Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition

Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition

The year is 1066, the world is changing and a new order is rising. But who will be rising stars of this new era and who will fall?

Christendom is tragically split in schism. A bitter seed has been sown in the lands of Christendom where spiritual brothers are pitted against brothers, swords are raised and spears are sharpened. Will this enmity reap an equally bitter harvest?

Dar-al-Islam too is split between the party of Ali (Shia) and the Community of the Sunni based in the respective Caliphal seats of Cairo and Baghdad. Elsewhere Islam faces collapse especially in Al-Andalus where the third rival Caliphate in Cordoba has disintegrated into petty Taifa states concerned in their own self-interest and blind to the resurgence of the small Christian states in the north who are determined to undo the humiliation inflicted upon them 300 years ago. However, there is also renewal in Islam as well. A new power from the east is coming in the form of new converts to Islam. Will these Seljuk Turks revive Islam’s fortunes and restore unity and power to Sunni Islam?

On the shores of the Bosphorus, it seems that the ancient Roman Empire may have run its course. Dynastic exhaustion is approaching with the near death of its current Emperor who is weak, feeble, incompetent and childless. Its armies are weakened by successive intrigue and powerless against recent raids by the Seljuks. Its generals, coming from noble aristocratic families are seething at such poor leadership and may soon rebel. But is it too late? Can the Romans save their 1000 year old empire?

This is also the time where brilliant individuals come to the fore and create history. From the ranks of the Normans come two of the finest generals to grace Norman history. Though they exist in two different places at once (one in Normandy and the other in Southern Italy), they share the same drive, motivation and ambition to create their own destiny. One is an illegitimate bastard, the other, a warrior of low ranking. Will William the Bastard be a Conqueror? Will Robert Hauteville live up to his name of “Guiscard” the “wily”?

In a time such as this, there are many unpredictable things as well. From steppes of the east has come the scourge of God in the form of the Huns and the Avars. From these same steppes have come the ferocious Magyars who have now become a bastion of Christendom. There is always the possibility of another eruption from the mysterious east where tales abound of unnatural beings of great military brutality and swift retribution. Will civilisation be able to resist it the next time the endless steppes unleash a new terror?

All this and more in MTR: Age of Ambition!!

Proposed Factions:

Scottish
England (Normans)
Danes
Duchy of Southern Italy
Papal States
HRE
Poland
Rus
France
Crown of Aragon
Leon-Castile
Moorish Sultanate
Egyptian SultanateTurkish Sultanate
Romaion (Byzantines)
Serbs
Venice
Hungary
Mongols
Georgia-Sakartvelo
Cumans/Qipchaqs

Aims of MTR: AOA (or Meteora) if you want :2thumbsup:

Create a "realism" modification which will immerse players in whatever faction they choose. We aim to create unique factions with unique cultures with small added features that make a difference to gameplay. We want to create a medieval world the way it should be to cater to an individual's ambition, greed for gold, thirst for battle, glory and perhaps surprisingly enough...piety.

With the likes of Caius Britannicus and Wraithdt, you can be sure that the visual content of the modification will be first class from a lowly peasant unit to an elite royal bodyguard unit. We are looking for:

Researchers - the foundation upon which the modification must be built on. Their knowledge will ensure that we will stay on the right track to create an immersive world to play in. People with considerable knowledge for a particular faction and want to be a head researcher with their own research team and with responsibilities as preparing factions previews, co-ordinating with skinners and scripters and glory and babes..PM me. However, if there is a faction with a head researcher already, PM them, not me.

Graphic Designers - They are the ones who create the interface through which players can experience MTR: AOA. We're looking for people who are excellent with graphic design programs and want the chance to show off!

We invite, anyone and everyone who wants to participate in the creation of such a modification to notify either me (Kataphraktoi) or Achilles by PM.

Team:
Project Leader: Achilles

Most honoured Researchers:
Head of Polish Faction Research: Polak 966

Head of Serbia Faction Research: DukeofSerbia

Head of England/Norman (Normandy and Italy) Factions Research: Ignoramus

Head of Turkish Sultanate Research: Cebei (HOORAY!!)

Head of Moorish/African Research: Beauchamp

Head of Danish Research: Endre (or Ringeck)

IrishArmenian

Almogaver (Crown of Aragon)

Head of Danish/Scandinavian Research: Endre

Head of Byzantium/Romaion Research: Kataphraktoi
Byzantine Emperor

Head of Georgia Faction Research: Beka

Head of Rus Faction Research: Cadmus

Head of HRE Faction Research: SabreHRE and Cutepuppy

Eltrevo (Tuetonic Knights)

Randarkmaan (Fatimid, Ayyubids)

Faenaris (Crusading Orders)

Head of Rus Faction Research: Cadmus


Tech/Visual/Graphic Wizards:
Publius - Skinner/Modeller/Graphic Artist
Kataphraktoi (stand in project leader)
Wraithdt
Caius Britannicus
Dark89 (Coder)
Chigga
Silver Rusher

CONCEPT ART
Here are a list of concept art, they are under two sections:

I'll list Orda Khan's first, in honour of his gracious effort and time to provide us with these concepts:
https://img78.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mongol17ef.jpg

https://img78.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mongol43sx.jpg

https://img78.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mongol31yc.jpg

https://img193.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mha1b1eu.jpg

https://img408.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mha1a5eu.jpg

https://img139.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mha1c1fy.jpg

https://img78.imageshack.us/my.php?i...pchaq012ic.jpg

https://img419.imageshack.us/my.php?...elite012pz.jpg (KIPCHACK ELITE)

https://img224.imageshack.us/my.php?...pchaq026vg.jpg (KIPCHAK)

https://img161.imageshack.us/my.php?...ntryman9un.jpg (VOLGA BULGARINFANTRYMAN)

https://img161.imageshack.us/my.php?...rarcher7zz.jpg (VOLGA BULGARARCHER)

https://img473.imageshack.us/my.php?...olnoyan6yh.jpg (MONGOL NOYAN)

https://img132.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hun016tk.jpg (HUN)

https://img418.imageshack.us/my.php?...golkhan1zs.jpg (MONGOL KHAN)

Wraithdt and Kataphraktoi's stuff
https://img134.imageshack.us/my.php?...1066kat8ok.jpg (KATAPHRAKTOI 1060S)

https://img419.imageshack.us/my.php?...cavalry0rh.jpg (GHULAM CAVALRY)

https://img403.imageshack.us/my.php?...anguard4om.jpg (VARANGIAN GUARDS 11TH-14TH CENT)

https://img58.imageshack.us/my.php?i...ersionb3kj.jpg (KLIBANOPHORI VERSION A)

https://img69.imageshack.us/my.php?i...ersiona4ve.jpg (KLIBANOPHORI VERSION B)

http://img111.imageshack.us/my.php?i...atickat3rv.jpg (TAGMATIC KATAPHRAKTOI)

https://img205.imageshack.us/my.php?...rcopole2jp.jpg (TURCOPOLE)

http://www.geocities.com/weirdguynextdoor/excubit.jpg (EXCUBITORES)

http://www.geocities.com/weirdguynex...man_Knight.jpg (NORMAN KNIGHT)

http://www.geocities.com/weirdguynex...ttawa_prev.jpg (ADDED FUTUWWA..hopefully this works)

http://www.geocities.com/weirdguynex...HI_prev_04.jpg NEW JANISSARY HEAVY INFANTRY - RIGHT CLICK AND SAVE

http://www.geocities.com/weirdguynex...lic_prev02.jpg DRAFT OF MEN AT ARMS

http://img111.imageshack.us/my.php?i...aafinalsj7.jpg GOTHIC MEN AT ARMS

https://img75.imageshack.us/img75/65...osmlyy2.th.jpg HASHASHIN

https://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?i...oplitaifm0.jpg Thematikoi Hoplitai

https://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?i...toxotaiwe9.jpg Thematikoi Tagmatikoi Hoplitai and Thematikoi Toxotai

Great previews here, but some of the links have th.jpg at the end. Remove the .th so it is just .jpg, otherwise you get a shrunken down version with a dimensions bar at the bottom.

dont forget the 966 in my name~;p

I'm willing to be a researcher.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ignoramus

I'm willing to be a researcher.

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i'm willing to be a player when it's out.:idea2: :laugh4:
seriously though, will keep an eye on this one!

At Silver Rusher, thanks for the tip :2thumbsup:

AT Sarkiss, nice one :laugh4:

At Polak, no probs :2thumbsup:

Ignoramus, check ur PM :2thumbsup:

LINKS FIXED!!!

Will release map soon.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kataphraktoi

Time to know a bit about Wraithdt:
Concepts he's responsible for:
Crusaders
Arabs
Turks (joint)

Concepts done so far:
Saracen Infantry
Ghulam cavalry
Varangian Guard
Futuwwa Infantry
Templar Knight

From:
Petaling Jaya, Malaysia

Now:
Canada, modeller and concept artist
__________________

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Where can I find the 'Futuwwa Infantry'? I can't find it and these concept drawings are so beautiful; I wouldn't like to miss out on one.

I think there were two concepts I didnt post up....I'll check and re-add them later. :2thumbsup:

I shall start researching tomorrow morning. I have a few things to do tonight, and the night's getting on here in Australia.

Ignoramus.

It seems that some researchers work for MA, too or maybe I am wrong.

:2thumbsup: Yep, thats right.

Where u at Ignoramus in Australia? Im in Melbourne at the moment

ALWAYS CHECK THE FIRST POST FOR UPDATES (NEW UPDATES WILL ALWAYS BE AT THE BOTTOM) so everything can be found in the one post...:D

1062 - interesting start date. It will be fun to have a Saxon english faction. Very different from MTW's Anglo-Norman faction. Should mean a much greater role for anglo-saxon units.

So i guess you are having the English and the Normans as independent factions? Are you including the Norse so you can have a nice 1066 re-enactment? :)

Yes, the Futuwwa has gone missing and it was a beautiful sketch

.....Orda

Looks great to see a fellow Malaysian on board on such a great project. Good luck !!! :2thumbsup:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kataphraktoi

Concept Draft Map:
http://www.geocities.com/weirdguynextdoor/Proper.jpg

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This link doesn't work for me. Can you sent map via e-mail?:help:

It doesn't work for me either. Why didn't you upload it via imageshack.

What's your aims and strategy for this mod?

Is it purely concentrating on realism? On improving gameplay? On adding new features?

Will you be replacing skins? Adding new units? Adding/removing provinces? Changing names?

Is it going to be a series of releases or working towards 1 big launch?

Concept arts previews look fine and there is only to hope
that researchers and modders will do their job till it's finished.
Greets

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kataphraktoi

:2thumbsup: Yep, thats right.

Where u at Ignoramus in Australia? Im in Melbourne at the moment

ALWAYS CHECK THE FIRST POST FOR UPDATES (NEW UPDATES WILL ALWAYS BE AT THE BOTTOM) so everything can be found in the one post...:D

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That's interesting, so am I. Where do I send my research? Do I send it to you?

FUTUWWA ADDED, check first post.

Quote:

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1062 - interesting start date. It will be fun to have a Saxon english faction. Very different from MTW's Anglo-Norman faction. Should mean a much greater role for anglo-saxon units.

So i guess you are having the English and the Normans as independent factions? Are you including the Norse so you can have a nice 1066 re-enactment? :)

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I had to move it from 1054 to 1062 because:

a) Marrakesh was found in 1062 so i couldn't give the Moors Marrakesh as a capital before 1062.

b) Toghrul Beg was given the title of Sultan after 1054 and before 1062, hence I can call the Turkish faction the Turkish Sultanate.

c) Normans in Italy start with more than one province because by 1063, the Byzantines are left with a toehold and the Normans are beginning to fight in Sicily - two-pronged ASSAULT YEAH!!

d) Yep, the Normans and English are independent factions and the Danes will be in there two. Hopefully we can script it so that a stack of Danes will be on English territory, or least script so that the Danes try to invade England.

e) Add to that Scotland in the north. Its one big messy soup :2thumbsup:

Quote:

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What's your aims and strategy for this mod?

Is it purely concentrating on realism? On improving gameplay? On adding new features?

Will you be replacing skins? Adding new units? Adding/removing provinces? Changing names?

Is it going to be a series of releases or working towards 1 big launch?

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Realism and gameplay, but we want to create a certain atmosphere that draws you into the game by creating and representing unique cultures and achievements of each faction. As for new add features, hard to say at the moment.

Everything will be replaced. We have one of the best skinners in the business, Caius Britannicus! Check out his Crusades mod for samples of his work down in www.twcenter.net

One big launch probably. I'm only a stand-in project leader.

Quote:

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It doesn't work for me either. Why didn't you upload it via imageshack.

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Fixed link. Plus, geocities has no popup ads so far. Well not for me anyways. :2thumbsup: Its ready for viewing DukeofSerbia, and its a massive jpeg so u might want to shrink it....:wall:

Quote:

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Looks great to see a fellow Malaysian on board on such a great project. Good luck !!!

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Don'y forget Wraithdt, he's Malaysia too..from Petaling Jaya, I'm from small humble Malacca, the former capital of the Malacca Sultanate, now just a tourist attraction for Chicken Rice Balls and the ruins of a once formidable Portugese fortification called A'famosa (The famous).

Seems like theres going to be daily updates for this week. :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :2thumbsup:

At Ignoramus:
Research data shouldn't be sent to me. Hold onto your data until I come up with a proper format for faction previews. Although for the fuedalism system, you have any idea how it should be implemented? Im interested to hear it. :2thumbsup:

And I have to add ur name to the team list now. :2thumbsup:

i dont mean to sound crazy but i think kakhaber would be excellent as a researcher for the georgians. theyre in arent they?

Im sure he'll get tons of info, but in terms of communicating it to the rest of us in English, I'm not too sure about that. And besides, I have't been able to contact him since he got banned (it seems for life) at twcenter.net. I'll leave Georgian recruitment to Beka. He's the head reseacher for Georgia so its his responsibility for that :2thumbsup: woot!

Just a notice to everyone, I have the following concepts to post this week and next week:

a)Janissary Heavy Infantry by Wraithdt (not finished, but once u see it u won't care! Its that brilliant!)

b) Men at Arms 14th century by Wraithdt

c) Klibanophori version 3

d) Imperial Tagmatic Cavalryman on horse

e) Khazar mercenary

f) Varangians

g) Other assorted Byzantine soldiers

h) Constantine Dragases

Personally, I'd get Wraithdt to do all concepts, but he's only human and can't do it all so I have to chip in :laugh4:

Wow, this looks even more well researched then the original RTR! I have some questions though:

1.Are you planning on bringing the eras back? It could possibly work like TFT in RTW when they had different zipped campiagns. This way, you can use the same faction slots,(I.e In early campiagn you have Saxons, but in High you have Seljuks of Rum)units, and skins/models without worrying about the hardcoded limits.:idea2:

2.How do you plan on tackling the Religion issue? I mean theres a mighty big chance they'll be hardcoded like MTW1 which means no Shia/Sunni split! In short, what are your backup plans?


Really looking forword to this guys I hope this makes the money I'll shell out for MTW2 worth it!

PS:Map pic is'int working for me either.:no:

ok, guys, if the links don't work directly, its a matter of "right click and save".

In the future, I'll "imageshack" everything. Damn Geocities, good for nothing...razzle frazzle.

Hmmm, the tech guys will probably sort out the eras things. I'm not too familiar with that kind of stuff.

Since we can't have the Sunni/Shia split, either Sunni or SHia will have to be the heretics. 3 of 4 Muslim Factions are SUnnis, so I think the Shia will be the heretics. Not out of personal bias or anything cos I'm not Muslim, I'm following the "majority" mentality thats all.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kataphraktoi

ok, guys, if the links don't work directly, its a matter of "right click and save".

In the future, I'll "imageshack" everything. Damn Geocities, good for nothing...razzle frazzle.

Hmmm, the tech guys will probably sort out the eras things. I'm not too familiar with that kind of stuff.

Since we can't have the Sunni/Shia split, either Sunni or SHia will have to be the heretics. 3 of 4 Muslim Factions are SUnnis, so I think the Shia will be the heretics. Not out of personal bias or anything cos I'm not Muslim, I'm following the "majority" mentality thats all.

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There's not much theological differences anyway between the Shiah and the Sunni and the split was mainly political/tribal issue eventhough the split was big enough to bring continuos war even until today.

However, if M2TW uses the loyalty system as in BI that can be use/modded to represent the split and I'm sure that the next TW will have more than current 3 religion that have an actual effect (hardcoded stuff).

I'm pretty sure that M2TW wont be too much diffrence from BI as it'll basically uses the same engine (upgraded hopefully).

Just my 2cents.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kataphraktoi

Fixed link. Plus, geocities has no popup ads so far. Well not for me anyways. :2thumbsup: Its ready for viewing DukeofSerbia, and its a massive jpeg so u might want to shrink it....:wall:

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Yes, I see. It's pretty big file. How I will downlod that, that's the good question.:wall:

Did you receive e-mail from me in Sunday night (your time was Monday morning) or not? I ask because you didn't answer.

And now I saw that starting year is 1062. Kievan Rus desintegreted into numerous principalities. Which principality will be the major, question is now (Moscow didn't existed yet)?

oops i did see the email, but i didnt read it completely. TO download the map, "right click and save target as" on the link for the map.

The disintegration of the RUs wasn't immediate after 1054, so we have to script it in so that provinces around Kiev are rebellious, the player who controls the Rus will have to fight internecine wars.

Kipchaks were indeed one of the dominant components in the Golden Horde army, perhaps, Orda Khan can shed light on this.

I'll leave the naming of the Balkan provinces up to you except for Epirus, Thrace, Thessaly and Constantinople in which I'll get it translated into Greek by another guy.

Ok, then can ur friend show some animation samples?

The worse thing now are team members asking for more provinces when I've already hit the province limit. :laugh4:

:2thumbsup:

JANISSARY ADDED, SEE FIRST POST

It must be the file size of the map, the other geocite links work OK. The Janissary Heavy Inf is stunning, superb work Wraithdt!!

The Qipchaq question.....
When the Mongol princes left for Qaraqorum, the vast majority of 'Mongol' Tumens left the west. Batu was left with his own personal army and some other commanders/personnel who decided to remain. On the whole, the so called 'Mongol' armies of the Golden Horde were Qipchaq. Batu's new realm was referred to as the 'Khanate of Qipcha'ud'. The Golden, Blue, White horde names did not apply, the whole area was under the authority of Batu. Tatar was a name applied to conquered peoples, perhaps after the destruction of the Tatars proper by Chingis Khan. This could be one explanation why both Russian and European chronicles refer to them as 'Tatars', especially when Friar Giovanni DePlano Carpini wrote about the 'Mongols whom we call Tatars'

.......Orda

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wraithd

There, the Byzantine master has said it. Plus I remembered reading that the Byzantines were never really keen on adopting the western style of heavily armoured infantry and has always stuck to using lamellar and scale armour up untill the fall of the empire in 1453. The only person I know who wore full plated armour was the emporer Constantine XI during the final fall of Costantinople.

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Kataphraktoi, I found that on www.twcenter.net Forum (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showp...&postcount=88).

Year: 1150
Event: Battle
Location: Near (small) river Tara near modern Valjevo town in Western Serbia
Sides: Romans against join forces of Serbs and Hungarians
Military leaders of Romans: Emperor Manuel I Comneni, plus generals John Ducas and ? Cantacuzenus (all were personally fought, Cantacuzen and Manuel were almost killed by Hungarians)
Military leaders of Serbs and Hungarians: Rascian Grand župan Uroš II, Rascian župans Grdeša and Vučina and Hungarian archzupan Vakhin
Battle: Roman army defeated joint forces of Serbs and Hungarians in bloody battle. Reason was highly undisciplined Serbian and Hungarian soldiers. Rascian župans Grdeša and Vučina were captured, Grand župan Uroš II and his army routed. Manuel I captured personally Hungarian archzupan Vakhin who almost killed him according to John Kinam. Hungarian army also routed.
Outcame: Rascian Grand župan Uroš II became Manuel’s vassal (second time).

I read that emperor Manuel I Comneni has protected whole body with golden armor in that battle! And I think it was plate armor from describe. It is recorded by Greek John Kinam (or Cinam).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kataphraktoi

Since we can't have the Sunni/Shia split, either Sunni or SHia will have to be the heretics. 3 of 4 Muslim Factions are SUnnis, so I think the Shia will be the heretics. Not out of personal bias or anything cos I'm not Muslim, I'm following the "majority" mentality thats all.

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If you have to make one of them heretics the Shia is by far the best choice. They split off the mainstream muslims (which are now known as the Sunni) so in that way they are just as much heretics as all the other heretics, since the word in general applies to the way the Roman catholics saw the religious groups that split from the Church and other non catholics. But this raises another question: will you include the group from whose name the word assasin is derived? They're called Assassijnen in Dutch. They joined forces with the Shia to fight the Sunni and where famous for their suicide attacks on Sunni leaders.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tellos Athenaios

If you have to make one of them heretics the Shia is by far the best choice. They split off the mainstream muslims (which are now known as the Sunni) so in that way they are just as much heretics as all the other heretics, since the word in general applies to the way the Roman catholics saw the religious groups that split from the Church and other non catholics. But this raises another question: will you include the group from whose name the word assasin is derived? They're called Assassijnen in Dutch. They joined forces with the Shia to fight the Sunni and where famous for their suicide attacks on Sunni leaders.

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They real name was "Batanis" FYI. :2thumbsup: And they were Shia. They were originally from Iran and were founded by a man named Hassan. In this timeline they dont exist yet so no need to work on them untill the next era. ;)

new concept, check first post.

interesting about the manuel komnenos and his golden armour though

Okey FINALLY got to see the map and it looks great sofar! My only compliant is that Germany and maybe France have too many provinces and the Middle East doesint have enough. This really does'int make sense since the ME was the more highly populated area at the time period of the mod.:book: Plus noone wants to spend most of there campiagns in Germany and France.:no:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DukeofSerbia

I read that emperor Manuel I Comneni has protected whole body with golden armor in that battle! And I think it was plate armor from describe. It is recorded by Greek John Kinam (or Cinam).

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It wasn't plate armour, cuz it wasn't invented back then. Instead it could be just cuirass for chest with golden decorations.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Herkus

It wasn't plate armour, cuz it wasn't invented back then. Instead it could be just cuirass for chest with golden decorations.

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That's why I wrote "I think". Record of battle by John Ciman said he was all in golden armour (whenever that mean). Maybe you have right.:bow:

Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition

I resized map because original map is just too large and upload to imageshack.us. Who want to see greater map (resolution is 3508*2480) know where is the link.

https://img153.imageshack.us/img153/...sizeou2.th.jpg

According to map, factions are (alphabetical order):

Roman Catholics: Aragon, Castile-Leon, Denmark, England, France, Holy Roman Empire, Hungary, Mediterranean Normans, Normandy, Papal State, Poland, Scotland and Venice

Orthodox: Georgia, Roman Empire, Rus’ and Serbia*

Muslim: Egypt**, Moors and Seljuk Turks


* Most of (modern) Serbia was under direct Byzantium rule and those Serbs who were free and had state in Zeta were mostly Roman Catholics and rulers were also. How this will be solved, I don’t know until M2 TW came on market.
** Egypt was ruled by Fatimid dynasty (Fatimid Caliphate) who was de facto shia.

Quote:

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Okey FINALLY got to see the map and it looks great sofar! My only compliant is that Germany and maybe France have too many provinces and the Middle East doesint have enough. This really does'int make sense since the ME was the more highly populated area at the time period of the mod. Plus noone wants to spend most of there campiagns in Germany and France.

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:laugh4: I actually trimmed down the province numbers for France and Germany and increased the number of provinces for the Middle East!!! It drove me nuts trying to erase provinces from Europe :laugh4:

By the way which provinces would you erase anyway? This is a draft map, so its likely a new version will be made later.

True, the Middle East had more population, but there were highly concentrated in its greater urban centres than Europe. Plus, a poorer Western Europe would benefit from a few more provinces as revenue bases.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DukeofSerbia

Most of (modern) Serbia was under direct Byzantium rule and those Serbs who were free and had state in Zeta were mostly Roman Catholics and rulers were also. How this will be solved, I don’t know until M2 TW came on market.

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Maby make mixed population in the cities, and then you have to convert your populace to the prefered religion. That woul be acording to history (at least I think), because Stefan Nemanja did have the option to chose to which religion will he side. He was ultimately swayed into ortodox faith by his son Sava.

At least that's what I think. I may be wrong.

A few things.

Spain and north africa look far too barren. I think some moor islamic factions are really needed.

And secondly that very many provinces. Im not sure Ireland for example needs three provinces for itself.

Whole Moslem Iberia (Umayyad) desintegrated in begginig of XI century into various emirates. So, those Taifa kingdoms will be represented as rebels.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DukeofSerbia

Whole Moslem Iberia (Umayyad) desintegrated in begginig of XI century into various emirates. So, those Taifa kingdoms will be represented as rebels.

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Yea, but still kinda unbalancing.

Another thing I just noticed.

The French lands are simply the French Crown lands resulting in most of France being rebels. The HRE which was really just a loose collection of states however is completly unified including Bohemia thus has no rebels. This does not make sense. France is piecmealed wich is rather accurate, yet at the same time the Holy Roman Empire is a single entity. This just seems terribly unbalancing.

I'm in charge for Serbia and mostly Balkan (South Slavs), so I can't comment about what is not my area.
This map is just preview and there will be changes, I'm sure.

P.S.
About HRE I agree. We don't no how loyalty will function. Remeber HRE from MTW - when you started, most generals had very low loyalty, and AI always went in civil war. Voltaire said: "This agglomeration which was called and which still calls itself the Holy Roman Empire was neither holy, nor Roman, nor an empire.":laugh4:

I know changes will be made to the map but regarding the Crown of Aragon I don't know how you will call the starting province...
you have united Aragon and Catalonia in one province and both are cut in half (I know this is correct in terms of representing the area they owned at the time but you will have to "invent" a new name for the province).
I'd made them start with two provinces: Aragon and Catalonia and make them both bigger, deleting the one southwards.

wat do you mean? i see, going along the northern coast from the left, galicia (or possibly leon), castilla, navarra, zaragosa.

Feedback is always, I just want everyone to know that its still a draft concept map until I get the researchers I need.

I'm looking for a head researcher into France and HRE.

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I know changes will be made to the map but regarding the Crown of Aragon I don't know how you will call the starting province...
you have united Aragon and Catalonia in one province and both are cut in half (I know this is correct in terms of representing the area they owned at the time but you will have to "invent" a new name for the province).
I'd made them start with two provinces: Aragon and Catalonia and make them both bigger, deleting the one southwards.

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I'm trying to erase more provinces so I can split the Crown of Aragon into two, don't worry Almogaver, I want to split it into two provinces, but just not yet, I'm still balancing other stuff :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup:

The reason why I won't delete the Taifa of Zaragossa is because I want as many Taifa's represented as possible. But of course some Taifas cannot be represented. Keep ur feed back coming, its appreciated.

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Yea, but still kinda unbalancing.

Another thing I just noticed.

The French lands are simply the French Crown lands resulting in most of France being rebels. The HRE which was really just a loose collection of states however is completly unified including Bohemia thus has no rebels. This does not make sense. France is piecmealed wich is rather accurate, yet at the same time the Holy Roman Empire is a single entity. This just seems terribly unbalancing.

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Taifa states won't be pushovers, they will have adequate armies to prevent a simple overrunning by the Christian states.

Originally, I intended for the HRE to have only provinces under direct control, but I just decided to give them everything just to see how it would turn out, but my first intention is to limit HRE to its German hinterland which excludes Bohemia, Burgundy and Italy. It is likely, I will do this in the next map because I never felt comfortable giving HRE control over provinces they never had direct control over. Like Spain, at least the rebels will be formidable. WHen the time comes, MTR will decide how to implement gameplay so that defeating rebels requires more than winning one battle, but will involve other strategic considerations.

One of my thoughts revolved around giving faactions provinces they had direct control over. Eg. Byzantium had Serbia, Georgia and the Mirdasid/Marwanids as vassals, but I do not think it would represent them fairly in the game so I decided not to give them such territories. I also intend to change the Turk's territories in the future since Transoxiana was a vassal state, not a Seljuk province.

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A few things.

Spain and north africa look far too barren. I think some moor islamic factions are really needed.

And secondly that very many provinces. Im not sure Ireland for example needs three provinces for itself.

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Lol, I originally gave 14 provinces to North AFRICA, but the 199 province limit forced me to cut down provinces. Im operating on the assumption that the province limit for mtw2 is the same as RTW.

I would give the HRE control over everything. It would work perfectly with my feudal system.

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Originally Posted by kataphraktoi

One of my thoughts revolved around giving faactions provinces they had direct control over. Eg. Byzantium had Serbia, Georgia and the Mirdasid/Marwanids as vassals, but I do not think it would represent them fairly in the game so I decided not to give them such territories. I also intend to change the Turk's territories in the future since Transoxiana was a vassal state, not a Seljuk province.

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Prince of Zeta (Dioclea) Michael in 1062 wasn't vassal of Roman Empire. He was indepedent and he received crown from Pope in 1077 (first Serbian king).

Will Venice be somehow represented?

(They began as the most western city of the Eastern Roman Empire, became a semi independent city state with control over the Balkans later and ended up as a completely independent city state.)

Which raises my next question: will the Silk road and more important the trade routes in the Med from and towards Venice be represented? I mean Venice being Europe's key to silk, spices and so on...

@ Orda Khan, Kataphrakoi, and especially Wraithdt - how on earth do you manage to draw concept art like that? Do you just use a standard pencil, read up on some info and then draw away? I've been trying to draw some concept art, have you got any tips, becuase those drawings are incredible!:2thumbsup:

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Taifa states won't be pushovers, they will have adequate armies to prevent a simple overrunning by the Christian states.

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Well if there is really a 30 faction limit like they said why not make Coroboda a faction? I just think factions are funnier to fight than rebels and a spain filled with rebels, dispite how strong they may be would be kinda boring.

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Originally, I intended for the HRE to have only provinces under direct control, but I just decided to give them everything just to see how it would turn out, but my first intention is to limit HRE to its German hinterland which excludes Bohemia, Burgundy and Italy. It is likely, I will do this in the next map because I never felt comfortable giving HRE control over provinces they never had direct control over. Like Spain, at least the rebels will be formidable. WHen the time comes, MTR will decide how to implement gameplay so that defeating rebels requires more than winning one battle, but will involve other strategic considerations.

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My point was less HRE should or should not have control over all its lands as it was if they do then France certainly should. Im aware of the situation of the French Crown, but aside from Brittany, Normady, Flanders, and Burgundy, France should be excert control over its own territory. Otherwise the situation is again one that doesnt seem apealing gamewise.

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Lol, I originally gave 14 provinces to North AFRICA, but the 199 province limit forced me to cut down provinces. Im operating on the assumption that the province limit for mtw2 is the same as RTW.

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I meant in terms of factions. Again all rebel. People like factions. Fighting rebels gets dry and boring. Is there no faction that could be around tunisia or something?

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Originally Posted by King of Atlantis

Well if there is really a 30 faction limit like they said why not make Coroboda a faction? I just think factions are funnier to fight than rebels and a spain filled with rebels, dispite how strong they may be would be kinda boring.



My point was less HRE should or should not have control over all its lands as it was if they do then France certainly should. Im aware of the situation of the French Crown, but aside from Brittany, Normady, Flanders, and Burgundy, France should be excert control over its own territory. Otherwise the situation is again one that doesnt seem apealing gamewise.



I meant in terms of factions. Again all rebel. People like factions. Fighting rebels gets dry and boring. Is there no faction that could be around tunisia or something?

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To reply to that sugestion about 30 fact.
We don't know if there would be that many factions. So they are putting on map only those necsary that fit into what we know about faction number. If we find out when gam comes out that there is indeed f limit of 30 then aditional will be included. Untill then they go I think by RTW limit.

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Well if there is really a 30 faction

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I kinda covered myself on that one...

:2thumbsup:

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Well if there is really a 30 faction limit like they said why not make Coroboda a faction? I just think factions are funnier to fight than rebels and a spain filled with rebels, dispite how strong they may be would be kinda boring.

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Don't you see the point? THats only IF... we don't know if its a certainty or not so we can only plan for 21 factions, its the most sensible thing to do. It is far easier to add a faction than remove one. Believe I've thought a LOT about what factions to include, of course, I would love to include more factions....but as you already know....I am constrained. So please understand.

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My point was less HRE should or should not have control over all its lands as it was if they do then France certainly should. Im aware of the situation of the French Crown, but aside from Brittany, Normady, Flanders, and Burgundy, France should be excert control over its own territory. Otherwise the situation is again one that doesnt seem apealing gamewise.

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And my point is, its still a draft concept map. We are still adjusting things. I just hope people don't see it as FINAL MAP. So please, while I accept all feedback, just don't assume its a final map. I think it would be a good challenge to assert proper and direct control over France than just give them territories of their vassals. But it depends in the end on Ignoramus and his fuedalism idea. Like everything else, we are still changing.

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I meant in terms of factions. Again all rebel. People like factions. Fighting rebels gets dry and boring. Is there no faction that could be around tunisia or something?

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As I said before. Faction limitations. I'd like to add another Moorish faction, but I can't.

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To reply to that sugestion about 30 fact.
We don't know if there would be that many factions. So they are putting on map only those necsary that fit into what we know about faction number. If we find out when gam comes out that there is indeed f limit of 30 then aditional will be included. Untill then they go I think by RTW limit.

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:2thumbsup:

I would be the first one to add more factions. But until then, we wait.

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Will Venice be somehow represented?

(They began as the most western city of the Eastern Roman Empire, became a semi independent city state with control over the Balkans later and ended up as a completely independent city state.)

Which raises my next question: will the Silk road and more important the trade routes in the Med from and towards Venice be represented? I mean Venice being Europe's key to silk, spices and so on...

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Yep, its on the map, but you just have to zoom cos its small hehehe. :laugh4:

Hmmm interesting idea about the Silk Trade Route, I suppose when it comes to modding it, certain cities along the Slik Trade Route will recieve bonuses, Eg. Train merchants with bonus ability or something like that.

Venice controls Istria (joined to Venice, not by land but by province borders); Zara and Spalato at the beginning of the mod. I have to change ownership of Ragusa to Byzantines later.

As Venice you can conquer and limit yourself to islands and port enclaves should you decide to stay as a naval power.

If I recall the islands/enclaves you can conquer in the Mediterranean and Black Sea are:\
1) Chios - known for its valuable mastic, and worth a province in my opinon
2) Crete - good archers
3) Rhodes
4) Cyprus
5) Euboea or Negroponte
6) Peloponessus or Morea
7) Athens
8) Klimata, covers Cherson, Sudak, Caffa
9) Tmutarakan
10) Corsica
11) Sardinia
12) Balaerics
13) Sicily
14) Malta
15) Tunis
16) Tripoli
17) Acre
18) Genoa
19) Arles

Happy sailing and trading :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup:

I've always wanted to play as the Venetians

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I kinda covered myself on that one...

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hehe no probs. By the whats ur favourite faction?

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As I said before. Faction limitations. I'd like to add another Moorish faction, but I can't.

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This is more or less what I wanted to hear :). I understand you right now have the basic plan, but its good to hear that if possible you would be happy to add more factions in the areas I highlighted.

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And my point is, its still a draft concept map. We are still adjusting things. I just hope people don't see it as FINAL MAP. So please, while I accept all feedback, just don't assume its a final map. I think it would be a good challenge to assert proper and direct control over France than just give them territories of their vassals. But it depends in the end on Ignoramus and his fuedalism idea. Like everything else, we are still changing.

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Which is why im discussing, not crying. As this is not the final product I figured now is the time to offer my two cents. That being said you guys have been very good about responding to critisisms :)

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As Venice you can conquer and limit yourself to islands and port enclaves should you decide to stay as a naval power.

If I recall the islands/enclaves you can conquer in the Mediterranean and Black Sea are:\
1) Chios - known for its valuable mastic, and worth a province in my opinon
2) Crete - good archers
3) Rhodes
4) Cyprus
5) Euboea or Negroponte
6) Peloponessus or Morea
7) Athens
8) Klimata, covers Cherson, Sudak, Caffa
9) Tmutarakan
10) Corsica
11) Sardinia
12) Balaerics
13) Sicily
14) Malta
15) Tunis
16) Tripoli
17) Acre
18) Genoa
19) Arles

Happy sailing and trading

I've always wanted to play as the Venetians

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Now that sounds like an intresting faction indeed :)

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Originally Posted by kataphraktoi

Venice controls Istria (joined to Venice, not by land but by province borders); Zara and Spalato at the beginning of the mod. I have to change ownership of Ragusa to Byzantines later.

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What controled Venice is good question. As I know Dubrovnik/Ragusa was independent Republic and in 1062 they accepted Byzantine supremace, but Roman troops weren't never in town. So, Ragusa/Dubrovnik will be rebel town.

I will look for Zara/Zadar and Spalato/Split what status they had in 1062. Later they were under Venice noth.
Remember that Zara was sacked by Crusaders in November 1202. After that Zara became part of Venice. Probably Rebels, too.
Spalato/Split was took by Venice in 1420. Again Rebels, too.

Dalmatia (Zara and Split) were protectorates under Venice. Basil II bestowed upon the Doges of Venice responsibility for the Dalmatia. The question of Ragusa is harder.

Ragusa was an archontate before the 11th century with a small number of men (100 or so), but in 1062, there is a much more ambiguous situation, perhaps a slow move to independence, I will research this tomorrow as I came across it a few days ago. A history book on Serbia reveals conflicts between Serbs and Byzantines with evidence that Ragusa was under direct Byzantine control, I will check back tomorrow and post my findings

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Originally Posted by Woad Warrior

@ Orda Khan, Kataphrakoi, and especially Wraithdt - how on earth do you manage to draw concept art like that? Do you just use a standard pencil, read up on some info and then draw away? I've been trying to draw some concept art, have you got any tips, becuase those drawings are incredible!:2thumbsup:

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Speaking for myself, it's pencil work; I believe Wraithdt uses a palate (which I must look into due to the splendid finish achieved)
A while back, Duke John asked if I would colour the sketches I have done and I have completed 4 of them in water colours, so I will post them shortly. I am currently constructing a leather lamellar cuirass (very time consuming) so I am a little bogged down at the moment.
I have spent many years researching nomadic life on the steppe, the Mongols and Huns in particular. Historical accounts and pictures help and archaeological finds add invaluable information. Of course, when trying to achieve historical accuracy, nobody can claim to be 100% spot on the best we can do is form a picture from the evidence before us.
Good luck with the concepts

.......Orda

shOW us a pic of u in lamellar one day won't u? :2thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by kataphraktoi

Dalmatia (Zara and Split) were protectorates under Venice. Basil II bestowed upon the Doges of Venice responsibility for the Dalmatia. The question of Ragusa is harder.

Ragusa was an archontate before the 11th century with a small number of men (100 or so), but in 1062, there is a much more ambiguous situation, perhaps a slow move to independence, I will research this tomorrow as I came across it a few days ago. A history book on Serbia reveals conflicts between Serbs and Byzantines with evidence that Ragusa was under direct Byzantine control, I will check back tomorrow and post my findings

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About Dubrovnik - in 1062 town was under Byzantium protection. And I will also look for true. http://www.hostkingdom.net/westbalk.html#Ragusa

Venice had control of Zadar and Split only on paper, especially Zadar. Reality was different. And that I will check.http://smiles.zy.cz/230.gif

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Originally Posted by King of Atlantis

Well if there is really a 30 faction limit like they said why not make Coroboda a faction? I just think factions are funnier to fight than rebels and a spain filled with rebels, dispite how strong they may be would be kinda boring.

I meant in terms of factions. Again all rebel. People like factions. Fighting rebels gets dry and boring. Is there no faction that could be around tunisia or something?

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Taifa kingdoms will be represented realistic as much as possible (we don’t know limits of m2 tw until game come in market). There were several strong emirates in Al-Andalus after death of Umayyad Caliph al-Muzaffar in 1008. Those emirates were divided between Arabs, Berbers and Slavs. Arabs held the most of Al-Andalus, Berbers were located in the south of Iberia and Slavs held eastern parts. Slavs were the weakest and they survived longest in Baleares (Emirate of Mallorca from 1076) until 1114 when famous Emir Mubākir ibn Suläymān was killed. He made in Baleares a strong pirate base from 1093 to 1114 when united fleets and armies of Pisa, Catalonia, Narbonne and Montpellier led by Count Ramon Berengar III occupied the island and killed him. Mubākir was the last Slavic emir. Next year (1115) Murabitin (Almoravid) fleet took Baleares from Christians.
You may know guess that Baleares will be strong pirate island… http://smiles.zy.cz/481.gif

Conclusion - expect at least strong rebels in Al-Andalus, as we don’t know how much slots will be in the game.

If there will be 30 free slots, then I can bet that Cumans will be faction.http://smiles.zy.cz/174.gif

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About Dubrovnik - in 1062 town was under Byzantium protection. And I will also look for true. http://www.hostkingdom.net/westbalk.html#Ragusa

Venice had control of Zadar and Split only on paper, especially Zadar. Reality was different. And that I will check.

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Today I consulted three sources, two Byzantine and one Serbia and found the following.

Dubrovnik was indeed under Byzantine protection, but it was a combination of direct and autonmous control without being a protectorate.

Dubrovnik was the seat of a strategos...but not a regular garisson which suggests that local resources were deployed from Dubrovnik and not Constantinople.

Dubrovnik was first included in the theme of Dalmatia by Basil I, level of control was still local but it was part of the Byzantine administrative system since it was part of a theme. The theme of Dalmatia came under Venetian sovereignty when Basil II granted the title Dux Dalmatiae to the Venetians, however, it seems to have effectively covered Zara and Spalato since Dubrovnik was under Byzantine influence and local control until the Normans seized it in 1081, whereby it was seized back by Alexius I Comnenus.

I'd still say Dubrovnik should be under Byzantine control was it was under direct (with strong local autonomous) control under a Byzantine strategos. However, forces guarding the city should unique and not composed of Byzantine soldiers.

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Taifa kingdoms will be represented realistic as much as possible (we don’t know limits of m2 tw until game come in market). There were several strong emirates in Al-Andalus after death of Umayyad Caliph al-Muzaffar in 1008. Those emirates were divided between Arabs, Berbers and Slavs. Arabs held the most of Al-Andalus, Berbers were located in the south of Iberia and Slavs held eastern parts. Slavs were the weakest and they survived longest in Baleares (Emirate of Mallorca from 1076) until 1114 when famous Emir Mubākir ibn Suläymān was killed. He made in Baleares a strong pirate base from 1093 to 1114 when united fleets and armies of Pisa, Catalonia, Narbonne and Montpellier led by Count Ramon Berengar III occupied the island and killed him. Mubākir was the last Slavic emir. Next year (1115) Murabitin (Almoravid) fleet took Baleares from Christians.
You may know guess that Baleares will be strong pirate island…

Conclusion - expect at least strong rebels in Al-Andalus, as we don’t know how much slots will be in the game.

If there will be 30 free slots, then I can bet that Cumans will be faction

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yep agreed, under MTR, rebels will be portrayed more as independent factions with their own unqiue character in the province they are in.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Woad Warrior

@ Orda Khan, Kataphrakoi, and especially Wraithdt - how on earth do you manage to draw concept art like that? Do you just use a standard pencil, read up on some info and then draw away? I've been trying to draw some concept art, have you got any tips, becuase those drawings are incredible!:2thumbsup:

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Just wanted to drop in to say Hi to you guys just so you know I'm not dead. I've busy with work and other stuff lately so I rarely have time to do new sketches. Look out for a new Gothic Foot Knight in glorious colour some time soon.

Woad Warrior: I do lotsa personal research and reading into the subject and then I start conceptualizing. It really helps if you can get visual references; I highly recommend the Osprey military books as they are beautifully illustrated and contain many photos as well. When I draw I sometimes use the good ol pencil but mostly I'm more comfartable with a wacom tablet as it allows me me to draw straight into the computer using photoshop. Its alot more convinient that way.

Sorry for double posting but I couldn't edit my previous post. No idea why.

Anyway I forgot the say thanks to you guys for the compliments. I appreciate it.

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Originally Posted by DukeofSerbia

Taifa kingdoms will be represented realistic as much as possible (we don’t know limits of m2 tw until game come in market). There were several strong emirates in Al-Andalus after death of Umayyad Caliph al-Muzaffar in 1008. Those emirates were divided between Arabs, Berbers and Slavs. Arabs held the most of Al-Andalus, Berbers were located in the south of Iberia and Slavs held eastern parts. Slavs were the weakest and they survived longest in Baleares (Emirate of Mallorca from 1076) until 1114 when famous Emir Mubākir ibn Suläymān was killed. He made in Baleares a strong pirate base from 1093 to 1114 when united fleets and armies of Pisa, Catalonia, Narbonne and Montpellier led by Count Ramon Berengar III occupied the island and killed him. Mubākir was the last Slavic emir. Next year (1115) Murabitin (Almoravid) fleet took Baleares from Christians.
You may know guess that Baleares will be strong pirate island… http://smiles.zy.cz/481.gif

Conclusion - expect at least strong rebels in Al-Andalus, as we don’t know how much slots will be in the game.

If there will be 30 free slots, then I can bet that Cumans will be faction.http://smiles.zy.cz/174.gif

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SLAVS?! WTF? Since when were there Slavs in Spain?!:inquisitive: EDIT:Okey I checked Wiki seems these "Saqaliba" were mercs in the service of the Umayyads who set up emirates in Spain. Heh, yah learn something new every day!

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SLAVS?! WTF? Since when were there Slavs in Spain?! EDIT:Okey I checked Wiki seems these "Saqaliba" were mercs in the service of the Umayyads who set up emirates in Spain. Heh, yah learn something new every day!

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Yep, we try to uncover all the little things :2thumbsup: The more obscure the better hehe.

You know of any other unique phenomena in the Muslim factions?

There were also Slavs who assimilated in Syria as well.

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Originally Posted by Trajen the 1st

SLAVS?! WTF? Since when were there Slavs in Spain?!:inquisitive: EDIT:Okey I checked Wiki seems these "Saqaliba" were mercs in the service of the Umayyads who set up emirates in Spain. Heh, yah learn something new every day!

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Wikipedia is not good for searching history as Wiki in not primary source (everybody can write what he want and then interpret that).

Primary sources about Slavs in Iberian pininsula are like Abū l 'Abbās al Maqqarī "Nafh at tīb min ghusn al Andalus" from XI century etc (little secret are others).

Plus, Francis Conte (professeur à l'Université de Paris-Sorbonne) wrote excellent book Les Slaves -Aux origines des civilisations d'Europe centrale et orientale (VI-XIII siècles).

It will be more suprises...:2thumbsup:

P.S.
Slavs weren't only excellent mercenaries, they were also poets, teachers, eunchs, viziers etc in Al-Andalus.

There were also Slavs in the service of the Fatimids...

Ive done more research on Zara and Split and it seems that Venice has difficulty in forcing its protectorate over Zara and Split despite being given the Ducate of Dalmatia :laugh4: In 1062, there was resistance to a Venetian fleet in Zara....so we know its a grey era of control/loss/control and even more ambiguity. But this means to me that Venice has no effective control over Zara and it seems Split as well. Venice will have to reinforce its Ducate starting from 1062. No soup for you Venetians :laugh4:

Well, at least, u get to send a fleet and start ur maritime empire eh???

:2thumbsup:

Show no MERCY ME HEARTIES!!

Ive done more research on Zara and Split and it seems that Venice has difficulty in forcing its protectorate over Zara and Split despite being given the Ducate of Dalmatia :laugh4: In 1062, there was resistance to a Venetian fleet in Zara....so we know its a grey era of control/loss/control and even more ambiguity. But this means to me that Venice has no effective control over Zara and it seems Split as well. Venice will have to reinforce its Ducate starting from 1062. No soup for you Venetians :laugh4:

Well, at least, u get to send a fleet and start ur maritime empire eh???

:2thumbsup:

Show no MERCY ME HEARTIES!!

What I said about Zara and Spaleto? Zara was sacked by Crusaders in 1202 as town refused to accept Venetian supremacy. Several years before that Zara's fleet destroyed large Venitian fleet in gulf of Tarent or ?

P.S.
Open your e-mail. And you doubled posted.

I can be Seljuk-Ottoman researcher. I did it before and quite frankly, even the Ottoman flag used in the game is utter rubbish. Turkic faction has all to reasearch for.

Check revised map in first post :2thumbsup:\

or here!

https://img136.imageshack.us/img136/...isedks2.th.jpg

Ah darn it. Keep forgettin...Dang.

Just one question. Where did Serbia go? Or is it representated by that litle province encircling Dubrovnik?

And your first link is wrong. Remove the damn .th from it.

Serbia is represented by the Dioclea (Duklje) region, I'm waiting from DukeofSerbia to confirm if Raska/Rascia and Duklje were under the same ruler or not, Dubrovnik was under a Byzantine Strategos but not quite directly under control of Constantinople, nor independent either.

Hopefully Cebei can tell me what territory the Seljukids controlled in 1062.

Notes on changes:
Added provinces:
Tbilisi
Aragon
Western Sahara

Proposed future changes:
More islands..but not as provinces.

These maps are still in the "process".

Just a humnle suggestion of mine: If there indeed is going to be possible to have 30 factions I think an interesting faction to add could be the Abbasid Caliphate of Baghdad, yeah I know at the start date they were pawns to the Seljuqs (who nonetheless treated them with respect and gave them an illusion of power), but during the 12th century they were practically independent until they were destroyed by the Mongols in the 13th century that is. Even though they were historically confined to a small territory they have a few interesting sides, the Futtuwa code (which was nearly like the chivalric code in Europe, though with much more emphasis on religious zeal I think) developed there and the Abbasids were also terrorized by the Assasins' sect (who would be very fun to include one way or another)...

I've read recent reviews and the developers keep talking about 17 playable and 4 unplayable factions, which means 21 factions. Darn it. :embarassed:

But if there is indeed 30 faction slots, we will consider a lot of things. :2thumbsup:

I would like a Hashashin faction too!!

I would have liked more pagan factions actually like the Qipchaks, Patzinaks, etc, etc....

Well, I remember reading on the .com forums a little while back that they were considering raising the faction limit to 30...

I believe kataphraktoi is referring to this - rather more recent - developer interview.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=67314

I don't really think there would be scope for more factions at this point (unless there are going to be empty slots left open for modding).

As it is, 17 playable factions and 4 unplayable (most likely rebels, Papal States and the two Native American factions).

Research Template (Organising Research Data):
You guys can be as detailed possible, theres no rush! MTW2 isn’t out yet, so you have like 6 months to research it!! Have fun!! And remember, small things matter too!

SYMBOL /FLAG of FACTION:

1) NAME OF RESEARCHER: Eg. Supamurat

2) FACTION: Eg. Danes

3) INTRODUCTION TO FACTION:
Eg. The ferocious northmen have been tamed by Christianity. Now they uphold the name of Christ as a Christian Kingdom…etc,etc. The year is 1062.…etc, etc.

4) PROVINCES:
Check my map to see which ones your faction can claim in the year 1062. I'm still making changes, but the provinces were pretty much as they are now. I will notify of any province border changes, but highly unlikely from this poiint on.
Province Name: Eg. Thrace
Capital of Province: Eg. Adrianople (Edirne) If possible, state alternative name as well
Description of province: Eg. Flat featureless plain, good for farming but exposed to enemy attacks.
Tradeable products from province: Wheat
Raw resources from province: eg. Gold

5) MILITARY UNITS:
Remember the mod goes from 1062 to 1453, so unit list must cover this range!!
Name of military unit (if possible, name of unit in native tongue of faction):
Description of military unit:
Unit Type: Describe as either
- LIGHT INFANTRY
- MEDIUM INFANTRY
- HEAVY INFANTRY
- MISSILE INFANTRY
- MISSILE CAVALRY
- LIGHT CAVALRY
- MEDIUM CAVALRY
- HEAVY CAVALRY
- SUPER HEAVY CAVALRY
- ARTILLERY
- GUNPOWDER
Estimated Combat Characteristics
Melee Attack: Rate out of 10
Defence: Rate out of 10
Charge: Describe as either WEAK/MEDIUM/STRONG/IRRESISTIBLE
Armour:
Melee Weapons:
Missile Weapons:
Defensive Panoply:
Speed:
Morale
Discipline:
Notable abilities:

Example of a military unit:
Name of military unit: Klibanophori; Singular Klibanophoros
Description of military unit: A renaissance of the Late Roman Clibanarii, the Klibanophori was re-introduced by Nikephoros Phokas who..etc,etc
Unit Type: SUPER HEAVY CAVALRY
Estimated Combat Characteristics:
Melee Attack: 8
Defence: 8
Charge: MEDIUM
Armour: Lamellar, Mail, Padded Epilorikon
Weapons: Mace, Lance
Missile Weapons: Javelins
Defensive panoply: Small shield
Speed: Slow
Morale: Very good
Discipline: Excellent Discipline
Notable abilities:
Can form wedge
Can fire javelins before charge

6) CULTURE OF THE FACTION:
I’ll leave it at your discretion as to what you consider culture, but it should at minimum discuss religion…although I’d like someone to mention FOOD!!

7) FAMOUS FIGURES:
Famous people in your faction from 1062 - 1453
Don’t limit yourself to just military figures!
It could be:
- Religious figures
- Statesmen
- Poets
- Artists

8) FAMOUS BUILDINGS:
Very obvious - famous buildings. Eg. Hagia Sophia

9) FAMOUS ACHIEVEMENTS OF THE FACTION:
Eg. Seljukids famous for tile work, etc, etc

10) ADDITIONAL INFORMATION OF INTEREST:
- Famous qoutes
- Poems
- Famous Documents

Here is the skeleton TEMPLATE: :2thumbsup:

SYMBOL /FLAG of FACTION:

1) NAME OF RESEARCHER:

2) FACTION:

3) INTRODUCTION TO FACTION:

4) PROVINCES:
Province Name:
Capital of Province:
Description of province:
Tradeable products from province:
Raw resources from province:

5) MILITARY UNITS:
Name of military unit:
Description of military unit:
Unit Type:
Estimated Combat Characteristics
Melee Attack:
Defence:
Charge:
Armour:
Melee Weapons:
Missile Weapons:
Defensive Panoply:
Speed:
Morale
Discipline:
Notable abilities:

6) CULTURE OF THE FACTION:

7) FAMOUS FIGURES:

8) FAMOUS BUILDINGS:

9) FAMOUS ACHIEVEMENTS OF THE FACTION:

10) ADDITIONAL INFORMATION OF INTEREST: