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Thread: Never forget.

  1. #1
    Marzbān-ī Jundīshāpūr Member The Persian Cataphract's Avatar
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    Post Never forget.

    This is still as painful to watch as I first saw it in 2003.

    The looting and ransacking of Iraq National Museum in Baghdad
    Last edited by The Persian Cataphract; 04-20-2009 at 12:44.


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  2. #2

    Default Re: Never forget.

    - REVENGE!!!
    - A NEW DYNASTY!!!

    - a very generous bribe from Yarema


  3. #3
    Peerless Senior Member johnhughthom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    It's one thing for people to have taken objects from the museum to sell, but what was the point of destroying anything they couldn't carry? I imagine it would have been a wonderful museum to have visited.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Never forget.

    Attacking a whole people's memories. Cruelty at its peak. No way this can be forgotten.
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  5. #5

    Default Re: Never forget.

    This really was horrible - what could be moved taken, what coudn't be moved smashed (but I just don't understand why) and most of it lost.

    Lets not forget.
    “Save us, o Lord, from the arrows of the Magyars.” - A prayer from the 10th century.




  6. #6
    Member Member Raygereio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    Quote Originally Posted by johnhughthom View Post
    It's one thing for people to have taken objects from the museum to sell, but what was the point of destroying anything they couldn't carry? I imagine it would have been a wonderful museum to have visited.
    Why did they start looting in the first place? Your previous government has fallen, the invaders are parading into the city with promises of freedom and the first thing you do is looting your own city? I'll never understand us humans...

    Same kind of stupidity as with some football matches (or soccer for you US citizens); after their favority team looses the 'fans' drown their sorrow by rioting and destroying stuff. Or even if their team wins, then they celebrate by rioting.
    East of west, stupidity is everywhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by vartan View Post
    Attacking a whole people's memories. Cruelty at its peak. No way this can be forgotten.
    Oh it will be. I'm not pessimistic, just being realistic.

    On a sidenote (and in no way making a political statement whatsoever) Rumsfeld's response of "stuff happens" and "freedom is untidy" was just hilarious. I certainly laughed out loud, what on earth made him think saying that was a good idea...
    Last edited by Raygereio; 04-20-2009 at 12:01. Reason: there was the word 'in' somewhere.. no idea what it was doing there

  7. #7
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    well, they probably remember how their ancient Keltoi ancestors loot Babylon in EB ... A standard looting and rioting activity... maybe if Slavery didn't get abolished... we just got a news that Baghdad are Enslaved... or even Exterminated... Luckily they are only looted... (but this was awful too)

    It was sad when we see humanity values degraded...

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  8. #8

    Default Re: Never forget.

    Such acts like this are not only against the law, common sense and just absurd, but also against your own nation! There is no nation without a history. Same as there is no nation without a language. Destroying your OWN history is the worst crime possible...

    I was unsure whether to cry or laugh when I wathed Rumsfeld saying "stuff happens", "they've got freedom and they can do bad things, BUT they can do a lot of beautiful things too!" (not an exact quote, but something similar). That's just absurd.

  9. #9
    Member Member Aurgelmir's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    Most off the artifacts,temples and historical goldmines(figurly speaking)are destroyed because off there religion.....its really a shame!!
    We have to thank the"Zend Avesta"for this.Without zoroastrianism,religion would not the be same,and i think much friendlier(but that is only my opinion,before SOMEONE starts flaming again)

  10. #10
    Member Member the man with no name's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    Horrible. HorribleHORRIBLE.
    My balloons:

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  11. #11
    urk! Member bobbin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    Don't forget the american military's decision to build a base ON TOP of a part of the ruins of Babylon, not trying to start america bashing here i'm just amazed at that particular idiotic decision.


  12. #12
    master of the wierd people Member Ibrahim's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    the times we live in
    I was once alive, but then a girl came and took out my ticker.

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  13. #13

    Default Re: Never forget.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ibrahim View Post
    the times we live in
    I'm afraid it could get worse... but I hope it will not.
    “Save us, o Lord, from the arrows of the Magyars.” - A prayer from the 10th century.




  14. #14
    Satalextos Basileus Seron Member satalexton's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    Am I the only person that's worried about the presence of an over-sized Arche, with Type 3 and 4 settlements crawling all over the world in conspicous places?




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  15. #15
    master of the wierd people Member Ibrahim's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    Quote Originally Posted by satalexton View Post
    Am I the only person that's worried about the presence of an over-sized Arche, with Type 3 and 4 settlements crawling all over the world in conspicous places?
    unless you are chezc, nope-far from it.
    I was once alive, but then a girl came and took out my ticker.

    my 4 year old modding project--nearing completion: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=219506 (if you wanna help, join me).

    tired of ridiculous trouble with walking animations? then you need my brand newmotion capture for the common man!

    "We have proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that if we put the belonging to, in the I don't know what, all gas lines will explode " -alBernameg

  16. #16
    Abou's nemesis Member Krusader's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    Today is also a decade since the Columbine massacre.

    As for the sacking it is sad as well.
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  17. #17
    Guitar God Member Mediolanicus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    I remember the sacking all to well...

    I was really shocked when they showed it on the news here...

    I won't forget it...
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  18. #18

    Default Re: Never forget.

    Cant remember who said this but there is a quote -

    "War destroys the past."

    In most cases its very true.

  19. #19
    Σέλευκος Νικάτωρ Member Fluvius Camillus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    This really is saddening...
    Quote Originally Posted by Equilibrius
    Oh my god, i think that is the first time in human history that someone cares to explain an acronym that people expect everybody to know in advance.
    I lived for three years not knowing what AAR is.

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  20. #20
    Something Witty Goes Here Member Zeibek's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    It's funny how history is always one of the first victims of war. The Aztecs systematically burnt the codices of subject people as to erase any memory of the time prior to Aztec dominance, the Romans had their whole damnatio memoriae thing and we all know how the USSR liked to rewrite the history of newly annexed states. Still, that all was somewhat understandable because it had a clear reason behind it. This was just taking whatever is movable and destroying the rest just because if you can't have it no-one should. It's not even anarchism, since at least anarchists wreak havoc for something, its just simple blind avarice let loose by the breakdown of law and order.



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  21. #21
    EB TRIBVNVS PLEBIS Member MarcusAureliusAntoninus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    I have consipracy theories about the looting of the Baghdad museum, but won't go into them here. I'll only say, the easiest way to defeat someone is to destroy the uniqueness of their culture...


  22. #22
    Slixpoitation Member A Very Super Market's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    Today is also Hitler's birthday. Seems like a bad day for history.
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  23. #23

    Default Re: Never forget.

    Very sad. So many Iraqi archaeological sites are looted as well. Poor Babylon.....

  24. #24
    Member Member Tudhaliya's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    To respond to a theme in this thread: why do people destory their own heritage?

    "Heritage" has and always will be the product of a small elite ruling class. Think about it: the stuff that most people make and live around each day is rather unremarkable. A straw mat or a clay pot will look pretty much the same anywhere and any time in history. But give that as a reason to the owner of the pot you just smashed, and it will not fly with him.
    Possession is nine-tenths of fondness for an object, so most members of a culture do not naturally have an emotional connection to the precious artifacts of their culture. With the exception of the children of the elite who literally grow up around the stuff (which is to say, what we could call "precious" is their "mundane"), a person's "heritage" must be taught.
    In other words, precious artifacts mean the most to the elite that created them. They use them and display them as symbols of their authority. They teach the masses that support their empire to identify with these symbols - even to love them.
    Now, none of this means that these artifacts aren't significant in a larger "human" context. Objectively, they are some of the finest things we as a species have produced. In some sense, they belong to all of us. But in truth, they only ever belonged to their progenitors, like a limb to its body.
    So, when an Iraqi loots the dowry of some dead Babylonian princess, we musn't look at him as a cannibal turning on his own kind. He is more like a scavenger or a bacterium. Horrible, yes, but understandable.

  25. #25

    Default Re: Never forget.

    Quote Originally Posted by A Very Super Market View Post
    Today is also Hitler's birthday. Seems like a bad day for history.
    Its Lenins Birthday as well. Which makes it an even worst day for history.

  26. #26

    Default Re: Never forget.

    April sounds so downhill now. Memories of Oklahoma City 1995, Columbine 1999, Baghdad 2003, Lenin and Hitler, and the Armenian Genocide 1915. What a strange old month.
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  27. #27
    Slixpoitation Member A Very Super Market's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    Uh, Lenin was born on April 22. Today is April 20, in the Americas.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    WELCOME TO AVSM
    Cool store, bro! I want some ham.
    No ham, pepsi.
    They make deli slices of frozen pepsi now? Awesome!
    You also need to purchase a small freezer for storage of your pepsi.
    It runs on batteries. You'll need a few.
    Uhh, I guess I won't have pepsi then. Do you have change for a twenty?
    You can sift through the penny jar
    ALL WILL BE CONTINUED

    - Proud Horseman of the Presence

  28. #28
    Member Member jabarto's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    That was honestly hard to watch, even for me. I won't forget it anytime soon.

  29. #29
    Near East TW Mod Leader Member Cute Wolf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    let's hope that this bad thing won't happened again...

    btw, the looter is not an Arche... He was a Res Publica, with type 4 government... in almost all the wolrd... the type 3 is only in some misfortunate countries...

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  30. #30
    Villiage Idiot Member antisocialmunky's Avatar
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    Default Re: Never forget.

    I was honestly surprised at how much wasn't destroyed after seeing the video of the main displays and the archives of the museum. Not that it excuses this act, nothing will excuse the destruction of priceless artifacts. I don't think anyone actually expected it to be that bad or expected people to destroy their own history, more that a stray missile would have blown it up.

    They've managed to recover a surprising amount of it between people who have turned items back in and people who took stuff to keep it safe. Still it was a stupid and sad thing.

    The real thing are the archeological sites. People lost things they didn't even know they had. They lost things that weren't catalogues or studied - that's the real travesty.

    What happened to Babylon was ridiculous though and inexcusable.
    Last edited by antisocialmunky; 04-22-2009 at 04:27.
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