The Will of the Senate - Senate Deliberations III

[Braden]

I also cannot see a victory in the East if by “victory” you mean the destruction of Selucia. Such a victory I do not see for many, many years.

We can attain victory though if a “victory” consists of preventing our lands from being pillaged by the Selucids, we must ensure we have sufficient manpower to repel the Selucids then we can see what manpower we can bring to bare against Carthage.

Like you, and indeed the new Consul, I acknowledge that Carthage is a great threat and must be dealt with completely. However, don’t believe we have sufficient men to man such an expedition.

Granted, perhaps the out-going Consul has played up our “lack of funds” a little but with very nessassary building projects going unstarted because we only have a surplus of 10,000 denarii each season we cannot afford the required funds for a conquest of Carthage.

No matter what funds it will provide us, the simple fact is that if we are to keep our cities free from open Revolt then we have to invest in them and if we do this we do not have enough funds to raise the troops that would be required for a proper invasion of Carthage.

Suffice to say Senator Lucius, that all we can afford at this time is only the expeditionary invasion of Afrika. Truth is, it pains me as well but it is all we can achieve for now.

We do not need to withdraw from the East, all we need is time to assemble a properly formed invasion force.

I am glad that you have retained your good humour with regards the other peoples of the world though, even at my age I have long since lost all hope that ANY would forge an alliance with us.

I have also noted a great many brigand warbands mentioned to me by the couriers and second your call for someone to deal with them with urgency for they will be having a very great effect on our revenue.

As for my Grandfather, I am shocked at the derision spoken by you. Certainly you cannot compare the Republic at its beginning to what it is today and hence I am surprised that a man of such age and wisdom as you would attempt to do so.

Grandfather, the Republic has grown to such an extent since Quintus’s time. Pyrrhus was but one enemy, the only one we had on that day, now we have many enemies and a great many number of cities to run and citizens to please. If you inflate the “crisis” of that time and compare them fairly I am sure you will appreciate that our troubles now are at least equal to those times whilst being perhaps too abstract to appreciate fully.

And rest assured, Quintus’s deeds are well counted in the Academes’ and his actions are counted high above with those of Romulus even. He is still held in awe by the students and his tactics taught with vigour.

[Lucjan]

A messenger enters the senate floor and proudly presents a package to Servius's clerk. Opening it, the clerk smiles broadly and begins, enthusiastically, to adress the senate.

"Senators! I am proud to present you with the first message from our consul abroad!

Senators,
I am deeply gratified to hear of your choice to elect me as the next consul. You all have my promise, these next five years will be ones of a powerful resurgance in Roman might. Not just militarily either, no. These last few years have been hard on Roman coffers and our favor in the eyes of the gods. But Rome will become rich again, and the gods will see the folly in their brief divergance from Roman support.

I'm sure you have already determined, judging from this letter and my knowledge of the consular election results, that Lepcis Magna has fallen. And your assumptions would be correct. Though not large enough of an endeavour to really merit a battle report for our tactical libraries, I will provide a brief summary of the expedition.

We landed at midday on the shores just west of the city, the fleet given orders to head to port and blockade it so that there would be no escapees by way of the sea, we waited out the greater portion of the day, and were able to procure the services of some numidians discontented by Carthy rule for a small sum. Skirmishers, but useful none the less. With the city's meager defences concentrated on calming the citizenry's panic over the blockade, we were able to approach the city from the rear of their governmental building. When nightfall came around, while the bulk of our formation waited in columns at the outskirts of the city, our funditores drew the patrolling punic skirmishers away from the city. I took charge to their rear before they could get within range of our men, and our new Numidian friends hurled their javelins into their backsides. They took flight, we took chase...and we were left with the simple matter of dealing with the Libyan spearmen still left in the center of the city. The numidians took one street, our velites and samnites took the other, surrounding the spearmen they performed magnificently. Whenever the spearmen presented their backs to either group they were met with a volley, and whenever they got too close, our skirmishers took to fleet of foot and outran them in the opposite direction.

Needless to say, after all was done, Lepcis Magna now lay in our hands, we have culled nearly 4,500 slaves from its population, and..oh, yes. The casualty report. Here it is.


As you can see, if Mars continues to hold us in such high favor as he has done today, the future is bright indeed.

As for other things. The Iberian army in the Alpine Pass has been blocked by our forces, should they wish for war, they will be sorely punished, and if they back down, then we can only hope that their prudence continues to outweigh greed, and, honestly, stupidity. I have already ordered the immediate initiation of extensive building projects throughout the Greco-Macedonian regions and have begun to restructure and reorganise the tactical mess we seem to have gotten ourself into, I will go into more detail when this has been completed.

For now, things are beginning to look up, and I hope the future holds the fruits of prosperous days for all of Rome.

In nomini Roma, et pro totus doxa deum.
Consul Servius Aemilius"

The clerk looks out amongst the senators and smiles.

[Death the destroyer of worlds]

I think I speak for all the senate when I congratulate my grandson on this excellent beginning of his consulship.
I beg the consul however, pray tell us if you made sure all the slaves ended up in the cities that most need the population, and not in Corinth, Athens and so forth ?

[Lucjan]

(OOC - I thought I moved everybody unnecessary out, but I guess I missed Athens...)

[Braden]

Congratulations and I hope the others in my family will join me in this sentiment. A good start to your Consulship indeed.

[Braden]

I am apparently the first to congratulate our forces on their destruction of the Thracian horde. Proof again, if more was needed, that our armed forces are capable of amazing feats of heroics and skill.

I am told that soon I shall depart these shores. I cannot say to where though, but tonight I shall pray to Mars and Jupiter for my safe journey and that I may perform my duties well for the Republic.

[Lucjan]

Servius's clerk nods.
I'm sure, were he here, the consul would wish you the best in your expedition senator. It is my understanding also that we are soon to hear word of the east, and the situation that is being resolved as we speak.

[Lucjan]

Servius's clerk, who shall hereby be known as UPS Maximus, prepares to adress the senate again.

Senators, I have been told to present to you the current state of affairs in the east. The messengers report that just days ago senator Numerious Aureolus, as per the consul's strategy, struck a resounding victory at Maronia, retaking the town from the Seleucid occupation force, and securing the local population through simple occupation. Further more, I am to reveal the situation there now for the senate's discussion.


As you can see, senator Aureolus's victory at Maronia was a strong success.

Senator Coruncanius, north of Maronia, has been asked to deliver the central Seleucid forces there to an early grave. An order for a night attack on the main contingent has been ordered, so as to catch the larger army off guard and prevent them from acquiring reinforcements. The outcome of this battle will determine our next immediate move in the east. But we feel we can rest assured that senator Coruncanius will secure a victory in the name of Rome. In which case he will continue immediately west to crush the smaller army, and senator Aureolus will launch an attack from Maronia to push the last Seleucid army into the cold waters of the straits.

We expect the Thracian army to the north may launch an attack on Tylis or Debeltos, but Tylis should be able to be easily defended by senator Saturninus, and Debeltos would be swiftly retaken.

We are awaiting further news from the front, but we have certainly left our prayers to Mars for good fortune.

[GeneralHankerchief]

My congratulations to Praetor Tiberius Coruncanius on his impressive victory against the Seleucids.

May they take the hint and leave us alone!

[Mount Suribachi]

I doubt that Senator. Their lands are vast and their manpower is endless. we shall see these battles for many seasons to come.

Nevertheless, I must congratulate Tiberius Coruncanius and Numerius Aureolus on their fine victories.

[Lucjan]

UPS Maximus receives another letter from the consul.

Senators! More news from the consul!

"Senators,

I am pleased to hear of our victories in the east over the Seleucids. Slightly disappointed that one of their armies found it better to flee than fight, but such cowards will be dealt with in due time.

I am currently preparing for an expedition of my own in the west. After further assessment of the situation, I have determined that it would, in fact, be detrimental to our campaign in Afrika to allow the army led by Celeas Abderas and Mobilkar the Mad to exist for one more season. The smaller contingents surrounding him, while easily defeated one at a time with Celeas gone, would provide a much more difficult opponent if allowed to group and fought in unison with or directly following a battle with the main Carthy army.
So the plan is to strike at the carthy heart, then break the limbs as they come down one by one.

I shall send word of the expedition soon."

(OOC - Having some minor computer problems. I've solved the problem, but unforetunatly it involved wiping my entire computer, so I'm in the process of redownloading all the mods and glueing them back together. If all goes well, I'll be up and ready to go within the next 2 hours. If not, I need to try the multi-part zip.

Do not worry! This will not interfere with the flow of the game! If I can't get it up and running within the next two hours, Quintus Libo will be given the order to march, and the game will progress regardless, while I hammer out the minor details with the re-install.)

[Death the destroyer of worlds]

First consul,

As your army is already invading the Cartheginian heartland, I can't help but wonder what has happened to the Consular Army, which was ready to invade from Sicily ? Do you want to deny your brother Marcellus his part of the glory and conquer Carthage singlehandedly ?
Those who the gods would destroy, they first make proud.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Uncle, darnit. So I have even more authority over him than I would as brother.

[Lucjan]

UPS Maximus - Senator Lucius, you are mistaken. It was made very clear that the conquest of Carthage would not begin for at least a year and a half past the first consul's election. What is occuring now is the necessary whiddling down of Carthage's military might. Consul Servius is by no means moving north in an attempt to conquer Carthaginian territory. He is taking advantage of a strategically sound position to pull Carthage's brazen and unprepared armies south, where they will be broken one by one. Marcellus and Flavius Pacuvius, will, within a year and a half's time, be landing on the shores of Carthage to begin the actual conquest.

As for the consular army, Manius Coruncanius is ready to embark to the east, where it is more immediately needed.

As for the gods, the only pride I have seen from the consul is pride to be fighting in Mars name, and for the good of the Republic, for the advancement of our people. I see no personal issues clouding his judgement. Perhaps you should read the second half of the first consular report, updated just recently. There, the consul speaks of passion, and may I note, at the end of every journal entry. He writes "in nomini roma, et pro totus doxa deum." (In the name of Rome, and for all the glory of the gods.)

You should know your grandson better than anyone Lucius.

[Death the destroyer of worlds]

As I feared, the endless battles in the east are drawing your attention away from the core issue, the conquest of Carthage. I think it is a mistake to send the consular army to the east instead of the south. In your position, I would leave the east to its own devices and send all available troops southwards.
Nevertheless, I lack access to all the tactical information and am confident the first consul has made a sound decision.

[Braden]

Senator Lucius Aemilius,

I would perhaps believe that my Grandfather and Senator Numerius Aureolus would have a much different view of that situation. They face the full force of the Selucid Kingdom with only a Legion each, no Senator, I am needed elsewhere.

The Consul is not being distracted, how could he be? He, himself, is fighting in Afrika…surely his thoughts are more there than anywhere else.

I have great confidence in the plans the Consul has, there will be an Invasion of Afrika and the conquest of Carthage, but in a proper manner where the Mothers of our Republic do not weep for too many lost sons of Mars.

[econ21]

NUMERIUS AUREOLUS: I wonder if the First Consul could inform the Senate on his grand strategic thinking at the moment? Some of his actions have been unexpected given the discussions in the last Senate session. For example:

1) Our occupation of Viberi appears to be permanent - what are the Consul's intentions regarding the remaining Thracian settlements?

2) Our response to the Seleucid incursions into Europe have been more vigorous than I anticipated. What is to be our next move in the east?

3) The advance from Lepcis Magna has also been a surprisingly aggressive move. What will be the next move of the Consul's own army?

4) The news that the Consular army is bound for the east, not Afrika, is unexpected. What is it to be tasked with?

I list these instances not to complain - many of these surprises are welcome ones, but they are still surprises and I would be grateful to learn of the Consul's thinking.

[Braden]

Whilst I am privy to most of what the Consul plans for the near future and have many of the answers to the questions you ask, I would not presume to speak for the Consul but I will provide you with some form of answer for your question regarding the Consuls own incursion into Afrika.

He did not intend his incursion to have this “aggressive” turn, however, he has acted in the manner of bringing the battle to the enemy and ensuring he fights the battles HE wants to fight and where HE wants to fight them. This is exceptional tactical prudence as I am sure you can appreciate.

He has managed to destroy a weak Carthaginian army and a Consular sized one for very little loss to his Roman and Italian Troops. He is perhaps in as better condition than any of us had hoped because of his swift action there. He never pretended that he would be able to take on the full might of Carthage alone, and has never intended to do so but, as I have noted from his style of leadership, he will certainly push the issue as far as is humanly possible.

If Mars smiles upon him he may be fortunate enough to either decimate or destroy a further two Consular sized formations, provided he can isolate them in turn, and this would allow our full Invasion to progress far more swiftly and efficiently when it comes.

I know the task that the Consul has presented with me and granted me this Consular army with to perform. I am not at liberty to advise you of that task, but I am sure you will approve of its nature.

That is, of course, always assuming nothing changes in that time. As we all know, often the enemy are rude enough to not play by our battle plans and we are forced to change ours.

[Lucjan]

UPS Maximus - Firstly, I would like to say that any plan can be set in stone, but when you try to move ahead with that plan, that stone, there are any number of obstacles in your way which can force you to rethink your plan. Many of you should all understand this full well, as it applies to the battlefield as well. Even the best laid plans, against an equally clever foe, only last until the beginning of the first engagement.

With that in mind, I can provide you with the answers you seek.

Firstly, we never intended to permanently occupy Viberi. Before anybody else brings it up, the consul did not vote in favor of the motion to give it away to anybody who would take it, because this would involve giving it back to thrace, or potentially to Iberia, which would completely defeat the purpose of taking it from Thrace to begin with. In that respect, the only neighbor we could find who was actually willing to take it was Iberia. The consul, finding it better not to completely abandon our German allies to becoming an island amongst the Iberian sea, felt compelled to garrison the settlement instead. This act may be temporary, it may be permanent. With this issue, it is still too early to tell. For now, however, it has provided Senator Quintus Libo with a place to fall back on should Thrace counter his incursion with unexpected force. A judgement shall be passed on the remaining Thracian settlements when the consul feels the bulk of the Thracian military might has been lain to waste through our cross border incursions.

As for the Seleucids. The whole of the senate seems to be surprised by the swiftness with which we have dealt the Seleucids a serious, early blow. Within a single seasons time we have eradicated three large Seleucid armies, killed numerous high ranking Seleucid generals, and pushed a fourth army and its young commander back across the straits. This is all thanks to the battle tactics of senators Tiberius Coruncanius and Numerious Aureolus, and the campaign strategy of the consul himself. Without the three collaberating the way they had, the situation in the east could have been something that the near future would not be able to reverse. Our next move, as things stand at the moment, is to wait for the Seleucids to make a move. We are predicting a siege of Byzantium, and possibly the withdrawn army crossing the straits once again, this time under the command of the Seleucid Beast, Molon, to either take Maronia again, or confront senator Aureolus on the field. We will decide further what course to take when we see what they actually decide to do.

As he has done this autumn, the senator will rely on the information relayed to us by our spy in Afrika to determine the best course of action, if he must fall back and await a better oppertunity to strike against the Carthaginian armies, he will do so. If there is a strong oppertunity to isolate and envelope one without putting himself in unneccessary, deadly danger, it will be done.

The Consular army headed for the east under the command of Manius Coruncanius is to land at Maronia, enter a debriefing with senator Numerious Aureolus, who will by then be well informed of his next set of orders, and proceed from there. We cannot set a definate, direct goal until we see the situation in the theatre at that time.

This senate has a horrible tendency of setting specific, unflexible goals without taking into consideration the fact that all situations change. The consul realises that nothing stays the same season by season, and everything must be taken in stride. There are some generalised goals everywhere. Stabilise the east, conquer Carthage, fend of Thrace, maintain peace with Iberia. How, exactly, these things are to be done when the time comes can only be determined by the circumstances of the moment.

If the consul were to say now, the consular army heading east is to do this, this and this, then when we arrive, the situation is completely different and those things are not within our best interest, then it is much more difficult to alter the plan without looking unreliable, than if we allow ourselves the leway to deal with moments as they come.

I hope I have answered all these questions, and, if there are more, will be glad to offer whatever knowledge I may.

[Mount Suribachi]

If the consul were to say now, the consular army heading east is to do this, this and this, then when we arrive, the situation is completely different and those things are not within our best interest, then it is much more difficult to alter the plan without looking unreliable, than if we allow ourselves the leway to deal with moments as they come.

Forgive me Consul, but some might say that you are being driven by events, rather than driving them yourself. A more critical man might even say that you do not know what your own intentions are.

[Braden]

Beg your pardon Senator Paullus but isn’t the very essence of defending our borders as the Senate requires, RE-Active rather than PRO-Active?

In the East we must wait to see if the bloody nose we have given the Selucids deters them from further incursions, we have no mandate from the Senate beyond this other than to re-enforce and ensure they no longer can lay claim to our cities or walk un-contested in their streets.

Are you suggesting we take a more pro-active approach as we are doing in Afrika perhaps?

I believe the Motions passed last session prohibited further expansion in Europe also, so does this not answer the Question of Thrace? The Senate has basically instructed that our offensive ceases with them hasn’t it?

Does this also appear “event driven” to you Senator rather than the other way round?

Do not forget the Consul is bound as much as he can to fulfil the Motions the Senate has presented to him.

An invasion of Afrika and therefore Carthage was permitted……further than that is dependant on the actions of the other states around us rather than dictated by ourselves at this time as no approval was given from the Senate for other offensive actions.

But that would certainly not preclude any offensive actions where ever they are deemed as required to defend our cities as per one of our first Motions.

[Lucjan]

(OOC - Just to clear something up, because I think there might be a little confusion. UPS Maximus is Servius's freeman clerk, speaking for him in the senate while Servius himself is away on campaign. Most of what is said is the clerk's interpretation of Servius's feelings, not necessarily the precise thing. Servius's exact feelings can be seen in the consular reports, battle reports, and when UPS informs the senate that "a message from the consul has arrive". Just clearing up some confusion. )


UPS Maximus - Then some may clearly be incapable of seeing the prudence in patience. A goal must be set, but the path to it must be flexible, otherwise you walk straight into a brash, unnecessary defeat.

Look at the situation like this senator Paullus. If I am a cat and you are a mouse, and there is a piece of cheese in the center of the floor. Do you brazenly rush from your hiding place, as I sit beside the cheese, and hope to the gods I do not catch you? Or do you wait for me to go away, biding your time for the perfect oppertunity to strike and return home unharmed? The situation is that simple. Such brazen acts, charging in without truly knowing the gravity of the situation, cost us two co consuls in the last consulship. Able, cunning, and valuable men to the Republic, lost because they were not properly informed of the whole state of affairs. They did their duty to Rome, and they payed the ultimate price for it. Consul Servius would prefer the alternative. As we have already seen, his tactics have worked superbly thus far, based on reliable intelligence, co-operation and prudent, patient planning. Would you have us do the opposite, and rush in swords drawn and blind? I would not, nor does the consul. Strategy, patience, and guile. These are the practices that win wars, and these are the practices this consul employs.

Further more, a "more critical man" may also be unable to tell the difference between his ass and a hole in the ground, provided they're roughly the same size, shape, and he can fit his head equally well in both of them. The consul knows exactly what his intentions are. But as it has already been said, the path must be flexible. We have a present state, and we have a future goal, but the time in between these two points will be wrought with change and unexpected events that must be worked around to secure a proper victory, a proper achievement of our goal. Think of it as a river senator. Have you ever seen a river flow completely straight from its source to its mouth? No, rivers wind and bend, and weave for a great length before they spill into the sea, because the river knows it is much easier to wind around the hill than to try to plow straight through it. It is logic, it is flexibility. The Republic, right now, is like a river. The question is, would you rather us take our victories and our goals in stride so that we can reach our golden goal and claim victory over adversity? Or would you have us dash ourselves upon every rock we encounter, until the waters of the Republic are so splintered and broken, that they are merely absorbed once more into the ground, and its very existance is forgotten with the passage of time?

I, for one, choose victory. Flexibility, patience, strategy, guile, wisdom, and daring. These are the virtues our first consul has chosen to exhibit. Let me ask you all, especially senators Aureolus and Coruncanius, whose own tactical prowess in battle have brought them great, resounding victories when used in compliance with our consul's strategy. Could the strategy of any other man have repulsed the Seleucids entirely from Roman lands in a single season's time?

Anything else senator Paullus?

[Glaucus]

Senators, I speak before you. I have rarely done so before, so that I am speaking at all must let you know the gravity of the situation. I know that most senators here are cought up between the eastern and western fronts, but you may have forgotten the still-active north front. Thrace is far from defeated. There are 2 legion sized forces in the south of her lands, within a few seasons march from undefended roman settlements. Not to mention the near-consular sized army in the north. I, Quintus Libo, command only a small, understrength legion, yet the consul has made it clear that he intends to set me up against a force twice my size. I know that in the past I have shown my prowess as a general, (38-1 kill-lose ratio at last count, yes thank you) but all you have seen of me is fighting forces who at most have 200 more men then I, and no general. If you send me against a larger force headed by the overlord of thrace with many of his son's bodyguards present... you may not be pleased with the results. I do not ask for more soldiers, I ask that we revise our policy concerning the northern front. We are in a multi-front war right now because we overexpanded. The last thing on the senate's mind right now should be taking more land. Please do not send me against the collosal thracian horde, I am too young to die! Let me instead pick apart any smaller groups of thracians, let me lie in ambush for them, let me fight on my terms. "The only thing worse then no battle is a battle lost". If you send the Germanic Legion at the Thracian heart, we will all die. If you let us fall back and take it slower, we will win in the end.

[Lucjan]

There is a look of severe confusion on UPS's face.

Your navigators are quite confused senator. You are, indeed marching in the completely opposite direction you claim to be. And I have never stated that you would embark on such an expedition. That would be reckless, unnecessary, and certainly no order given by consul Servius. Actually, I would like to see documentation proving that I specifically said the consul gave such an order.

What I did say, was that you, and others, would be used to attack Thracian forces in Thracian lands, yes. But I never said you would go on such a foolish assault as the one you suggest. Like I said, have your navigators check their maps, they're telling you that you're somewhere you're not. You, and others, like Lucius Aemilius is doing now, will be used to attack Thracian forces inside Thracian lands, yes. But with the intent to defeat them and scatter them before they reach our borders.

To think that Consul Servius would send you to Vicus Marcomanni, well...that's just silly. Take a look at the senate motions themselves. The senate tried to pass a motion to send you there. However; Consul Servius voted against the motion. You have nothing to worry about senator Quintus. You are in good hands, we would not let such a valuable man fall ill to a poorly thought campaign.

(OOC - Take a look at the latest save game, it's 255-winter-lucius.zip in the upload directory. Autoresolve the battle or whatever just so you can get a good look at where you yourself are. You're marching back to Viberi, , far, far away from Vicus Marcomanni and their overlord's army.

EDIT - Note that that save game was placed there before your post was made. Just a bit of a mix up, it's ok.)

[Mount Suribachi]

My my, how people deduce an entire strategy I have in mind based merely on my wondering out loud just what the Consuls plans are. What more can I say? You have already deconstructed "my" strategy.

[Lucjan]

UPS - I never said anything of any strategy you may have.

But when you accuse the consul of not knowing what he is doing, and of allowing other men to drive the course of history while he sits by and goes with the flow, then you should be quite ready for a lecture. Such things are a direct insult to the consul, who I have tried to explain to you is most certainly the man moving our current events more than any of our rival faction's leaders. Just because there are no blatant invasions or brash charges does not mean that it is not so. So far, they have all played right into his hands, and even the rather commendable attempts of the Seleucids to counter the consul's tactics have been defeated.

[Mount Suribachi]

I never said that you didn't know what you are doing. I said some men might think that. I never called for "blatant invasions" or "brash charges".

And despite all your posturing and lecturing and philosophising like some kind of Greek, you still haven't clearly explained your strategy in the east, aside from some vague and wooly cliches.

[Death the destroyer of worlds]

He's got you there, Servius

[Braden]

UPS Maximus,

I believe you should find out if you can release the full details of what is planned initially in the East. Seems the Senate is getting "Twitchy".

[Lucjan]

UPS - Quite apparently so... I will dispatch a letter to consul Servius requesting his permission to divulge the full details of the plans for this consulship.