KOTR Postmortem and Next-Gen Rules Discussion

[TinCow]

Okay, my first comment is regarding army composition rules: I hate them. Passionately.

As I noted, I am fine with getting rid of them altogether. I agree that they probably cause more problems than benefits. If the majority agree, I'll happily cut all of Rule 4.4.

Next comment: Ship recruitment doesn't seem to be specifically covered in the rules (If it is and I missed it pardon me). I'd like to see recruitment of ships tied into the Feudal system, such that no one below a certain rank (Duke? Lower? It may depend on faction) can recruit a ship, even if their settlement has the technical ability.

Do you want to take ship recruitment away from the Chancellor? As it stands now, no one controls recruitment of any kind other than the Chancellor. Under 1.5, they can seize control of units the Chancellor recruits, but since the Chancellor holds the purse strings, the actual recruitment decisions are entirely up to him.

I like the rank system. My one question is, how will ranks (Specifically Baronets vs Knights) be assigned initially?

Rule 2.2 handles this. Everyone starts as a Knight, but then the starting settlements are handed out by econ21 (or someone else, if econ21 isn't around). That will instantly promote everyone who receives a settlement to Baronet. If Oaths of Fealty are immediately sworn, higher ranks could theoretically be achieved on turn 1, but I doubt we'd see anything higher than Baron.

The only significant loopholes I see are regarding agents (Spies, Assassins, Diplomats). Will only the Chancellor control them, or will we allow a certain rank in the feudal system to start recruiting and ordering agents?

As it stands now, Agents would be 100% controlled by the Chancellor. I remember someone (GH?) proposing that a new 'Power' could be control over agents of various kinds, but that must've gotten lost in the shuffle. That's definitely something that could be added, though.

If I am a knight, and I conquer a province, it is mine?

Only if you are not a vassal to someone else and were in command of the army. Every rank above Knight has the "All provinces conquered by any of their vassals become their property..." power, so a Knight who has a Lord will be subject to this rule. If the Knight is solo, he can definitely get his own province, but he would need an army in order to do it. Given his penalties, that is likely to be difficult. He probably won't get control of a Private or Royal Army without swearing fealty to someone, so he'd be limited to a half stack army. Getting even a half stack would be difficult unless the Chancellor gave it to you, because you have no ability to 'seize' units since you don't have a province to seize them from.

If I am a knight, but beholden to TC, who is my Baronet, and I conquer a province, it is his? And then he can give it to me?
And if TC gives me the province, that would boost me up to Baronet? And him automatically to Baron?

Exactly correct. Top Dog in the House gets all the provinces and then redistributes them however he wants.

Very interesting. So, 6 people with land can agree to push one of their members up to Grand Duke? Simply by agreeing who to push up the ladder?

Technically 7. 6 would be limited to Baronet, Baron, Viscount, Count, Marquess, and Duke. You would need a 7th to fill the Grand Duke slot.

Would it help if some of the requirements required 2 vassels instead of 1? That way it would limit the number of people in the upper rank. Otherwise, you might just see "clubs of 6" form and push their people up the ladder. Just a thought.

In my original structure, I had the Grand Duke requiring 2 Dukes, but the ranks of Baronet and Viscount were absent. So, a Grand Duke required 9 people (2 Barons, 2 Counts, 2 Marquesses, 2 Dukes, 1 Grand Duke). When I thought about it, I concluded that this was too many. 9 people is a really, really high number and I doubt we'd ever see that many people in an alliance. However, under that system dropping the GD requirement to 1 Duke resulted in a GD for a group of 5 people. This was way too easy, since a 5 person alliance is very doable and the GD is designed to rival the Faction Leader for power. So, I switched it to a 1 Duke requirement, but added in the Baronet and Viscount to hit a happy-medium requirement of 7 people for a GD.

That doesn't mean this is well-balanced, though. This is exactly the kind of stuff we need to be talking about.

3.) PvP is good as is as long as we keep finding people willing to donate so much time to running them.

I'm hoping people will come up with better systems for resolving these battles. Perhaps even using other computer games or web-based systems. At worst, we could just use the AI battles, which shouldn't take too much time. That would essentially be an Autoresolve.

I am a little worried that the game will require an exponentially increasing amount of people. Almost everyone playing will want to go up the ladder. That will require an influx of new people. Then those will want up the ladder. All of this will require more land to be taken. Once all of the interested people in the forum join, that is where the real jockeying for power will begin. Because those at the top will be scrambling to get players under them and out from under their opponents. Plus, if people start dropping out, I see it dragging the whole ladder down with them. Those at the top will see people drop out from under them and that will lower their own rank.

Yep, this is a concern and one that should be discussed. Fewer ranks could help this, but I think we would need to re-balance the powers if we cut some ranks. At the same time, I don't intended for every rank to be filled at all times. I personally think Grand Dukes should be very rare and hard to achieve. I wouldn't be surprised if it took 3-4 Chancellorships for the first GD to appear.

Also, it is my intention to advertise heavily for this game. I want to try and recruit a large body of people from all over the Org, and other forums as well. The system should make it pretty easy for people to join in at any time as well, so I'm hoping we'll get upwards of 20 players at the start, maybe even up to 30 at some times. Ambitious, perhaps, but I think it's achievable.