What changes would you support to our narcotics laws?

treat drugs like other drugs are currently treated in the UK.

alcohol/coffee/ibruprofen - freely available within quality control constraints to over eighteens.
harder drugs - prescription only.

it would marginalise the criminal element, ensure people get a consistently safe product, and bring revenue into the exchequer.

Originally Posted by Idaho

I would argue that a legal market is a controlled market. A black market is an uncontrolled market.

Yes but what would we be doing on the other side all that, we would be actively supporting some very sick people, there is a lot of tragedy at the other side of our supply. We can make rules here but we can't change the very nature of the trade it's from south America and those controlling it are scum, how exactly are you going to legalize it without destroying lives. I do not want to pay taxes for that.

Originally Posted by Fragony

Yes but what would we be doing on the other side all that, we would be actively supporting some very sick people, there is a lot of tragedy at the other side of our supply. We can make rules here but we can't change the very nature of the trade it's from south America and those controlling it are scum, how exactly are you going to legalize it without destroying lives. I do not want to pay taxes for that.

I'd assume that they'll only be selling drugs made by themselves... I'm sure the current medical suppliers are capable of making more than they are now with few problems.

EDIT: Btw, that's the reason I will never, ever touch any drug, no pot or anything. I don't want to support an industry that kills thousands every year.

Originally Posted by HoreTore

EDIT: Btw, that's the reason I will never, ever touch any drug, no pot or anything. I don't want to support an industry that kills thousands every year.

Do you drink? Drive a car? Eat fast food? Use power tools? Support any sort of political movement?

Originally Posted by Idaho

I would argue that a legal market is a controlled market. A black market is an uncontrolled market.

A fair point, but it begs the question of whether we want people buying cocaine at their corner shop. A number of young men have died in my home town from massive heart attacks, where use is prevelant.

I've also watched people turn into complete wastrels on hash.

Originally Posted by Idaho

I would argue that a legal market is a controlled market. A black market is an uncontrolled market.

Sorry, I used unclear terms. By "controlled", I meant illegal in the "classed" or "scheduled" context. Those that would become legalized like alcohol/nicotine would be subject to health and safety regulation and taxation.

Originally Posted by Strike For The South

Do you drink? Drive a car? Eat fast food? Use power tools? Support any sort of political movement?

Bah. Not even close.

Originally Posted by HoreTore

Bah. Not even close.

Well now you're just bloody lying. You don't drink?

Originally Posted by Strike For The South

Well now you're just bloody lying. You don't drink?

I am quite sure that my water company doesn't kill anyone.

Originally Posted by HoreTore

I am quite sure that my water company doesn't kill anyone.

Let me rephrase, DO YOU DRINK ALCOHOL?

Originally Posted by Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla

A fair point, but it begs the question of whether we want people buying cocaine at their corner shop. A number of young men have died in my home town from massive heart attacks, where use is prevelant.

I've also watched people turn into complete wastrels on hash.

I don't think there is anyone on any side of the debate who believes there is a way of stopping people wasting their lives one way or another. The question is now all about harm and cost reduction to the individual and to society. There is a middle ground between corner shop and the alley behind the corner shop.

Originally Posted by Fragony

Yes but what would we be doing on the other side all that, we would be actively supporting some very sick people, there is a lot of tragedy at the other side of our supply. We can make rules here but we can't change the very nature of the trade it's from south America and those controlling it are scum, how exactly are you going to legalize it without destroying lives. I do not want to pay taxes for that.

There is no reason why the cocaine market can't become expolitative and unfair in the same legitimated way the chocolate and coffee trade is.

Yes, and Aass brewery doesn't kill people either.

If people kill themselves by overuse of their products, then that's something else. That wasn't what I was talking about previously. The drug industry kills people to produce their products, something no brewery I know of does.

Interesting that no-one has supported the current policies and next to no-one supports 'more of the same only worse'.

It does leave the question of who our politicians are appealing to with their moribund approach?

Originally Posted by HoreTore

Yes, and Aass brewery doesn't kill people either.

If people kill themselves by overuse of their products, then that's something else. That wasn't what I was talking about previously. The drug industry kills people to produce their products, something no brewery I know of does.

Alcohol claims far more lives, directly and indirectly than all the illicit drugs put together x10.

Originally Posted by Furunculus

treat drugs like other drugs are currently treated in the UK.

alcohol/coffee/ibruprofen - freely available within quality control constraints to over eighteens.
harder drugs - prescription only.

By what rationale is alcohol not a hard drug?

Originally Posted by HoreTore

Yes, and Aass brewery doesn't kill people either.

If people kill themselves by overuse of their products, then that's something else. That wasn't what I was talking about previously. The drug industry kills people to produce their products, something no brewery I know of does.

Alcohol is highly habit forming and is very capable of killing someone just like cocaine.

All people kill themselves by overuse that's why it's called and overdose.

Originally Posted by Idaho

Alcohol claims far more lives, directly and indirectly than all the illicit drugs put together x10.

Originally Posted by Strike For The South

Alcohol is highly habit forming and is very capable of killing someone just like cocaine.

All people kill themselves by overuse that's why it's called and overdose.

Again, not what I'm talking about. Until I see a brewer doing a hit and run, I'll continue to drink. Until the drug industry stops doing hit and runs, I won't touch their pot.

Originally Posted by HoreTore

Again, not what I'm talking about. Until I see a brewer doing a hit and run, I'll continue to drink. Until the drug industry stops doing hit and runs, I won't touch their pot.

May I introduce you to Alphonse Capone?

The whole reason gangs are in the drug buisness is because it's illegal.

Originally Posted by Strike For The South

May I introduce you to Alphonse Capone?

The whole reason gangs are in the drug buisness is because it's illegal.

I have absolutely no plans to buy alcohol produced by Mr. Capone, for the very same reason I won't touch drugs.

Originally Posted by HoreTore

I have absolutely no plans to buy alcohol produced by Mr. Capone, for the very same reason I won't touch drugs.

Oh try it anyway they stuff a turkey and call it tradition, nothing wrong with it in small doses just certain death

Originally Posted by HoreTore

I have absolutely no plans to buy alcohol produced by Mr. Capone, for the very same reason I won't touch drugs.

Listen cowpoke, you're working backwards.

No legit buisness can deal in drugs because they are illegal.

This leads to a vaccum

This vaccum gets filled by peolpe who stab people

This vaccum turns into dog-eat-dog

The violence gets ramped up

By legalising the drugs these things will end, just like the mafia got out of the alcohol buisness.

Originally Posted by Strike For The South

Listen cowpoke, you're working backwards.

No legit buisness can deal in drugs because they are illegal.

This leads to a vaccum

This vaccum gets filled by peolpe who stab people

This vaccum turns into dog-eat-dog

The violence gets ramped up

By legalising the drugs these things will end, just like the mafia got out of the alcohol buisness.

Sure, I agree with all of that.

But as long as things remain the way they are, I'm not touching that stuff. If the situation changes, and it's sold by government outlets, for example, then the situation changes, of course(though I still doubt that I will try it, I love my beer).

Bottom line is; I'm not going to fill the coffers of a crook. No way Jose. Don't care how great his offer is, I won't take it.

Originally Posted by HoreTore

Sure, I agree with all of that.

But as long as things remain the way they are, I'm not touching that stuff. If the situation changes, and it's sold by government outlets, for example, then the situation changes, of course(though I still doubt that I will try it, I love my beer).

Bottom line is; I'm not going to fill the coffers of a crook. No way Jose. Don't care how great his offer is, I won't take it.

Why are we arguing?

Originally Posted by Strike For The South

Why are we arguing?

Because you're Texan.

Originally Posted by HoreTore

Because you're Texan.

Norweigan penis envy?

Originally Posted by Strike For The South

Norweigan penis envy?

Yeah.... You tiny Texans just can't come to terms with my might Norwegian boner...

But hey, given its incredible size, I don't blame y'all.

I fail to grasp the difference between the last two options. Plus does the UK's licensing system regards the sale of alcohol come under state control?

I think the backroom is about measuring your wits, not ~~ It is surpising how swiftly we moved from the opiates to sex... Tz-tz-tz...

Eating a pizza, unhealthy yet pleasurable
Riding a motorcyle, risky yet fun (I believ 16x more likely to die)
Drinking coffee, a stimulant, unhealthy

So being "unhealthy", "risky" or "a drug" is fine. But obviously the goverment has some responsibility.

About 5,000 people a year die in motorcyle accidents, and you are about twice as likely to die if you take a bike compared to a car. So that's 2,500 deaths a year the government could prevent by banning motorcyles. And all the extra injuries as well, probably 99% of motorcyle accidents result in injury. The rate of death is 66.7 per 100,000.

So if you support motorcyles being legal, should you support any drug being legal that has a death rate of 66.7 per 100,000 or less?

Some drugs have other concerns besides death, but I left the amputated arms and smashed in faces out of the motorcyle equation too because I didn't want to take the time to look it up.

If it's legal, it's not cool.

Originally Posted by HoreTore

Yeah.... You tiny Texans just can't come to terms with my might Norwegian boner...

But hey, given its incredible size, I don't blame y'all.

You misunderstood when they called you vi KING. you got pointy ears that's all.