EB Online EDU v2.1 - RELEASE!

**Kival** · 07-15-2011, 21:54

Originally Posted by -Stormrage-

i think the best proposal for getting imperial archers, which are not sheilded, to die realistically to slinger fire would be to decrease all archer unit armour.

Sorry, but you do not understand how armour values are calculated. You have a formula for that (Like this helm +2, chainmail +6, etc.). This are all just imaginary numbers but you should get the basic. Imperial archers get the exact amount of armour which is calculated for their equipment. For some units it's more difficult because they did not all have the same equipment but for the imperial archers it's fairly easy because they are very much uniformed in comparison to other units. So one could reduce armour for *all units* if you change the formula (for the example it would be perhaps only +1 for helm, +5 for chainmail). It would be wrong to give two units with the same armour different armour values!

I want you to put yourself in my situation, as saba i got 8 slingers witch chevrons for the sole purpose of killing the imperial archers of my enemy, so i come to the feild with 8 slings my opponent 4 imperial archers, i move my slingers to the side so 4 of my slingers target one of his imperial archers and the rest cant attack me. i make them run to attack the unshelded helpless archers. i look at 4 slingers discharging their stones i move to the imperial archer unit expecting it to get devestated. long story short they got 3 kills and got butchered.

That's not normal. One slinger unit does not get butchered by any archer unit and landed only 3 kills until he's butchered. They can surely lose but they don't do nothing in dozens of volleys.

**-Stormrage-** · 07-15-2011, 22:01

i made them attack a volley each thats 4 slingers, they got 3 kills so i pulled them the hell out of there and got butchered as they were retreating, so on top of archers getting more armour they also got more range. we will wait until GG2 gets here and ask him what to do.

**Kival** · 07-15-2011, 22:19

Originally Posted by -Stormrage-

i made them attack a volley each thats 4 slingers, they got 3 kills so i pulled them the hell out of there and got butchered as they were retreating, so on top of archers getting more armour they also got more range. we will wait until GG2 gets here and ask him what to do.

How many units do you want to be killed by one volley? Be precise.

**vartan** · 07-16-2011, 00:36

First, slingers should not be able to take out archers. You shouldn't be aiming at archers with your slingers to begin with. Second, even if changes are to be made, it isn't to the archers, it's to the slingers. By the way, you could give any unit the lowest attack integer of 1 and they'd still kill. If I understand the system correctly, it has a minimum chance to kill. There's a reason why even if your attack is lower than the enemy's armour, you can still kill that enemy. It isn't as straightforward as attack minus defense.

**-Stormrage-** · 07-16-2011, 00:45

4 slingers SHOULD be able to DEVASTATE armoured archers VARTAN>\, especially since the archers in question have no hseild just tons of armour. I think the base attakc of the slingers hsould be raised to increase the chance of a kill on impact. i mean with 240 stones falling down on 80 men and only 3 dye, some of the stones must have hit them en but the men didnt die becuase they have so much armour. so that the man dies on impazt or atleast a 50 percent chance of death. 3 kills out of a possible 240 thats insane where the hell did the other rocks go lol. im assuming some stones hit but didnt do anything to the archer is that the way it should work ?

**Kival** · 07-16-2011, 00:47

Originally Posted by vartan

First, slingers should not be able to take out archers. You shouldn't be aiming at archers with your slingers to begin with.

I'd slightly disagree here, against heavy archers it's actually not a bad idea to use slingers.

Originally Posted by -Stormrage-

im assuming some stones hit but didnt do anything to the archer is that the way it should work ?

Sure. Some attacks does not even hit (that's for missiles only), most attacks are stopped by armour, shield and defense (that's for melee only) and some attacks do not kill but only throw the enemy down (that's for melee only). That's the system. It would be crazy if every hitting stone would kill the unit.

Just to let you know: It's mentioned that in fact the imperial archers used shields, they should get MORE defense against missiles not less.

EDIT: Every reduction of armour would make the archer weaker against everything not only against slingers.

**vartan** · 07-16-2011, 00:58

Originally Posted by Kival

I'd slightly disagree here, against heavy archers it's actually not a bad idea to use slingers.

Trust me. You don't want to attack any archers with your slingers, unless you want to lose all of your slingers. Do you want to lose all of your slingers? That's the question. When you have a 60 man slinger unit against an archer unit of 80 men that was born to kill those 60 men of yours, is it really worth losing your 60 men and up to 600 or so mnai investment, only to take out 100 or 200 mnai worth of archers (a handful of men)?

**Kival** · 07-16-2011, 01:36

Originally Posted by vartan

Trust me. You don't want to attack any archers with your slingers, unless you want to lose all of your slingers. Do you want to lose all of your slingers? That's the question. When you have a 60 man slinger unit against an archer unit of 80 men that was born to kill those 60 men of yours, is it really worth losing your 60 men and up to 600 or so mnai investment, only to take out 100 or 200 mnai worth of archers (a handful of men)?

Perhaps this actually is what I want. The archers would devestate my more valuable units perhaps and it seemd to be useless to use a bad archer unit against them. It will have no chance at all, I thought, but now I've reconsidered it and the difference is not that big. I thought it would be like 3 vs 10 for the bad archer or 2 vs 5 for the chevroned slinger but one could actually chevron the bad archer and get a 4vs10 which would be the same as 2vs5.

**-Stormrage-** · 07-16-2011, 07:15

Trust me. You don't want to attack any archers with your slingers, unless you want to lose all of your slingers. Do you want to lose all of your slingers? That's the question. When you have a 60 man slinger unit against an archer unit of 80 men that was born to kill those 60 men of yours, is it really worth losing your 60 men and up to 600 or so mnai investment, only to take out 100 or 200 mnai worth of archers (a handful of men)?

Ok, Vartan what if it is not a 60 man slinger against a 80 man archer, what if it is 240 slingers VS. 80 archers? and when you say archers are BORN TO KILL THESE MEN. The fact is VARTAN! that slingers are like wise born to kill this type of archer, does the word anti Armour mean anything to you. As archers are BORN to kill light units, slingers are likewise BORN to kill heavy unsheided units. As you stated the archers are doing what they are supposed to be doing slingers are getting devastated by archer fire, but our problem is heavy archers are NOT getting scratched by slingers. you claim that 80 man archers were born to kill 60 man slingers and i agree but are 240 slingers not born to kill 80 man archers?

**-Stormrage-** · 07-16-2011, 00:48

I have a friend that has experience with EDU's ill ask him about this .Maybe it is something more complicated then armour or attack maybe it has something to do with velocity, mass, weight ,(etc.), of the stone itself.