Making money

[vladiator]

I read some of the threads on this board and cannot comprehend the sums of money some of you have in EB! Hundreds of thousands, even millions, mnei!

I play as Rome, and my empire includes Spain, most of the present-day France, all of the coastal and some of the inland Africa (just got Alexandria and Memphis in my last turn). Yet, on average my income is about 5,000 mnei per turn. Normally, my income goes up for a few turns after I conquer a city, but then goes down to the normal level.

I try to set my taxes at the highest possible level (without people revolting). When I have money, I build roads and ports. When I take over a large city, I normally enslave the population to limit the risk of a revolt (should I not be doing it?).

I would be grateful if you could share your tips regarding how to make money.

Another unrelated question -- I hear a FM can receive a nickname, e.g. Africanvs. What other nicknames are there and is there any info on how to get them?

Thanks.

[xypherx]

So I play many campaigns atm and no matter with which faction besides sweboz atm i gain quite a lot of mnai per term - in my makedon campaign (about 252bc) i get roughly about 16k and employing 5 armies of lower tier troops able to wander around and one which is filled with elite and higher tier units too crush foreign stacks. With pahlava carthage i get even much more per turn despite using mainly HA+heavy cav.
I usually rush for the provinces with mines or at least with their availability and coastal regions + i build up everything which is improving trade and reducing corruption to the maximum+ schools for my FM, I seldomly use allied kingdoms(type 4) i usually use type 3 governments or of course better ones, to ensure public order ASAP i employ spies and assassins (to kill foreign spies) in vast numbers, 1spy will cost you 100 mnai per turn but beeing unable to get rid of a trained foreign spy and keeping units as garrison will cost you usually 300mnai in many cases much more than that per turn. Ensure that u can oversee your territory, spawning rebels usually block trade routes which can have quite an impact on your economy i.e. blocked road to carthage's harbour will cost you in an early game about 2-3k trade revenue thats more than a upgraded mine can provide (except those being a very rich deposit). Selling trade rights + having them with every faction which is able to trade with you, if you aren't at war with them trade with 'em. When you are invading a province try to avoid sieges - your army will cause devastation to the land, when you extinct the population(or in EB enslave), you will have lower taxes + trade, and sometimes more unrest, but u don't need a huge force to supress them, depending on how far it's away from your capital you will have to know what is better for your plans, to have low pop+ low force present but for a longer time, or high pop+high revenues but stronger garrison in the beginning until the unrest lowers itself. Uprade towns ASAP to reduce the impact of the cultural difference, government building will reduce the mali for a good amount, try to train your FM in ways which are suitable for your expansional plans and let them get good traits and retinue, build marketplaces and trade+tax increasing temples and try to get their priests, do not underestimade the worth of law and populationgrowth, i usually use a normal or in very small towns very low tax rates to encourage the growth....
as long as not really needed try to avoid those colonies - I use them later on when i need to reduce the pop-growth in the huge cities and try to balance squalor+growth to secure public order but until then I want as many tax payer and trader as I can get.
Use as few troops as possible and those with the cheapest upkeep - I employ usually only one or two stacks with superior units but another 4-6(depending on how many fronts you have) with lower tier units which are effective with just 2 or 3 better units in the whole stack (rely on agile and high attack units - with missile support), and try to train them in the field - the more experience they have (remember 3xgold=9 attack+9def boni) the higher is their effectiveness - so i usually try to retrain every unit to keep their battle experience, some barbarian units or some assault units will hack their way through everything opposing like through butter no matter how many metal is on them. I like cavalry very much - sure their upkeep seems annoying but in the end they are real moneysavers due to their effectiveness in battle, and on the campaign map, good trained cav will smash even the heaviest troops which might otherwise will cost u a lot of man+mnaipower to overcome.
Disband unused units, kill ineffektive FMs so that they cannot spread their ill genes through your empire, even when the tooltip says there is no upkeep for FM there is an upkeep - at least in my sweboz games I dunno why.
Reposition your capital to reduce unrest+corruption. Play battles on your own to reduce losses and get better retinue and traits.

You get those nicknames due to some faction related aims which you reach at certain points and of your behavior - or the behavior of your generals.

[Luis Sera]

My epeirote campaign has 80k per turn because i employ 1 army to do all my dirty work while garrisons of 2 pikemen and 2 archers can keep the town in check and hold off any enemies. I give money away because i have so much! Trade via ports (greece is big on this) and mines are the best for money making. You may be employing WAY too many units or too many elites in garrisons when you can just employ levy spearman and the like in safe provinces

[Mulceber]

I read some of the threads on this board and cannot comprehend the sums of money some of you have in EB! Hundreds of thousands, even millions, mnei!

I play as Rome, and my empire includes Spain, most of the present-day France, all of the coastal and some of the inland Africa (just got Alexandria and Memphis in my last turn). Yet, on average my income is about 5,000 mnei per turn. Normally, my income goes up for a few turns after I conquer a city, but then goes down to the normal level.

I try to set my taxes at the highest possible level (without people revolting). When I have money, I build roads and ports. When I take over a large city, I normally enslave the population to limit the risk of a revolt (should I not be doing it?).

I would be grateful if you could share your tips regarding how to make money.

Another unrelated question -- I hear a FM can receive a nickname, e.g. Africanvs. What other nicknames are there and is there any info on how to get them?

Thanks.

If you're making that that little money per turn, you probably have one (or several) of the following problems:

*poor economic development: How many markets, mines and agricultural upgrades are you building? Are you just building MIC's, or are you investing significantly in these types of buildings? These buildings are necessary to fund large-scale armies.
*too many troops: try going around the map and dismantling any units that are not part of an active army or are COMPLETELY NECESSARY to garrison a city. Especially look to get rid of mercenaries, their upkeep is killer.
*Navies: these are expensive. Whenever I play a campaign, my first move is to dismantle any navies I have. Most of them are poor quality and are dead weight when trying to build your economy.
*Taxes: try jacking up the taxes as high as they will go without public order going below 100%.

These are just a few ideas. Most likely, imo, your problem is largely due to economic development, although the other factors could be playing in as well.

Oh and re: cognomina (or as you put it, nicknames), those come to a family member who has gone a particularly long way toward conquering a foreign people (eg. in my last Romani campaign, the man who conquered Gaul, Decimus Iulius Caesar, received the cognomen "Gallicus"). My best advice on getting nicknames (as well as triumphs) is have one general fight most of your battles in a given region. The rest will come on its own. -M

[vladiator]

Thank you gentlemen!

Yes, I think my problems are the number of units and the lack of economy-developing buildings. It is partly due to having to fund constant wars on three fronts (Spain, Gaul and Africa), therefore, not having enough money for building the necessary economy buildings.

[Rahl]

Especially look to get rid of mercenaries, their upkeep is killer.

Mercenaries are expensive when you hire them, but their upkeep isn't higher then that of normal units.

@vladiator
If you are able to get some spare money due to this tips you should build mines in Spain and the alps (maybe illyria?) especially in provinces with 2 or 3 mines. They givean enormous boost to your economy.

[Cambyses]

Also watch for corruption. That can get really high in cities that are a long way from the capital or have bad governors. So build the +law buildings. They often do more for your income than anything else.

[Mulceber]

Mercenaries are expensive when you hire them, but their upkeep isn't higher then that of normal units.

@vladiator
If you are able to get some spare money due to this tips you should build mines in Spain and the alps (maybe illyria?) especially in provinces with 2 or 3 mines. They givean enormous boost to your economy.

That really hasn't been my experience - I've found that, typically, mercenary upkeep is more expensive - which makes sense: these guys are demanding a pretty penny for their expert services. -M

[Blxz]

Law is incredibly important, I aim for that almost to the exclusion of anything else. Also, I will make sure that every single town is building somehting each turn, EVERY turn. If this means I have a small army then fine, but just keep building stuff. Thats where the real strength of your empire forms. So up until about 250BC I have nothing but the starting level MIC's (barracks) and crappy armies composed of skirmishers and whatever melee unit I can find. Generally no cavalry unless I started with some. After that you will have considerable wealth and can start a real modernisation of your military to fund your expansion.

Also, keep in mind that recruiting a general from a Lvl 4 government is very expensive. They cost anywhere from 500mnai for the celtic footmen up to well over 1000 per turn. This will only pay off for distant and very difficult to run towns that would require massive armies to garrison. Be cheap and stingy until you build your wealth.

[vartan]

That really hasn't been my experience - I've found that, typically, mercenary upkeep is more expensive - which makes sense: these guys are demanding a pretty penny for their expert services. -M

Only when you hire them. Upkeep of equivalent units are calculated in the same manner as non-mercenary units. Only the hire fee is higher because of the merc tax, or the merc fee, whatever you wish to call it.

[Madoushi]

I find the bigger a city gets, the less money it brings in (???). No matter how well economically developed, cities with over 10,000 people always earn negative amounts of money, often times with my capital city earning negative several thousand mnai a turn, regardless of Public Order, law, ports, roads. I'm not sure if it is because the cities are directly paying for the upkeep of any troops they've raised or what.

[vladiator]

Madoushi -- I think that's the explanation I read somewhere. The city still makes money to you, but because cities pay for the upkeep of the troops in proportion with its size, the income is shown as negative.


BTW, I have used the tips given to me here and the economy of my empire has greatly improved. I went through all my settlements and disbanded unnecessary units. Doing this in some cities demanded a similtaneous lowering of the taxes, but often the net outcome was positive (i.e. the saving from disbanding a settlement's units would more than cover the lower income from taxes).

I had quite a few money from enslaving Alexandria and Memphis and I used them to build better roads, farms, ports, schools, etc. Now every settlement is building something.

The income I receive from each turn is now about 25,000 - 35,000 mnei!

[Olaf The Great]

Also watch for corruption. That can get really high in cities that are a long way from the capital or have bad governors. So build the +law buildings. They often do more for your income than anything else.

This is also why the +law temples are the best.