Are wiccans a bunch of dillusionnal people?

**Meneldil** · 09-10-2009, 20:42

Now, I'm not going to quote any article or nothing.

I just happen to be faced by someone (my girlfriend) who is pretty found of the whole wiccan thingy. So bad that she plans to go to Ireland to find the 'roots' of this so-called religion.

Now, honestly, I'm tempted to tell her she's stupid sometimes, but honestly, what can I say? She keeps spouting the usual wiccan mumbo-jumbo (Wicca is the first religion on earth, it was practiced 4000 years ago. See, it's all written on these stones that nobody - but us - can read). I keep pointing her to historians who proved and prove all this is nothing short of crazy, she won't even try to rethink about it.

What's deeply saddening is that she's also bringing in the conversation things about Islam, Christianity while she obviously has no clue about it, and that I think I know more about Wicca after reading 2 articles on internet than she does after reading countless books on the topic.

Is there anyway I could definitely prove her wrong, or am I doomed to facepalm and roll my head over the keyboard each time she talks about it?

**Ronin** · 09-10-2009, 20:51

to quote the comedian Ron White..

'ya can´t fix stupid'

either put up with it or get a new girlfriend...someone so far off the deep end that she is actually planning a trip around fairy tales isn´t gonna be dissuaded by logic arguments.

**drone** · 09-10-2009, 21:19

Is this the same girl from Canada?

Might be time to bail on this one.

**Banquo's Ghost** · 09-10-2009, 21:48

I'm not very à la mode with Web 2.0, but I wouldn't call Wiccans delusional - it's just not a very accurate encyclopedia. And she doesn't need to come to Ireland to edit it.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:

**Louis VI the Fat** · 09-10-2009, 21:43

Buy a druid outfit and drive her around Bretagne.

You and her will be sure to enjoy it. Then near the end of the trip, she can ask you why you are not happy, and then she can manipulate you into submission again.

But seriously. Reason can not outlogic religion. It doesn't work, never. You'll just have to live with it.

**Samurai Waki** · 09-10-2009, 21:19

Actually Wicca isn't that old at all, roughly going into it's mid fifties. It was popularized by Gerald Gardner, as a counterpoint in Esoteric Practice such as the bit older Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn, and it's mean older brother Aleister Crowley's Ordo Templi Orientis. True the roots of the religion are ancient, but esotericism is also at the roots of Judaism, and therefore at the roots of Christianity. Wiccans, unlike the other Esoteric focused "religions" (a term which should be used loosely), focus primarily on influencing earth bound forces, which isn't any more dillusional than Christianity's belief in absolute love of Jesus Christ, and sacrifice of self in order to make the world a better place, and attain eternal bliss in the afterlife. The whole credo of Wicca is "an it harm none, do what ye will".

There isn't any official right way, or wrong way to believe in the basic tenets of Wicca, the foundation of the mythology isn't really that much different, than the triple aspect of god in Christianity (Father, Son, Holy Spirit) vs. Wicca's (Maiden, Mother, Crone) really just a reverse in "sexes". Then of course there is the "Horned God" that represents the male aspect of the religion, much like "Satan" represents the Female Aspect of Christianity. The exception of course, is that the Horned God isn't necessarily evil in nature, but represents the dangers of losing self in the fragile state of human mortality.

As far as the "magick" shpiel is concerned, and seems to be a major focus for Wicca fanboys/girls. From an atheist, or agnostic perspective it's definitely weird, or downright dillusional. However, it's not that much different than mass, congregation, blessing, and the strangely dillusional exorcisms that Christians, and particularly Catholics seem so fond of. The entire basis of Magick is forcing one's will upon another, to change certain events, obviously, everybody does this, whether they know it or not, through your will (human action and interaction) you can change the course of any number of string of events. The practice of magick is quite simply, and dissapointingly enough to any fanboy, a ritualized version of this. Of course, Wiccans believe that through the ritual, they may have a stronger influence on the events, but from an agnostic's perspective, it's really just intuitive foresight.

As far as dealing with Wiccans, or people on the cusp of believing Wicca. Most people grow out of it, but those that don't, you just have to take it, or leave it. I'm sorry Melendil, but fact and religion rarely agree with one another, especially in the mythology department. But you would be better served by letting her find out the answer for herself.

**Adrian II** · 09-10-2009, 21:51

Originally Posted by Meneldil

Is there anyway I could definitely prove her wrong, or am I doomed to facepalm and roll my head over the keyboard each time she talks about it?

I'm not going to tell you to dump her or not, that is entirely your business. But I would say that she is compensating for something. Find out what that is and try to address it. That's my two cents, in all modesty, because who are we to judge your personal issues.

**Meneldil** · 09-10-2009, 22:32

Wow, I've been writing a 5 pages long paper in which I quote various historians, sociologists, and even wiccans who reject the whole 'Wicca has been here forever' theory. I've even included a part about the Mithraic Mysteries (I hardly remember why now).

It was exhausting, but interesting. If she doesn't change her mind with that (and she won't), then I don't know what to do.
I'm now tempted to buy a book on this topic just to make sure I'm even more right than I think I am.

As for dumping her, I don't think dumping your relationship whenever you disagree on a certain topic is the best idea ever, 'cause I'm never going to find someone with whom I'll agree all the time.

Originally Posted by AdrianII

I'm not going to tell you to dump her or not, that is entirely your business. But I would say that she is compensating for something. Find out what that is and try to address it. That's my two cents, in all modesty, because who are we to judge your personal issues.

**Adrian II** · 09-10-2009, 22:59

Originally Posted by Meneldil

I'm now tempted to buy a book on this topic just to make sure I'm even more right than I think I am.

Please don't. Forget the book and everything you have read. Try to figure out what she's saying to you and others when she speaks of this wicca thingy. Not the words, the emotional message.

I know this sounds all touchy-feely like, but it has helped me understand people more than once when they acted as if they were off their rocker.