I'd rather pay 10% more in Taxes than lose 10% of my (or my countrymens) freedom

[Strike For The South]

Agree or disagree? And dont weasel your way out by saying neither or both

[yesdachi]

How about if I pay 10% less in taxes and gain 10% more freedom?

[drone]

Paying more taxes gives more power to the government, therefore causing a loss of freedom.

[Innocentius]

Define freedom and I'll think about it.

[Goofball]

Define freedom and I'll think about it.

Something you hate?

[Xiahou]

Paying more taxes gives more power to the government, therefore causing a loss of freedom.

Best answer.

[Crazed Rabbit]

Agree or disagree? And dont weasel your way out by saying neither or both

Sure, if it worked out that way. But it doesn't.

Paying more taxes usually leads to bigger government which leads to less freedom, as drone said.

CR

[GeneralHankerchief]

Paying more taxes gives more power to the government, therefore causing a loss of freedom.

QFT

[Meneldil]

I hardly understand on what basis people assume that :

Paying more taxes = More power to the government = Less freedom for the average Joe.


But heh, anyway, who need rationality when arguing about taxes ? I mean, taxes are bad, everyone knows that

[GeneralHankerchief]

I hardly understand on what basis people assume that :

Paying more taxes = More power to the government = Less freedom for the average Joe.

What's the alternative?

[Dâriûsh]

Paying more taxes gives more power to the government, therefore causing a loss of freedom.

How does that work? Assuming the taxes are not used to fund some paramilitary thought police,


Is improved medical care a loss of freedom?

Are better schools a loss of freedom?

[drone]

How does that work? Assuming the taxes are not used to fund some paramilitary thought police

That's a big assumption.

Money is power. The very act of increased taxation is a reduction of freedom, there is no choice (aside from jail) but to pay. Money allows do-good (read: meddling) politicians to implement their little pet programs and to tell me what to do. Telling me what to do requires enforcement, which must expand as I find new ways of doing what I want instead of what they want, and that enforcement requires money.

Taxes are best served locally, I would willingly pay more local/state taxes if my federal bill was reduced accordingly. The majority of my tax burden goes to the feds, where it gets used in bad wars and bailing out poorly run companies. Locally, my taxes would go to schools, roads, etc. The US Constitution did not even allow for a federal income tax originally, it wasn't until the 16th amendment that allowed it (although the feds did try various schemes to get around the Article 1 clause). The tax disparity between the state and federal government in the US has essentially eliminated the 10th Amendment (state's rights), the feds can browbeat the states with reduced federal funding if a state gets uppity.

I don't argue that better schools or health care would be a bad thing, but there are no guarantees these would be delivered. Once a large bureaucracy gets a taste of tax dollars, it's like crack. They will do anything to get more, and they don't care who they have to step on to get it. A smaller treasury would make the government prioritize spending and use it more efficiently, instead of acting like sailors on shore leave.

[Louis VI the Fat]

The Congo government hardly levies taxes. Neither do Haiti and assorted hellholes elsewhere. Unlike heavily tax burdened countries like Denmark, Canada and Switzerland. Everything in life comes with a price. And taxes are the price one pays for living in a civilised country.

And dont weasel your way out by saying neither or both

Few would opt for both. But can we be freedom loving conservatives and weasel out by deficit spending and mortgaging our children's freedom to the Chinese and Arabs?

[Strike For The South]

The Congo government hardly levies taxes. Neither do Haiti and assorted hellholes elsewhere. Unlike heavily tax burdened countries like Denmark, Canada and Switzerland. Everything in life comes with a price. And taxes are the price one pays for living in a civilised country.


Few would opt for both. But can we be freedom loving conservatives and weasel out by deficit spending and mortgaging our children's freedom to the Chinese and Arabs?

Listen here comrade Im on your side

[Louis VI the Fat]

Listen here comrade Im on your side

Oooh!! I have a brilliant response burning on my keyboard, but I fear it'll lead us to digress again and consequently to a right good spanking by Banquo.

[Strike For The South]

Oooh!! I have a brilliant response burning on my keyboard, but I fear it'll lead us to digress again and consequently to a right good spanking by Banquo.

pm me frenchie

[CountArach]

Taxes. They are too low anyway.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Taxes. They are too low anyway.

You do realize that, if you wanted to convince any Americans of your position, you worded that statement in the most horrible possible way, right?

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

I hardly understand on what basis people assume that :

Paying more taxes = More power to the government = Less freedom for the average Joe.

Simple. You are giving your money away to someone else instead of choosing how you want to spend it.

[HoreTore]

You do realize that, if you wanted to convince any Americans of your position, you worded that statement in the most horrible possible way, right?

Bah, the yanks are lost anyway. Louis has it spot on IMO.

[lars573]

The Congo government hardly levies taxes. Neither do Haiti and assorted hellholes elsewhere. Unlike heavily tax burdened countries like Denmark, Canada and Switzerland. Everything in life comes with a price. And taxes are the price one pays for living in a civilised country.

This is so true.

[HoreTore]

Simple. You are giving your money away to someone else instead of choosing how you want to spend it.

Long term effects > short term effects.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

Long term effects > short term effects.

Perhaps, but does the government have the right to take away your money?

This is an unanswerable question, because we will inevitably have two sides who disagree based on ideaology.

[Vladimir]

Taxes. They are too low anyway.

Well, cough it up! You do realize that you can pay extra money to your government, don't you?

[Rhyfelwyr]

Paying more taxes gives more power to the government, therefore causing a loss of freedom.

This is only from a US viewpoint since due to it's history the government is seen mainly as a threat to people's freedom. For Europeans, the government is there to ensure their freedom from the same problems that arise from the "freedoms" people demand in the US (ie monopolies, big corporations, corruption, poverty etc).

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

This is only from a US viewpoint since due to it's history the government is seen mainly as a threat to people's freedom. For Europeans, the government is there to ensure their freedom from the same problems that arise from the "freedoms" people demand in the US (ie monopolies, big corporations, corruption, poverty etc).

The differences between freedom in Europe and American can in most cases be divided as such:

Europe: Freedom from (poverty, violence, corporate monopolies)
America: Freedom to (own guns, make your own financial choices, not be forced into a multi-state union against your will...)

[KarlXII]

Perhaps, but does the government have the right to take away your money?

This is an unanswerable question, because we will inevitably have two sides who disagree based on ideaology.

You think the government has money trees growing? They need the people's money to continue to run for the people.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

You think the government has money trees growing? They need the people's money to continue to run for the people.

Did I state an opinion in that post?

[KarlXII]

Did I state an opinion in that post?

Yes. Or your question is oddly worded.

"Does the government really have the right to govern?"

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

Yes. Or your question is oddly worded.

"Does the government really have the right to govern?"

The wording of the question is explained by the second sentence.