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Thread: The Magnaura

  1. #1201
    One easily trifled with Member Target Champion Motep's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Quote Originally Posted by Ibn-Khaldun View Post
    I wouldn't call it treason.. I would call it merely the truth!
    A truth that borders on treason, as it were. In either rate, he is not the emperor yet, so he is merely being called a murderer of his father's people.
    TosaInu shall never be forgotten.

  2. #1202
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    "The only problem being that Caesar has not murdered anyone. This slander does not have any kind of proof behind it. These two men have just shown that their personal hatred of Caesar for reasons unknown has made them spread lies and they should be punished for it."
    Ja Mata Tosainu Sama.

  3. #1203
    Makedonios Ksanthopoulos Member Privateerkev's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Makedonios listens to the people argue over the Caesar with mild amusement.

    Alright, lets settle down a little. While I would have picked slightly more... diplomatic language than my Sergeant, the Senate is the proper place to voice dissent.

    As for the Caesar murdering his own people, I do find him guilty of "criminal neglect." My complaints are well documented so I will be brief. The Caesar illegally starved the armies of the Order of men. This caused us to take higher casualties than normal when we had to defeat the Jihad heading towards the capital. So, because of his actions, or lack of action, more people died than probably would have normally.

    I won't go so far to call him a murderer because I do not think he was trying to kill our soldiers on purpose. I think he was simply trying to hurt his political opponents and the Jihad just happened to come along while he did it. But his actions were neglectful, as well as criminal. Because he broke our "rules" when he neglected those armies. Rules that are "supposed" to be sacrosanct.

    As for who gets banned, that is up to the Emperor. I am confident he will let us know when someone crosses a line.


    Knight of the Order of St. John
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  4. #1204
    One easily trifled with Member Target Champion Motep's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Quote Originally Posted by Privateerkev View Post
    Makedonios listens to the people argue over the Caesar with mild amusement.

    Alright, lets settle down a little. While I would have picked slightly more... diplomatic language than my Sergeant, the Senate is the proper place to voice dissent.

    As for the Caesar murdering his own people, I do find him guilty of "criminal neglect." My complaints are well documented so I will be brief. The Caesar illegally starved the armies of the Order of men. This caused us to take higher casualties than normal when we had to defeat the Jihad heading towards the capital. So, because of his actions, or lack of action, more people died than probably would have normally.

    I won't go so far to call him a murderer because I do not think he was trying to kill our soldiers on purpose. I think he was simply trying to hurt his political opponents and the Jihad just happened to come along while he did it. But his actions were neglectful, as well as criminal. Because he broke our "rules" when he neglected those armies. Rules that are "supposed" to be sacrosanct.

    As for who gets banned, that is up to the Emperor. I am confident he will let us know when someone crosses a line.

    And I must add that the Caesar should not his politics get the first sway in things. The good of the Empire should always come above the good of your self, and you should not get too presumptuous.
    Last edited by Motep; 08-19-2008 at 00:22.
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  5. #1205
    Just your average Senior Member Warmaster Horus's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Would it be insulting if I asked you whether you were truly your brother's brother? Because what you have just said, Andronikos, is more or less what he's been doing.
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  6. #1206
    The Search for Beefy Member TheFlax's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    A note at the entrance of the Magnaura.

    The following have been accepted for the position of Scholar in the University of Constantinople for the period of 1125 to 1140.

    - Strator Andronikos Komnenos
    - Comes Methodios Tagaris
    - Hypatos Armatos ek Naksou
    - Hypatos Ioannis Kalameteros
    - Ceasar Ioannis Komnenos
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    TheFlax needs to die on principle. No townie should even be that scummy.

  7. #1207
    Chretien Saisset Senior Member OverKnight's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Aleksios looks around and shakes his head.

    Considering that we have an unprecedented tied election on our hands, I would think the Electors would have something better to do than slander my son.

    Let us focus on the matter at hand.
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  8. #1208
    the G-Diffuser Senior Member pevergreen's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Dear Sirs, the next man to insult our Ceasar, shall face my wrath.

    I implore everyone to realise what a sham the "Order" is and realise that the only way forward is Savvas.
    Quote Originally Posted by TosaInu
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  9. #1209
    Saruman the Wise Member deguerra's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Ioannis gets up with an irritated frown

    And what, pray, constitutes your wrath?

    I tire of your petty threats to Senators of the Empire. I tire of all these personal insults and this squabbling. For crying out loud, you are grown men, nobles and tasked with running a government. If you cannot face this task with some of the required maturity perhaps you should ask to be replaced with men more suited to the position.
    Saruman the White
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  10. #1210
    One easily trifled with Member Target Champion Motep's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    To get back to the task at hand,

    I proclaim my support for the Grandmaster Makedonios Ksanthopoulos.
    TosaInu shall never be forgotten.

  11. #1211

    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Ioannis, slightly annoyed at the yapping senators, rises to speak.

    I will ignore the slander poured on me by the members of the Order. They are not important. What is important is the fact that we have a tied election for the post of Megas Logothetes. As this event is unprecedented in our empire's long history, I ask each senator to reflect carefully on whom he shall vote for.

    I reaffirm my support for Savvas ek Militou. He is a worthy candidate, and has the interests of the empire as a whole at heart. He has proved to be above partisan politics, and has proved himself well in battle. While all of us in the east were eager for war with the Seljuks, he accepted the mundane task of putting down insurrections. Surely that is to be commended.

    While Senator Ksanthopoulos waxes eloquently on the need for balance in the empire, he makes little mention of the fact that the lands of controlled by his Order are the least developed in the empire. How can you expect him to be balanced under such a policy? We will see the lands of the Order take priority because "they are in the most need".

    Ioannis resumes his seat.

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  12. #1212

    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Ioannis, slightly annoyed at the yapping senators, rises to speak.

    I will ignore the slander poured on me by the members of the Order. They are not important. What is important is the fact that we have a tied election for the post of Megas Logothetes. As this event is unprecedented in our empire's long history, I ask each senator to reflect carefully on whom he shall vote for.

    I reaffirm my support for Savvas ek Militou. He is a worthy candidate, and has the interests of the empire as a whole at heart. He has proved to be above partisan politics, and has proved himself well in battle. While all of us in the east were eager for war with the Seljuks, he accepted the mundane task of putting down insurrections. Surely that is to be commended.

    While Senator Ksanthopoulos waxes eloquently on the need for balance in the empire, he makes little mention of the fact that the lands of controlled by his Order are the least developed in the empire. How can you expect him to be balanced under such a policy? We will see the lands of the Order take priority because "they are in the most need".

    Ioannis resumes his seat.

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  13. #1213
    Makedonios Ksanthopoulos Member Privateerkev's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Amused that the Caesar gave the same exact speech twice, Makedonios addresses him.

    Slander? You deny that you broke the Rules during your term? Can it be slander if it is true?

    As for the Levant being the least developed, that is only because of your own criminal neglect. And while you jump to the assumption that I would show favoritism to the Levant, I am happy to inform you that you are quite wrong. I will distribute what resources there are evenly without regard as to who owns which province. All subjects of the Empire are deserving of the benefits of the Empire, regardless of which politician governs the province.

    And yes, what Comes Savvas has done is quite commendable. But, while you commend him, you failed to support him when he needed it. When you were busy sinking all of your resources into your pet projects, he was busy gathering local garrisons together to protect our heartlands from Jihad.


    Knight of the Order of St. John
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  14. #1214
    Saruman the Wise Member deguerra's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Ioannis rises, and bows to the Caesar

    Actually, my Lord, it was I who waxed eloquently about balance.
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  15. #1215
    Liar and Trickster Senior Member Andres's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Quote Originally Posted by Privateerkev View Post
    Makedonios listens to the people argue over the Caesar with mild amusement.

    Alright, lets settle down a little. While I would have picked slightly more... diplomatic language than my Sergeant, the Senate is the proper place to voice dissent.

    As for the Caesar murdering his own people, I do find him guilty of "criminal neglect." My complaints are well documented so I will be brief. The Caesar illegally starved the armies of the Order of men. This caused us to take higher casualties than normal when we had to defeat the Jihad heading towards the capital. So, because of his actions, or lack of action, more people died than probably would have normally.

    I won't go so far to call him a murderer because I do not think he was trying to kill our soldiers on purpose. I think he was simply trying to hurt his political opponents and the Jihad just happened to come along while he did it. But his actions were neglectful, as well as criminal. Because he broke our "rules" when he neglected those armies. Rules that are "supposed" to be sacrosanct.

    As for who gets banned, that is up to the Emperor. I am confident he will let us know when someone crosses a line.
    This looks like a nice speech, but it is, in fact, no more than slander.

    Rather ironic, isn't it? You constantly accused me of insulting you (which isn't true by the way), yet you don't refrain from lowering yourself to personal attacks versus our Caesar.

    And yet again, you subtetly make it clear that the main priority during your reign will be the Order... After all, since the Caesar "neglected" the Order, you will have to "rebuild" their armies and settlements, don't you?

    Tell me Makedonios, how is it possible that the "neglected" Order, which has faced so much "injustice" while the Caesar was Megas, managed to stay strong in the Levant?

    You always say how the Caesar didn't help me out while Corinth was besieged. But I never complained! You say that I was being ignored by the Caesar, but I, the person concerned, say that this is not true. I had all the resources necessary to obtain victory against the Fatimid crown prince. Instead of constantly whining about "injustices", I accepted that resources were scarce and that the last Megas wasn't able to recruit reinforcements. Instead of whining, House Tagamata tried to find a solution themselves, and we found a solution, thanks to the esteemed House Asteri (Savvas nods to the tables of the Asteri).

    I am sure you will yell "personal attacks" at me yet again, but the fact is that in times of peril, I didn't waste my time whining in the Senate. Instead, I tried to make the best out of a difficult situation.

    You, dear Grandmaster, produce alot of air, while I just do my duty in silence.

    Quote Originally Posted by Motep View Post
    To get back to the task at hand,

    I proclaim my support for the Grandmaster Makedonios Ksanthopoulos.
    Dear Senator, I realise you are still young and inexperienced, but it seems a bit tasteless that you swear an oath, only to ignore the opinions of your House members and your direct Lord. Maybe you should consult them in private, before casting your vote.

    We don't want you to get the reputation of a disloyal House member so soon, do we?
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  16. #1216
    Makedonios Ksanthopoulos Member Privateerkev's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Savvas, do you deny that the Caesar broke THE RULES?


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    Liar and Trickster Senior Member Andres's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Quote Originally Posted by Privateerkev View Post
    Savvas, do you deny that the Caesar broke THE RULES?
    Necessitas non habet legem...

    Besides, exactly what disasters happened during the reign of the Caesar? Where's the damage?

    And I would also like the Senators to reflect on this: is a man who constantly complains about regulations instead of dealing with the situation at hand, using the resources at hand, is such a man fit for the office of Megas?

    Let's assume that during the coming reign, a disaster does happen. Who would you want in charge: a man who keeps staring at his books, in disbelief that a certain rule was broken, or a man who carries on, using the resources he has and making the best of a situation.

    Do you want a man who knows how to deal with unexpected circumstances, or do you want a nitpicker?
    Last edited by Andres; 08-19-2008 at 07:24.
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  18. #1218
    Cthonic God of Deception Member ULC's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Lady Veronica, who is is at least 6 months with child, makes her way into the Magnaura, and sits down in her husbands seat. She reads the transcripts from the past few days and emotions from humor to anger cross her face. Finally, after she has satisfied herself, she gives Savvas a glance before addressing the senators.

    "I am sorry my husband was unable to attend, his injuries make it extremely difficult fro him to move and he is bedridden for now. As I read these documents though, I begin to wonder at why my husband would even come to the Magnaura. Do you discuss anything of importance? The only man here who even suggested anything coherent and intelligent is Vartholomaios. Otherwise, it has been useless bickering between men who can't agree over the color of the sky."

    Lady Veronica turns to Savvas

    "M'lod, if you would please tell me why on earth you would have us sack cities, when you wish to scorn Makedonios for one that he had no control over? Do you wish to hang lives over everyone's heads and then remind them later when they go against you what monsters they are? Is there any reason that you require the sacking of cities to fund an Empire that not only remained stable under Markianos, but grew? Are you implying you don't have the skill of knowing how to count money well enough to be Megas? May I ask how you see Makedonios asserting his rights as a senator "whining"? So, if I simply denied you an army, which currently you have no right to, but say you did, would you not complain as the Venetians encroached on your land? May I ask why you see the law of the land as something very flexible, and to be brushed to the side whenever you see fit? If so, then my husband can simply recruit what he needs then, since we all know that Adana is near Turkish territory and that the rules are flexible enough to allow him to insure the defense of his holdings. I am sure the Caesar will see the wisdom in it."

    Veronica delicately picks up another document. "Savvas, how attentive are you to the current situation on the eastern front? Because if you knew anything about it, you would see that House Asteri and the Order are ridiculously weak as of right now. The only real armies in all of the Empire are those controlled by the Caesar, and the one in this very city. May I ask how you will address not the quantity, but the quality of those in the Empires armies? When mentioning areas that need to be reinforced, may I ask why you neglectfully left Adana out of them?"

    Lady Veronica then turns to Makedonios. "Grandmaster, I am sure you know of my husbands condition, and how it came about because of politics. May I ask what you intend to do about internal politics? We cannot simply say one will get all the senators to work well together. Balance can only be achieved if all sides agree to it, otherwise one side will do what it must to tip the odds in it's favor to the determent of all others. So, may I ask, how do you plan to resolve inter House issues?"
    Last edited by ULC; 08-19-2008 at 07:40.

  19. #1219
    The Count of Bohemia Senior Member Cecil XIX's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    The Senator ek Militou likes to ignore facts when they don't suit him. With one breath he asks how the Order managed to stay strong and defeat the Egyptian Jihad, and with the other he chides the Grandmaster for not 'dealing with the situation.'

    The Caesar suffers from an even worse problem. He proclaims that the Order's territories are the least developed in his empire, and with the same breath warns us that the Grandmaster may use a lack of infastructure to justify building more infastructure.

  20. #1220
    Chretien Saisset Senior Member OverKnight's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    The Basileus has been dejectedly listening to arguments going on around him. A messenger approaches and hands him a note. After reading it, Aleksios stands and speaks.

    Excuse me Senators and Lady, but I have some matters to attend to. I will return shortly.

    Try to maintain some level of decorum.

    Summoning his Varangian Captain Harald, he exits the Magnaura.
    Last edited by OverKnight; 08-19-2008 at 08:24.
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  21. #1221
    Liar and Trickster Senior Member Andres's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Savvas looks a Veronica

    Mylady, I am still suffering from severe injuries from the battle of Corinth, yet I manage to attend this Senate Session.

    I take it your husband doesn't take his duties as seriously as I do? That's a disappointment...

    Anyway, the reason why I ask to sack cities has been utterly explained by me. Maybe you should re read your notes. I also explained several times why it is even better from a moral point of view, if you would only manage to think on the long term, long term as in "longer than one Megas-term". In order to do so, one must have a vision. As I explained before, the Grandmaster, who surely has the best interest of the Empire in mind, lacks such a vision. So it's not a matter of "knowing how to count money".

    I also never said that the law of the land is something to be ignored, please, don't twist my words.

    And if Venetians would attack my lands, than I would worry about the Venetians and I wouldn't just assume the Megas is deliberately ignoring my needs. I would send him a letter to ask for help and I would organise my defenses while waiting and I would also prepare for a worst case scenaria in case the Megas cannot help or cannot send me help in time, instead of wasting time travelling back and forth between the frontline and Constantinople, to plead in the Magnaura for my personal needs.

    I would be more dedicated to the Empire itself and less dedicated to my own personal gains...

    You will also remember that I plea for a war against the Order of the Knights Templar, who are without allies. These Knights are a great annoyance for the Order and they would gain a strategical advantage if they would defeat the Knights' Templar. Isn't it ironic, that the so called "foe of the Order of St John" has actually made a proposal that would hugely benefict said Order?

    And as for inter House issues, if there is one person who tries to arrange agreements between the Houses by extensively working behind the scenes, that it's me.

    You should ask you husband about this. Maybe you could mention a certain matter of the utmost delicacy while talking to him about certain actions behind the scenes.

    Savvas sits down again.
    Last edited by Andres; 08-19-2008 at 09:01.
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    Cthonic God of Deception Member ULC's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Lady Veronica almost smiles sardonically

    "My husband is sitting somewhere between life and death, and you would have him appear before you when even the best physicians of the Empire can do nothing more then pray? Do not compare Iakovos with yourself Savvas."

    "As to his duties, I would suggest you hold your tongue. He has done more for the Empire, without compensation, glory, or recognition, then you have or ever will know."

    "Yes, and you explanation rings hollow. By your suggestion then, Hypatios was justified in his actions because it prevented any harm "later on", and if thats true, then I suggest you cease attempting to characterize Makedonios as a butcher, because his men only prevented further harm "later on". And if Markianos could accomplish what he did without a mandate for sacking every city, how come you can't? Again, it seems to me that your ability to handle financial affairs is severely lacking, or you have ulterior motives for suggesting such an idea."

    "Speaking of waiting patiently, Makedonios waited 15 years to have his army taken care of. Shall we wait 15 years to help you? 15 years locked inside a settlement by besieging Normans and Venetians? That would be rather terrible of us, wouldn't it? I'd think you would have every right to make your voice heard, and thus the Grandmaster had every right to be vocal. Do not hold double standards were they can be scrutinized Savvas, it makes one look...poor, morally."

    "May I ask how you intend to for the Order of St.John to defeat the knights Templar without the Basileus's permission and with the current armies they have? And what if the Order wishes to pursue other avenues of expansion? Would you bind them to heavy losses and pitiful gain by sending them after a group of Knights that, however misguided, believe in the same ideals as the Order of St.John?"

    "And if you try to imply that my husband is somehow working behind the scenes for, heaven knows what, I may just die from laughter. But really, you didn't answer my question at all Savvas, in fact, you seem not to like to answer questions at all, preferring instead to simply retort and try to poke holes in your opponents arguments. I suggest you give clear answers, otherwise some may start to doubt you. So, I ask again, how do you intend to handle inter-house relations? Think about each House and how it functions before you retort and try to poke wholes in my statements, since I don't think you can answer."

  23. #1223
    Liar and Trickster Senior Member Andres's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Quote Originally Posted by YourLordandConqueror View Post
    "Yes, and you explanation rings hollow. By your suggestion then, Hypatios was justified in his actions because it prevented any harm "later on", and if thats true, then I suggest you cease attempting to characterize Makedonios as a butcher, because his men only prevented further harm "later on". And if Markianos could accomplish what he did without a mandate for sacking every city, how come you can't? Again, it seems to me that your ability to handle financial affairs is severely lacking, or you have ulterior motives for suggesting such an idea."
    Hypatios exterminated a settlement, he did not sack it...

    Savvas rolls his eyes.

    And these are different times. Don't compare Ampelas' period with this period.

    Quote Originally Posted by YLC
    "Speaking of waiting patiently, Makedonios waited 15 years to have his army taken care of. Shall we wait 15 years to help you? 15 years locked inside a settlement by besieging Normans and Venetians? That would be rather terrible of us, wouldn't it? I'd think you would have every right to make your voice heard, and thus the Grandmaster had every right to be vocal. Do not hold double standards were they can be scrutinized Savvas, it makes one look...poor, morally."
    What if, what if, what if, ... I don't do politics based on assumptions about imaginary scenarios, produced by the fantasies of a pregnant woman, thank you.

    I do not hold double standards either mylady, I have merely pointed out the fact that while the Caesar was Megas, the Order was the only one constantly complaining, the rest of us did what they were supposed to do, without wasting time complaining in the Magnaura during difficult times...

    Quote Originally Posted by YLC
    "May I ask how you intend to for the Order of St.John to defeat the knights Templar without the Basileus's permission and with the current armies they have? And what if the Order wishes to pursue other avenues of expansion? Would you bind them to heavy losses and pitiful gain by sending them after a group of Knights that, however misguided, believe in the same ideals as the Order of St.John?"
    If you would have paid attention, you would have noticed that I aksed the Basileus to send a declaration of war to the Knights Templar. If the Basileus does not want to declare war, then obviously, I won't either...

    And I also said that the Order would get what they are entitled to get, so they would have the means to defeat the Knights Templar.

    Quote Originally Posted by YLC
    "And if you try to imply that my husband is somehow working behind the scenes for, heaven knows what, I may just die from laughter. But really, you didn't answer my question at all Savvas, in fact, you seem not to like to answer questions at all, preferring instead to simply retort and try to poke holes in your opponents arguments. I suggest you give clear answers, otherwise some may start to doubt you. So, I ask again, how do you intend to handle inter-house relations? Think about each House and how it functions before you retort and try to poke wholes in my statements, since I don't think you can answer."
    Watch your tongue, woman, I wouldn't want to see you die from laughter...

    And how I would handle inter house relations? Discrete as in "not in public". Delicate matters are best treated calm, serene and discrete. I won't discuss that here, in the Senate, with somebody, with all due respect, is not member of a House but just a mere representative.

    Only fools would discuss how to deal with inter House relations in public and I am no fool.
    Last edited by Andres; 08-19-2008 at 10:10.
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    Cthonic God of Deception Member ULC's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    I see you avoided answering me again, Savvas. I also asked how you can justify your actions now, when you sneer at what Makedonios's men did years ago? And enlighten me, give me specifics on how this period, with it's rapid territorial expansion and thus more taxes and more income, has less money available to it?

    This are not fantasies, but plausible realities. Do not confuse the two Savvas, or one might question your sanity and ability to be Megas. And if you are unwilling to not consider ones possible future predicament, then how can we trust you as Megas? For such a forward thinker, you seem to prefer to take in the here and now."

    Again, you take only half my question. Again, what if the Order of St.John does not wish for war?

    Veronica chuckles. "Oh, do try me Savvas, please. Either way, answer the question I put forward. Here, let me give you an example so as to make it easier for you. Say The Order refuses to sack a settlement, such as Damascus or even Edessa. What will you do? Or, even better, say a dispute arisses over who should have their army replenished first, House Asteri or House Komnenodoukai, who would get the troops, taking in that all royal armies are filled?"

    "No, only those with ulterior motives who do not want them revealed, refuse discussing their policies."

  25. #1225
    Liar and Trickster Senior Member Andres's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Quote Originally Posted by YourLordandConqueror View Post
    I see you avoided answering me again, Savvas. I also asked how you can justify your actions now, when you sneer at what Makedonios's men did years ago? And enlighten me, give me specifics on how this period, with it's rapid territorial expansion and thus more taxes and more income, has less money available to it?

    This are not fantasies, but plausible realities. Do not confuse the two Savvas, or one might question your sanity and ability to be Megas. And if you are unwilling to not consider ones possible future predicament, then how can we trust you as Megas? For such a forward thinker, you seem to prefer to take in the here and now."

    Again, you take only half my question. Again, what if the Order of St.John does not wish for war?

    Veronica chuckles. "Oh, do try me Savvas, please. Either way, answer the question I put forward. Here, let me give you an example so as to make it easier for you. Say The Order refuses to sack a settlement, such as Damascus or even Edessa. What will you do? Or, even better, say a dispute arisses over who should have their army replenished first, House Asteri or House Komnenodoukai, who would get the troops, taking in that all royal armies are filled?"

    "No, only those with ulterior motives who do not want them revealed, refuse discussing their policies."
    I agreed with the Grandmaster himself not to mention what you are alluding to. I will stick to my end of that deal.

    Convenient? Maybe. Don't blame me for sticking to a well negotiated deal. Another piece of evidence that I'm the better diplomat...

    Savvas smiles calmly.

    At the moment, mylady, the royal treasure is empty. Land is a first step to acquire money. The Caesar set the first step. I will do the best I can to make the second step: building infrastructure which I will fund with the money generated from sacking.

    Long term mylady, long term as in "further than one term of Megas". The Caesar had a long term vision in mind during his term as Megas, but not everybody seems to understand it...

    And if the Order doesn't want to wage war with the Knight's Templar, by all means, let them say so. I was under the impression that the small Order of the Knight's Templar was a huge nuisance for their efforts in the Levant, but if they don't mind their presence, than they should say so.

    If the Order refuses to sack a settlement, than there's nothing I can legally do about it, since the Edict I proposed didn't pass. If two Houses should have their armies replenished and there's just enough money to help one, than I will take my decision in good conscience, after I verified the situation at hand and the circumstances in which the respective Houses find themselves in.
    Andres is our Lord and Master and could strike us down with thunderbolts or beer cans at any time. ~Askthepizzaguy

    Ja mata, TosaInu

  26. #1226
    Cthonic God of Deception Member ULC's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Lady Veronica smiles back at Savvas.

    "Of course land is the first step to acquire money, what I am asking is quite plain: how is it that with all the new land we have under our control, that we do not have any money at all? Do not say it is because of the armies, because we have fewer men now then we did when Markianos was Megas, and less land as well."

    Veronica seems perplexed at Savvas statement about the Caesar though. "Savvas, do explain how what I said had any relation to the Caesar at all? I was talking about you. I was talking about how Italian invasions are in your future...and yet you seem to want to avoid the discussion on how you would react to that, in the future, in fact, past more then "one megas term". Unless you know for a fact that the Venetians and Normans will only invade this term and never after.

    "What exactly, Savvas, am I alluding to? My husband has nothing to hide, and I know the Grandmaster has nothing to hide, so I take it you'd rather refer to an imaginary "deal"?

  27. #1227
    The longest lasting leper ever Member rossahh's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Sorry to interject myself in your, er...discussion, but when will the re-vote for the next Megas take place? I must return to Inconium soon.
    "Okay, here come the cavalry, get your swords out lads!" - the Captain details his orders to the pikemen

  28. #1228
    Makedonios Ksanthopoulos Member Privateerkev's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Makedonios chuckles.

    It seems Comes Savvas was "against the sacking of Antioch before he was for it."

    You do flip-flop a lot don't you? Anything to fit the situation huh?

    Since Lady Veronica has made very good points and rebuttals, I won't go into those Savvas.

    But I will say that I am amused that you ask us all to suffer criminal neglect in silence. The Caesar is guilty of criminal neglect and I have proven it.

    Let us break down these two words. The Caesar is a criminal because he broke the rules. He funded prioritized buildings before building a legally mandated army. I have the documentation (OOC: and the save game file) to prove it. There is no denying it. And, it is actually against the rules to break the rules. So you can't justify it. The Caesar treated us by neglect by his own admission. He proudly proclaimed that he would starve those he deemed "disloyal."

    So, since the Caesar broke the law to neglect us, that makes him guilty of criminal neglect. Therefore, when I say that, it is not an "insult" or "slander" but only the truth.

    Since you have long said that rules are basically meant to be broken, I fear you will only give us more of the same. Savvas is simply running for Caesar Ioannis's second term. (OOC: Got to love current US politics for giving me these frameworks. )

    I fear that if Savvas wins, that at some point, he too will break the rules.

    As for having us suffer in silence, you have now showed us why you are nothing more than a Comes. Because you do not understand responsibility to something greater than yourself. When you have thousands of citizens, hundreds of soldiers, and a half-dozen men under your care, you are responsible for them. The Caesar's criminal neglect put these people at risk. We had to fight two Jihad armies using two understregth poorly equipped armies because the Caesar criminally neglected us.

    Your contempt for the law leaves me to believe you are quite unfit to be Megas.

    As for this "deal" you keep spouting about, it stunk. Your a horrible diplomat Savvas because you lie so much. You asked me to help you rig an election so you could look good to the Caesar. And I have the letter from you to prove it. Rigging elections is for dirty Germans, not noble Byzantines. (OOC: )


    Knight of the Order of St. John
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  29. #1229
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    " Hypothetical Criminal neglect is nothing compared your men openly accusing the Caesar being a murderer, that is a grave insult and treacherous lies and you Makedonias are accountable for your men and what they say. Dont you understand how serious accusation is to accuse the heir of Roman empire as a murderer?"
    Ja Mata Tosainu Sama.

  30. #1230
    Makedonios Ksanthopoulos Member Privateerkev's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Magnaura

    Exactly what part of the Caesar's criminal neglect is "hypothetical?"

    He really did neglect the Order. And he really did break the law to do it. I fail to see what part is "hypothetical." My men are really dead because the Caesar really did withhold reinforcements by really breaking the law.


    Knight of the Order of St. John
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