Capo di Tutti Capi III [Concluded]

[El Diablo]

Vote Abstain

I still have not recieved any confirmation that my protection group worked from our host.

Does "inconclusive" mean that everyone got their order in but the person was not attacked and if not all the group got the order in there is no result pm?

[Myrddraal]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but were there not some townies in the last capo that were deemed "lucky" or some such and could survive a kill?

Yes.

About our supposed serial killer. I can't really remember that well, but I think I remember that the previous game's serial kills were of a reasonable length (i.e. not too long). My feeling is that a lot of effort has gone into that kill write up. A lot more than a busy game host would have time for. It also has the feel of a personalised kill.

Would a serial killer go to such great lengths? It seems to me that the only person who could be motivated to write such an elaborately crafted descriptions, with plenty of little red herring details to confuse and mislead is someone who wants to pass off the kill as the work of another. I propose that this kill was a mafia hit, and the mafia would really quite like us to think it was a serial killer.

[DJGingivitis]

vote: abstain

Trying to find something concrete to put my vote on.

EditL Also the kuni are an odd choice of weapons. Possible a signature.

[FactionHeir]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but were there not some townies in the last capo that were deemed "lucky" or some such and could survive a kill?

Hmmm I just found and read the last capo thread. You are right, people could get the lucky trait to survive night kills. However, both town, neutral and mafia had this ability so I guess it doesn't really mean much.

[Tratorix]

Vote: abstain. I'll hold off voting for a bit. The mafia were fairly inactive last night. I'm assuming they can investigate like they could last Capo? I would be odd for them to just waste a night of kills.

[Myrddraal]

Some more thoughts:

There's a large number of people abstaining. Worse yet, there are people abstaining without giving any other comment (I'm looking at you Jolt). Sounds like intentional lurking to me. A vote by the uninformed masses is random at worst. A vote by the informed minority always suits them.

The trenchcoat kill bears the hallmarks of a vigilante kill attempt, but perhaps that vigilante kill attempt failed but was quickly followed by a mafia kill which succeeded (the bomb in the car).

"Three point two seconds after turning the key, Quintus.JC was nearly half a block away and rapidly accelerating when the blast"

3.2 seconds makes it sound like a separate attempt to the tommy guns. What do we gain from knowing that there are vigilantes afoot? It invalidates group alibis, such as Andres' "Dutch_guy was protected last night by me, The Stranger and Moros." since that group could just as easily be the vigilantes/wise guys, hoping to gain innocent status.

Whatever the case, Andres claims a night action, which shows that none of those eating out last night are excluded from carrying out other actions that night.

My final point is more of a gut feeling really, but I couldn't help but notice the two votes for AVSM during chairman selection. If I remember correctly AVSM self voted, which was followed by a vote for him by ACIN.

If both AVSM and ACIN are mafia in the same family, maybe with AVSM as don, it might seem an easy mistake to make for ACIN to vote for his boss without thinking that it would identify him. This would seem particularly likely since AVSM seemed like an unpopular option.

I've got nothing better to go with for now, so I will Vote: AVSM

[Andres]

Yes.

About our supposed serial killer. I can't really remember that well, but I think I remember that the previous game's serial kills were of a reasonable length (i.e. not too long). My feeling is that a lot of effort has gone into that kill write up. A lot more than a busy game host would have time for. It also has the feel of a personalised kill.

Would a serial killer go to such great lengths? It seems to me that the only person who could be motivated to write such an elaborately crafted descriptions, with plenty of little red herring details to confuse and mislead is someone who wants to pass off the kill as the work of another. I propose that this kill was a mafia hit, and the mafia would really quite like us to think it was a serial killer.

Really, I don't see why a serial killer would not put a lot of effort in his kill write-up

[Seamus Fermanagh]

For your convenience, I have edited the summary thread so that post #1 now includes the rules of play and links to the previous Capo threads.

[seireikhaan]

People really need to stop abstaining and put forth real votes. Its impossible for people to get a proper judgement based on thread behavior, it cripples discussion, and it doesn't do a darn worth of good because there will be a lynch regardless of how many abstains there are. I'm sort of hoping Seamus put in a serial killer who's triggered by the first abstain.

[DJGingivitis]

Khaan. I would love to change my vote but as of right now I have no leads. I am working on who maybe the scummiest but other than that I have nothing. I would rather abstain then put my vote on a townie that would result in a kill.

[TinCow]

Digging a bit deeper, I think the killer of The Stranger is the Capo III version of the 'weather balloon' serial killer in Capo II. As GH noted, the Capo II version killed anyone who called themselves innocent. In TS's death write-up, we get this:

"Stranger, you promised death, chaos, and destruction, you spoke of harming the town as if it was a game. These minions of yours always cheered your words in the coffee house, deeming them “poetic” instead of blasphemous. You wished to set about events so that none could trust each other, and satiate their fears each day with spectacle. You all claim that which you shall not deliver, except unto yourselves. Before you are weapons of war, forged by man - it is with your own hand that you must now select one of those weapons, and kill those among you for the safety of the flock."

"He who has purged the others of life, shall be set free to live again, having earned their redemption. I shall watch from here, to insure that all goes as planned."

The first bit seems to refer specifically to this post by TS. This would fit with a 'reverse' version of the Capo II SK, someone who kills people who call themselves guilty or somehow threaten to kill or cause violence.

The second bit is interesting in conjunction with the two nameless non-players who are found dead with TS. I suspect that this has something to do with the killing power of the SK. The way it is written seems to indicate that two of the three would die, but the third would survive. This is verified in the write-up, where one of the non-players goes free. The use of the two non-player characters seems to me to be proof that no one except TS made the proper remarks to warrant the SK's attention. Thus, TS was the only person in the scene fighting for his life. I suspect that we will always see 3 people in this scenario, and one of them will always survive.

Based on the above, I very much urge people not to make joking comments about themselves being guilty, killing others, or committing other kinds of violence. Doing so may well get you killed.

[seireikhaan]

Khaan. I would love to change my vote but as of right now I have no leads. I am working on who maybe the scummiest but other than that I have nothing. I would rather abstain then put my vote on a townie that would result in a kill.

Then make a lead. There's almost never a good lead in the first round. Yet we still lynch someone. Waiting for leads will just kill discussion. Heck, go to random.org. Assign an integer to each player. Generate random integer. Vote for said person. Besides, there are actual things to discuss, such as these protection groups, why CA was in the writeup, why TC went for a solo protection, what Craterus was doing last night, etc...

[Moros]

The_stranger gets killed. He has french in it and references to Belgians we say. It almost seems as someone is trying to point towards me or Andres. TS would not be an unlikely kill, for both of us as well. hmm. It would be someone who would probably know us a bit so the obvious thing, except for poiting at me and Andres would be pointing at Dutch_guy. However who attacks people who are protecting him. He could obviously use us pretty well, by making us believe that he was towny. So it sounds not very convincing. That and the fact that we know dutch_guy for subtleness. If Louis, was playing I'd be thinking of him. But that seems not to be the case. Craterus is close with TS, maybe he used is insight on us?

Jolt and Diana also knew we were working together. Just as I knew they were. But then again that was obvious from communication on user profile, and logical as they form a little freind's group as well. Have I told and trusted them too much?

From an objective side of thing I'd consider this the more probable suspects, though I'm afraid I'm only helping the real killer by putting attention away from him. Either way list on the possible French/Belgian killer:
-Me
-Andres
-Dutch_guy
-Craterus?
-Diana
-Pizza
-Jolt

However this paragraph looks almost like an alibi:

Jolt, askthepizzaguy, Andres, and Dutch-guy had stopped off for a bite at a local Italian eatery near the convention center. Their tensions never quite eased as much as they had hoped, despite the excellence of the scallopini and liberal dosages of chianti. There wasn’t anything that you could point a finger at as being significant -- a periodic sense that others were nearby, a hint of something in the shadows as they’d walked to the ristorante, the unexpected convenience of 4 well-lit cabs waiting for them just as they exited the eatery – but all these little occurrences made it seem as though someone were watching over them. All’s well that ends well, but none of the four ever did totally relax.

So that leaves:
Me, Diana and craterus. However I find the latter (craterus) rather unprobable. I personally know that it wasn't me, so I'll vote Diana. Sorry girl, nothing personal. But though it's not a particular strong case, yet it's better than letting someone else die without any reason behind it.

Oh wait, I just realised that Diana was part of the Jolt, protection group. Jolt did you, or your partner, get any protection night results? If they are affirmative and Diana remained in the protection group, that leaves me and Craterus. Now for Craterus I have almost no case. SO that leaves me. Hmmm perhaps for my own sake, I shouldn't post this. But anyway maybe someone sees a flaw in my logic or might be able to take it further so I'll post it anyway. Who knows it might come in handy at a latter time. And if it kills me, well, at least noone with a special role has died.

In this case, I'll guess I'm doing a vote: abstain

[Andres]

Some more thoughts:

There's a large number of people abstaining. Worse yet, there are people abstaining without giving any other comment (I'm looking at you Jolt). Sounds like intentional lurking to me. A vote by the uninformed masses is random at worst. A vote by the informed minority always suits them.

True, but Jolt is a bad example as he interacted with me and thus contributed more than just casting an abstain vote.

3.2 seconds makes it sound like a separate attempt to the tommy guns. What do we gain from knowing that there are vigilantes afoot? It invalidates group alibis, such as Andres' "Dutch_guy was protected last night by me, The Stranger and Moros." since that group could just as easily be the vigilantes/wise guys, hoping to gain innocent status.

Whatever the case, Andres claims a night action, which shows that none of those eating out last night are excluded from carrying out other actions that night.

Planting a seed of doubt against your nemesis by insinuating that I was out vig killing instead of protecting? A baseless assumption, if I might add?

I don't "claim" a night action, I performed one. And we protected Dutch_guy.

My final point is more of a gut feeling really, but I couldn't help but notice the two votes for AVSM during chairman selection. If I remember correctly AVSM self voted, which was followed by a vote for him by ACIN.

If both AVSM and ACIN are mafia in the same family, maybe with AVSM as don, it might seem an easy mistake to make for ACIN to vote for his boss without thinking that it would identify him. This would seem particularly likely since AVSM seemed like an unpopular option.

I've got nothing better to go with for now, so I will Vote: AVSM

That's really bad reasoning for voting somebody.

1) allthough ACIN is new to these games, he wouldn't make the link between him and his supposed mafia partner so obvious. And no, saying "WIFOM" is not good enough.
2) You assume a link between ACIN and AVSM, because he selected AVSM? And not just a link, but a link between mafia and Don? That's reading a lot in such a minor event, isn't it?

Bad reasoning for vote + trying to create some doubt about the person who seems to have him on his radar + overall gut feeling; my vote sticks on you, Myrddraal. You're starting to smell fishy.

[Andres]

EDIT: In response to Moros' post.

GH knows some french and so does 'khaan; and they both know I'm belgian.

I wouldn't put it behind TinCow either. And there are probably even more who know a couple of french words.

Or it could be someone trying to frame those who know french.

Write-ups are nice and interesting and all, but I think analysing thread behaviour is more interesting. After all, the write-ups are written or at least influenced by the killers. Who else but scum, wannabe-scum and serial killers would go out killing on night 1? Why would we bother paying attention to what they wrote (if they wrote it themselves, Seamus); it's just there to confuse us.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

My gut tells me andres is guilty.

[Andres]

My gut tells me andres is guilty.

Your gut is wrong. Besides, if you gut tells you I'm guilty and if you, apparently, have nothing else to go on, then you should vote me.

[gibsonsg91921]

Vote: Abstain because if the glove doesn't fit, you must acquit.

[woad&fangs]

The use of French in the writeup is useless to us. Anyone can type a phrase into babelfish.

[Beskar]

Vote: Sasaki Kojiro

I offered to protect him in night phase, and he ignored my offer. he obviously must have known he won't be killed due to being a scummy Mafia-esque person.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Craterus: 2 (Lord Winter, Shinseikhaan)
Dutchguy: 1 (woad&fangs)
White_Eyes: 1 (Sasaki Kojiro)
Reenk Roink: 1 (GeneralHankerchief)
Scottishranger: 1 (Yaropolk)
Myrddraal: 1 (Andres)
Beefy: 1 (FactionHeir)
AVSM: 1 (Myrddraal)
Sasaki Kojiro: 1 (Beskar)

Abstain: 14 LittleGrizzly, atheotes, Askthepizzaguy, Chaotix, spL1tp3r50naL1ty, Iskander 3.1, Jolt, Diana Abnoba, slashandburn, El Diablo, DJGingivitis, Tratorix, Moros, gibsonsg91921


Tally needs to be double checked.

[Tratorix]

Vote: Sasaki Kojiro

I offered to protect him in night phase, and he ignored my offer. he obviously must have known he won't be killed due to being a scummy Mafia-esque person.

But there are 5 mafia families, so even the mafia could be killed.

[scotchedpommes]

I see few positives in doing away with people on the basis of gut feelings at the present time, [or any other] and am not overly keen on abstention.

Vote: No lynch

[Chaotix]

Unvote:Abstain
Vote: Andres

I will trust Sasaki's gut for now.

[Beskar]

but if I was Sasaki, I would have said "yes, do protection on me, as I am going to get night 1 killed" when he posted it in the thread. I got no reply what so ever.

Why didn't he reply, not even to say "thank you for the offer" ?

Seems suspicious that he wouldn't bother at all.

[Chaotix]

but if I was Sasaki, I would have said "yes, do protection on me, as I am going to get night 1 killed" when he posted it in the thread. I got no reply what so ever.

Why didn't he reply, not even to say "thank you for the offer" ?

Seems suspicious that he wouldn't bother at all.

Are you a doctor or something? Now you're the one who's going to be killed.

[Beskar]

No, you work with others to do protection. Or you not being town know about that?

[Chaotix]

No, you work with others to do protection. Or you not being town know about that?

I know about protection groups, but you seemed to have offered to protect Sasaki alone, which implied you were a doctor. However, I see I was mistaken.

[Beskar]

I withdraw my comments, as Sasaki is a very good guy and won't threaten me on secret accounts.

Unvote: Sasaki Kojiro

[Jolt]

There's a large number of people abstaining. Worse yet, there are people abstaining without giving any other comment (I'm looking at you Jolt).

As you wish.

I am abstaining because I see no reason to vote for anyone specifically.