus making unnecesary to actually cut the map.

True. Very True. Well then it is settled for now. We use Mundus Magnus 4.0 and have a large Terra Incognita

Ok. BTW i saw your progress report, there's also a neutralized senate for MM map, in case you want to check it out (don't have the link at the moment but i remember i found it a while ago).

Please tell me where it is man, Ive been battling CTD's for the past half hour trying to set it up!

The mod is not going vanilla.You have changed the map.We have discussed that the map would be vanilla extended-Ahowl,Ozman and me....Hey but do what you want.

Cut it off right before India going east and right before Arabia going south, frees up at least 15-20 city slots, plus Saba and Mauryan Empire are really not needed. We also include special geographic features from Rome.

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Originally Posted by Asgaroth

The mod is not going vanilla.You have changed the map.We have discussed that the map would be vanilla extended-Ahowl,Ozman and me....Hey but do what you want.

Cut it off right before India going east and right before Arabia going south, frees up at least 15-20 city slots, plus Saba and Mauryan Empire are really not needed. We also include special geographic features from Rome.

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This. I thought we already discussed it in the mod group over at TWC?
I thought the consensus was that you were going to keep the map for versions 1.0, 2.0 and change it for later versions?

How is cutting off India and Arabia not keeping it vanilla? It frees up more cities for us to use in Greece and Asia Minor.
And there is only one version. Nobody seemed to like the multiple versions and it was frustrating trying to explain to everyone. One solid version is all we need. If we have other versions they will simply be for bug fixes and corrections. The mod is going to have more structure everyone. No more disorganization. We must get the map set up and get everything to work on the right exe. Also we must come to a conclusion on the faction list.
@Asgaroth, remember my PM, I'm not changing my mind anymore, what I decide to do from now on I'm sticking with it. Getting rid of India and Arabia to me makes it more vanilla than having what we did.

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Originally Posted by ahowl11

How is cutting off India and Arabia not keeping it vanilla?

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So comparatively, will the map be closer in size to the vanilla map, or will it be an EB style map?

Ill also give my thoughts on the other areas

Neither, it will be in between those. If we had India from Mundus Magnus, that triggers my mind to say we need to include The Mauryan Empire. Do we need them? NO. Yeah they would be cool and fun, but that means we would need to include the whole Indian sub continent as that's what the empire extended to at it's height. I am not doing that, and adding an Indian faction is way too much work for nothing. Same for Arabia. Saba did nothing when it came to the Greeks and Romans.. so why even have Arabia on the map? If we compared our map to anyone's it would be like Roma Surrectum's.

Problem with Roma Surrectum's is that it still takes away easter regions were Parthians and Greeks (Seleucids and Bactians) went.

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Originally Posted by ahowl11

How is cutting off India and Arabia not keeping it vanilla? It frees up more cities for us to use in Greece and Asia Minor.
And there is only one version. Nobody seemed to like the multiple versions and it was frustrating trying to explain to everyone. One solid version is all we need. If we have other versions they will simply be for bug fixes and corrections. The mod is going to have more structure everyone. No more disorganization. We must get the map set up and get everything to work on the right exe. Also we must come to a conclusion on the faction list.
@Asgaroth, remember my PM, I'm not changing my mind anymore, what I decide to do from now on I'm sticking with it. Getting rid of India and Arabia to me makes it more vanilla than having what we did.

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No,you got me wrong ahowl11 whe I quoted this :


Cut it off right before India going east and right before Arabia going south, frees up at least 15-20 city slots, plus Saba and Mauryan Empire are really not needed. We also include special geographic features from Rome.


I meant that it was the original best idea,that is why I have bolded it...I like the idea and the part off the world in my opinion needs to be vanilla,but we can enlarge with roma II Surrectum's environment,like we wanted to do.It will bring more interesting things in the vanilla part.

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Problem with Roma Surrectum's is that it still takes away easter regions were Parthians and Greeks (Seleucids and Bactians) went.

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It is a game and you change history,why not go in a different direction ?

No, ahowl11 has stated by his wishes for accuracy that this is not a game anymore. He appears to wish a pseudo war simulator (like EB attemped, iugh)

I do not see what is the problem with the map...We are using the vanilla part,like the original RTW uses but the map will be bigger...The area stays the same...That is ok for me.

And I actually do not see why every mod needs to have Mundus Magnus map...I have nothing against it,but since this mod is vanilla we stayed with the original map,but to bring something new we have enlargen it(because it will have more cities also).

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Originally Posted by Asgaroth

And I actually do not see why every mod needs to have Mundus Magnus map...I have nothing against it,but since this mod is vanilla we stayed with the original map,but to bring something new we have enlargen it(because it will have more cities also).

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Is not that every mods needs that map, but are you willing to do a whole new map yourself? That map is already played, tested, almost bug-free (just some known CTD's), etc, and mapping is one of the longest time consumer parts of modding, and one that can stuck much of other work (if we were to use a whole new map, we wouldn't be able to put garrisons -wich take a lot of time to place in the right coordinates and to balance them-, place resources, check AI pathfinding, etc, and that, to me, should only be left for mods with full-time mappers -do we have any?-), so, as you can see most mods only took advantage of that already avaible and useful resource. Even more, check out the mod-team list for mods that use that map and you'll notice that the teams are rather small, since they have already a good ammount of work done, wich tells you just how important to have already a working map is.

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Is not that every mods needs that map, but are you willing to do a whole new map yourself?

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I never said that we should make a new map...I said that we use the vanilla enlarged map,if you know what I mean....And it is possible and we were planing to do it,but just as we were to do Ozman did something bad at the forum and he got kicked out by the moderators for a while.

The plan was to use Roma Surrectum's map and cut off the parts we don't need and for those that cannot be cut(down and left,or ?) out it would be terra incognita.

Ops, wrong post

We are using Mundus Magnus but making India and Arabia Terra Incognita. It is as simple as that.

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Originally Posted by Asgaroth

but just as we were to do Ozman did something bad at the forum and he got kicked out by the moderators for a while.

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Who says i did something wrong?

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We are using Mundus Magnus but making India and Arabia Terra Incognita. It is as simple as that.

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I like the idea.

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Who says i did something wrong?

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Eh,me ?...

Just jocking,there was something wrong at the TWC,you just dissapeared....I am happy that you are back.

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Originally Posted by Asgaroth

you just dissapeared....I am happy that you are back.

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It was because i went into self-exile until i could have a working map. I'm glad to say that my work is going smoothly, and since you guys were my first modding team i'll like to share at least the radar version of my new (masterpiece) map.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i1184.photobucket.com/albums...dar_map2-1.jpg

I'm glad to see to the evolution of this mod, and to see that this time you guys are first settling things up before everything else. I'm sorry for dissapearing without notice, i just needed time for myself too and arrange some stuff with real life (i'm applying for a job -got a test for it this saturday- and contesting to assist the next G-20 summit here in Mexico, so plenty of work :book2:).

Killer...

The map looks great.Nice work.

How does it look ingame...Is it more like the vanilla or is it extended ?

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I'm glad to see to the evolution of this mod, and to see that this time you guys are first settling things up before everything else.

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Yup...We are nearly done with the discussions.

Ah, Ave Oz, nice haha! Good to have you back!! Nice map as well, but if you have not read already we are getting rid of the Indian and Arabian regions to make room for more cities

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Originally Posted by Asgaroth

Killer...

The map looks great.Nice work.

How does it look ingame...Is it more like the vanilla or is it extended ?

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It uses the max size allowed by the engine, wich is 1021 pixels (actual size 1021x625 -widewise-). It features extended space for most areas, as an example you can now put 3 settlements in the peloponnesus area without overcrowding the zone. Italy is not much more width, just a few pixels, however the distance from south to north is more realistic (longer) and that off course has the effect of keeping away the problem of overcrowding any area (unless you want 10 regions in Italy-not smart at all).

And that keeps going and going.

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Originally Posted by ahowl11

Ah, Ave Oz, nice haha! Good to have you back!! Nice map as well, but if you have not read already we are getting rid of the Indian and Arabian regions to make room for more cities

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I have no problems with that, those geographical regions are kept in my map just to be able to provide a balanced regions distribution, not necessary that they will hold any actual region. So, will this map satisfy the necessities of HRTW? :)

Having read the other posts of the mod i would strongly suggest using the new map:2thumbsup:, since whatever the faction list finally comes to, the scale of the map will certainly make -more- justice (than the vanilla scale) to any faction that makes it in to the mod.

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So, will this map satisfy the necessities of HRTW? :)

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Of course...thank you for the map you have made

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Originally Posted by Asgaroth

Of course...thank you for the map you have made

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Haha it's not "made" yet. I spent several hours working on the right projection for the map, but don't worry it already loads and i'm working with back-ups to avoid future problems.

@ahowl11 if you don't mind, could you un-sticky this thread? And if it's ok with you i'll like to start a new one (under my charge :P) for the regions and settlements research, and also to post updates once a settlement is implemented. Also in that thread i'll like to have some discussion about the map and regions layou.

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Haha it's not "made" yet.

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Nevermind.I bett it looks awesome...

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i'll like to start a new one (under my charge :P) for the regions and settlements research, and also to post updates once a settlement is implemented.

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I think that this would be better as we would be more faster and more precise in our work.

However look the first message here(the first one on the top,I meant).We are researching by parts of the map,like Asia Minor,Italy and so on and after that we will give the settlements to the factions....I have alredy made/found you a region for every settlement we have researched till now and I will continue as soon as we start researching.

If you want your thread stickied, simply put (please sticky) next to it. Also copy paste the regions we have already researched. that way asgaroth and I can just continue instead of starting over again.. when we are done with the regions and cities, put them all in as rebels, add RS2 environments, and then take screens of each region. Then as we research each faction we can assign them cities. That's how we will do this.

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Originally Posted by ahowl11

If you want your thread stickied, simply put (please sticky) next to it. Also copy paste the regions we have already researched. that way asgaroth and I can just continue instead of starting over again.. when we are done with the regions and cities, put them all in as rebels, add RS2 environments, and then take screens of each region. Then as we research each faction we can assign them cities. That's how we will do this.

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Got it

can you give me a time frame of when it will be ready for us to start researching? I'm hoping by Saturday?

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Originally Posted by ahowl11

can you give me a time frame of when it will be ready for us to start researching? I'm hoping by Saturday?

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I don't know what you mean by that. The map alredy loads and any region you want can be inmediately implemented, so research should start now

Oh, then great! I have an hour or so before baseball practice and no homework at the moment so I will do my best to make a quick and simple guide to research each faction. Then we may start!

Sounds good.

BTW i never do a radar map for a map that doesn't load, so every map i've posted at TWC was working "fine" at some point. Once i get home (i'm at work now) i'll do the Italian peninsula regions, wich i have covered with my own resources.