Windows 7

[Lemur]

So, apparently the coding is done, the thing is baked to a perfect golden yummy crusty taste, and now all that's left is SKUs, marketing and packaging. The release candidate will be available for download tothe public soonish.

So what do Orgahs think? Will Windows 7 deliver in a way that Vista did not? Will Windows 7 become the new XP Pro? I'd especially like to hear from anyone who has gotten hands-on with any of the demos ...

[edyzmedieval]

I will wait for the first Service Pack, most probably.
Although if reviews are favorable, I will buy it earlier. Vista for me wasn't a disaster, it was fairly good, but it's not really my favourite operating package.

[Flavius Etius]

I have the beta of Windows 7 and in my opinion it's very good. The design is nearly the same as at Vista, but its much easier to change any settings, etc. than by Vista. Also hardware as a printer or a microphone are working without searching a driver for them and even many PC games, which didn't work on Vista work on Windows 7 again!

EDIT: Btw I think that the client will be released on May the 5th!

[Caius]

Can you get a demo of it? Do I need to throw down my HD in order to install it?

[Beskar]

You can get the beta of Wndows 7, or used to. There are still ways to get it though.

I have to admit, I tried Windows 7 32-bit Ultimate on a laptop that was presumingly "home basic vista" and it works absolutely great. It makes my Windows Vista look tired in comparison and with Windows 7 getting lots of feedback and support early on, where Vista lacked this big time, it should be a smooth ride.

[caravel]

MS are 90% hype and marketing. They're just fixing Vista (Longhorn) and releasing it with some, but not all, of the features it should have had in the first place and some fancy new themes (which look like OSX rip offs). Die hard Windows users get ripped off again and again, and still come back for more. People will pay out once again for what should be a Vista service pack.

Vista was also supposed to be a new OS "built from the ground up" or that's what the fanboys would have you believe anyway. It turned out to be more of the same, just another step in the twisted evolution from Windows NT.

It's interesting that Blackcomb which is supposed to be the next next generation Windows release was renamed to "Vienna" and then to "Windows 7". This is very typical of past trends - Longhorn also started as an offshoot from Blackcomb. It is evident that as with Vista, Windows users are still not getting the Blackcomb that has been in development since 2000, but once again another stopgap OS, with some cosmetic rework to keep the money rolling in until Blackcomb is ready (if it ever will be finished).

The renaming has been pure marketing as ever. I suspect Blackcomb has not actually been renamed, but instead put on the back burner once again. This is because Vista was a flop and MS now have no choice but to release something (anything) to fill the void ASAP. The rename to "Vienna" was supposedly to keep it in line with Vista, there is an MS statement on this (google). Due to Vista's bad press, MS obviously decided to ditch the "V" naming and take a different approach. This is why the latest stopgap release will be known as "Windows 7".

[Beskar]

Even though "Windows 7" might be a fixed version of Vista, it does work better, which is definitely a good thing.

Problems with computers is that Mac's is that they are all copy&pasta between them. Only reason they have their reported stability is because there are no differences between the machines. They also charge you $1500 for a $500 machine just because of the Mac sticker on it.

The other other choice after that is Linux. The problem with Linux is that you need a PhD in computer programming to get it working right. Since there is no support program in forms of aftersales or similar and since it is plagued with programme and driver incompatibilities, it is not really a viable option to use.

All this, then again, leaves Windows as the viable choice.

[Lemur]

Beskar, I can safely say that I understood over 60% of that post. Do I get a prize?

Even if, as some in this thread are saying, Windows 7 is just a "fixed" version of Vista, isn't that cause to celebrate? I love my XP as much as the next guy, but I'm ready to move on. I'd like to have a 64-bit OS that can recognize 4+ gigs of RAM without weirdness. I'd like to have an up-to-date OS that actually games well.

There are any number of angles for criticizing Microsoft, and lord knows we explore them from time to time, but this doesn't feel like the kind of thing that calls for bitterness. They messed up with Vista, they know it, and they're trying to make it right. Ain't that something to be happy about?

[caravel]

The other other choice after that is Linux. The problem with Linux is that you need a PhD in computer programming to get it working right. Since there is no support program in forms of aftersales or similar and since it is plagued with programme and driver incompatibilities, it is not really a viable option to use.

Wrong... Linux is not plagued by "programme and driver incompatibilities". A basic program consists of binaries, libs and config files built to run on a particular architecture and OS. It will either be compatible or it won't be. If it's incompatible then it's not built for that OS/architecture. The same goes for drivers, unless you're referring to proprietary drivers. These have always been an issue, because they're only as good as the hw manufacturer make them. They're also not open source so the community cannot fix problems with them as they can with all other OSS.

You're also wrong about aftersales support. If you want to actually buy a stable LTS distribution on discs, then you can purchase a support option for quite a few distributions. The GNU/GPL licence means that though software cannot be sold, the discs, manuals and support packages can. For all other non enterprise, free distributions there are support forums, which are usually very good.

I can only think that your opinion of Linux comes from limited experience with unstable and improperly marketed distros such as the Ubuntu family and it's spin offs, bleeding edge distros such as fedora or from user unfriendly (but rock solid) ones such as Slackware? Slackware does not even ship with a desktop manager, so it's out of the question for the beginner. Ubuntu (despite marketing) is bleeding edge and uses a lot of beta and alpha software in their releases. It is basically Debian unstable with lots of features and extras including compiz fusion added. It tends to draw in new users who then tend to come unstuck and fall flat.

For newcomers there are distros such as Debian "Lenny", Arch, OpenSuse, Mandriva etc which all have good stable releases.

For something stable and supported then you can put your hand in your pocket and go for Red Hat Enterprise Linux Desktop.

[Banquo's Ghost]

I'm still trying to work out why Macs are all "copy and pasta". Some kind of subtle hint at we fanbois' elitist metrosexual reputation?

[Beskar]

I'm still trying to work out why Macs are all "copy and pasta". Some kind of subtle hint at we fanbois' elitist metrosexual reputation?

They are all the same specification, hence, Mac's are all copy and paste. "copy&pasta" is a internet slang for all those copy and paste emails/forum posts you see.

[Lemur]

My old laptop just died, and the wife insisted on a MacBook. Can't say I blame her; the unibody aluminum should give it a modest degree of childproofing, and the new trackpad is pretty darn slick. I'm not fond of how Apple does business, and I think the closed OS/hardware loop has always been a mistake, but dang—they know how to make a good laptop. No denying it.

If you're interested in Windows 7, the public beta will begin on May 5, and the license will be good for over a year. That's a pretty good deal, especially if you keep your XP install on a separate partition just in case.

Some details.

On May 5th, general users will have access to an entire year of Microsoft's brand new operating system, Windows 7, for free! It is already available to download for MSDN and TechNet subscribers. This version is only the Release Candidate and will expire June 1, 2010. The Release Candidate is merely the near finished product and is basically the final stage in testing. It's supposed to have all the features of the final version. We don't know when the final version will be released but rumors say it'll be either late 2009 or early 2010.

A beta version of Windows 7 was released some time ago, and from using it for a short time, I can gather that it was much faster and more friendly than Windows Vista. Indeed for those of you who hated Vista, Windows 7 is Vista done right. Windows 7 boasts a lot of new features including a new taskbar, libraries, jump lists, etc. Windows 7 will also come packaged with the newest Internet Explorer (IE8).

The biggest improvement with Windows 7 is the performance. It will no longer take 5-10 minutes to boot up your machine. Windows 7 now has a much faster startup time, beating out both Vista and XP. We will also see a new feature called Windows XP mode which lets you run native XP programs on your machine.

People are saying good things about this Windows. Microsoft hopes it will make up for all the bad things about its previous version. I've heard news about IT developers leap-frogging Vista and going straight to 7 in their companies.

-edit-

P.S.: Here's a detailed review of Windows 7's XP compatibility mode.

[Husar]

It's nothing new either though, they already released a free beta and free releasde candidate for Vista and they were also good for like 6 or 12 months IIRC.
I also had some beta of WinXP once that was good for 6 months and when it wouldn't automatically activate once long after XP had already been released, the lady on the phone gave me an activation number anyway.

[Lemur]

Here it is.

[Tellos Athenaios]

Some pretty heafty system requirements right there: 1GHz processor with 1GB RAM means what exactly to one-legged-hamster-powered netbooks?

Ah well, I think I'll opt for a taste of Leonidas' finest instead.

[Mouzafphaerre]

.
Telle! Long time no hear from the Occultus.
.

[Lemur]

Pricing announced. Comparable to Vista, across the board.

Of course if your place of business has a "dual use" license, the cost is zero. That's always nice.

[Beskar]

I have to admit, I hate the upgrade editions. As you have to have the previous installed to install the newer, but I like to reformat my computer, etc, if I am swapping the Operating System, thus, you are unable to do that.

[Furunculus]

i don't like windows, but i am a gamer so its a necessity, and all signs point to 7 actually being pretty good, much like XP Pro.

i supported the DX10 only move from Vista as a way of killing a decade of cruft, and i think we as gamers will reap the benefits via the DX10 superset more commonly known as DX11.

[caravel]

Ah well, I think I'll opt for a taste of Leonidas' finest instead.

I gave it a whirl a few days ago and I have to say I'm still not impressed with Fedora. Maybe I just miss the whole point of bloated and unstable alpha and beta software...? Personally I prefer Debian stable to anything else. There is a lot to be said for a distro that doesn't crap itself and break at the next kernel update...

[Tellos Athenaios]

Rawhide isn't for those who want a production system. Altough so far the Ubuntu and Kubuntu alphas have been good with me, and they are Debian Sid + some more [beta KDE 4.3, definitely worth it and Debian testing is still on 4.2.4 which is over 3 months old! ]. I tried Leonidas in Alpha too. On the upshot: palimpsest, plymouth and Anaconda (which combines the simplicity of the Ubuntu installer with similar flexibility as the Debian version when it comes to partitioning; and much more flexibility when it comes to selecting which apps to install). On the downside: packagekit's GNOME interface isn't really up to the task; and using yum from the command line is not a very pleasant experience either: for starters the package names are looooooong.

Running alpha software does have a major advantage w.r.t. the graphics drivers though. Doubt that Debian stable has KMS for intel cards or compositing support for ATI HD4870 in the ati driver yet.

[Husar]

look, and that's probably why most people ignore Linux, there are more versions than a normal person can remember and you have to try them all to find the one that suits you best, then tweak it for weeks, learn tons of written code to do that, then....
Or maybe that's just why I will prefer to use Win 7.

[Beskar]

I know that Ubuntu hates my computer (doesn't even load), I had to use Knoppix which looks rubbish and styled like Windows 95.

[caravel]

Running alpha software does have a major advantage w.r.t. the graphics drivers though. Doubt that Debian stable has KMS for intel cards or compositing support for ATI HD4870 in the ati driver yet.

I suppose it depends on what you want out of an OS and what you want to do with it. Personally I like Linux a lot but I want something that works and doesn't require me to dedicate days tinkering around. I've been through most major distros since 2002 when I started with Mandrake. Out of all of these I've dound Debian to be the most reliable and stable but even that has issues - yes it's out of date once it's stable, but what the hell Windows XP is out of date. The fglrx driver is a pain in the arse. I spent about 3 hours last night trying to get it running on Debian testing and failed. It's just not worth the hassle. Today I went and clean installed stable as that has always worked ok. The result was another disaster. Despite it fetching gnome from the repos during install, it wasn't installed and I've no idea why. Anyway the disc hit the wall and now I've reinstalled Windows XP. The result is that everything works. No more problems with wireless, no more glitches, crashes and general flakiness. I just don't have the time or patience to dedicate to Linux anymore - I must be getting old. I'm glad to hear it works for you though Tellos, stick with it.

[Tillan]

Some pretty heafty system requirements right there: 1GHz processor with 1GB RAM means what exactly to one-legged-hamster-powered netbooks?

Ah well, I think I'll opt for a taste of Leonidas' finest instead.

In actual fact, win 7 works surprisingly well on one-legged-hamster-powered netbooks, and I do mean surprisingly, I wasnt expecting it to install at all on mine (was expecting to run out of disk space) but it did, and it runs really well. Even without a page file.

[Lemur]

Sixty percent of businesses plan to skip Windows 7. Are they the same firms that took a pass on Vista? And what will gamers do, 'cause let's face it, we're the only ones who matter.

ScriptLogic Corp, which provides help to companies in managing their Microsoft Windows-based networks, sent out 20,000 surveys to information technology administrators to learn the state of the market.

Many companies have rejected Windows Vista as unstable. For example, the chip maker Intel Corp, Microsoft's long- time partner in producing personal computers, has stayed with the older XP system.

The survey found about 60 percent of those surveyed have no plans to deploy Windows 7, 34 percent will deploy it by the end of 2010 and only 5.4 percent will deploy by year's end.

[drone]

I would imagine that some of that 60% have already moved (or are in the painful process of moving) to Vista. Other factors may be the economy (why blow capital dollars on upgrading if stuff still works today and the future is uncertain), or the switch to open alternatives such as Linux or Solaris.

As for PC gamers, we don't actually matter any more. Microsoft essentially killed off that market niche with the XBox and the overall push towards console gaming.

[Lemur]

As for PC gamers, we don't actually matter any more.

The heck you say! I'm special!

[Furunculus]

ordered my copy of home premium for £49.99 from play.com today.

[Beskar]

They won't be able to not get Windows 7. It will be a case of Vista or Windows 7 and Win7 is far superior.

They are stopping support for XP.