[EB MP]3.0 Thread - Testing and Updates

[Aulus Caecina Severus]

@ACS,Vega; Guys, stop whining. stop blaming your losses on the EDU. Fact is you people get beaten by more mobile and versatile opponents, instead of ranting about your units, get better. Its getting pathetic now. We are not the campaign AI so dont expect us to sit there , soak up pila and then attack 100 man cohorts in guard mode with whatever in the face.

/rant

LazyO,TCV; Guys, please, respect the opinions of others, without saying "pathetic" and clapping ironically.
Otherwise you two will do a new edu and only you two will play it.

We want to improve the edu to make it realistic and have fun, every suggestions are precious.

The thing that I'm saying is that some romani units were weakened compared to the original edu.
So I think this is not the right way for having a good balance between factions in game.
This is my suggestion, nothing else.

[Lazy O]

What I see, is constant complaining of supposed underpowerement (new word, yay) of Roman Units which does not even exist.

[vartan]

@ACS,Vega; Guys, stop whining [...]

Was this really necessary...? I am disappoint.

I could say something but i promised vartan that i will not, this is insulting me and ACS, and you dont have to be genius to win vs spqr like i wasnt when i played with gauls vs boar i atacked cohorts they trows pila and they was in guard mode that was useles cohorts routed after losing 15 men, the fact is that they are bad and slow killers and that symbol of SPQR rout after 10% lost army

I actually explained my analysis of that battle in detail in the Hamachi chat. Firstly, let me correct you in that WorldlyBoar's legions were mostly, if not all, out of guard mode. That's the first thing I looked for when I was reviewing the battle. It was my conclusion that due to a lack of first cohorts and a general, the Roman army was simply asking to have its morale lowered to the point where entire units would rout. It was simply a matter of time until the first routed. After that point, not only do you have a double-scare, but now you lose morale because your brothers-in-arm beside you are running for their lives.

LazyO,TCV; Guys, please, respect the opinions of others, without saying "pathetic" and clapping ironically.
Otherwise you two will do a new edu and only you two will play it.

We want to improve the edu to make it realistic and have fun, every suggestions are precious.

The thing that I'm saying is that some romani units were weakened compared to the original edu.
So I think this is not the right way for having a good balance between factions in game.
This is my suggestion, nothing else.

Romans were strengthened compared to the original EDU. The most important thing is their sword, and that was improved to kill more often (its lethality for instance is improved).

Also, if suggestions are so precious, please reconsider what you think about increasing heavy cavalry mass. Remember, we wish to simulate history better by making the exploitation of heavy cavalry less possible (cannot completely exterminate it). By this we mean to allow a cavalry commander a decisive charge (or two) that really matter, after which point you should not be able to keep hitting and running as if you're running on 500 horsepower. It's a horse carrying kilo after kilo of armour, not a Lamborghini (not that I like Lambos).

What I see, is constant complaining of supposed underpowerement (new word, yay) of Roman Units which does not even exist.

Do you mean to say people may be unintentionally contributing with deception? You need to give the benefit of the doubt and consider that the player is not informed (or has not reviewed) the changes in question. And I think it's underpowerment*

[vartan]

Because I love you guys so much.

[Lazy O]

Yea it was necessary. Like vega complains something is wrong every single match.

[gamegeek2]

The suggested money amount for testing is 40000 mnai. For the new big Tier 2 units, you need it. Also expect an update later today.

First cohorts may seem expensive at first glance; but have a closer look. They not only carry a command eagle, they are veteran versions of regular cohorts; meaning they have superior javelin accuracy and fighting ability. With 16 morale, they are very difficult to rout, and inspire the rest of your army.

Notice also the option of bringing an expensive, but extremely powerful Praetorian unit. With 100 men, they will be the largest elite infantry unit in the game. They cost 3400 mnai but have devstatingly good accuracy with the javelin and excellent skills up close (they have 14 attack/0.15 leth and 29 defense!)

[antisocialmunky]

Would it be possible to make the veteran unit a smaller but veteran version of the 1st cohort? Afterall, they are the super experienced battled hardened guys and they don't seem to play that way in the old EDU.

Praetorians while somewhat historically fanciful are a really devastating assault infantry. As of right now, Rome plays a lot like a faster version of KH.

@TCV. There's a difference between criticizing someone's idea like you and saying your opinion doesn't matter because you write it off as whining. More directed at LazyO than you because you have a point about ACS ignoring you and no one likes that.

[Vega]

I wrote something wrong so i just edited post to you guys dont see it lol P.S gg2 you dont believe me but i like your edu :DD
Maybe some fixing with nietos price :DD

[gamegeek2]

UPDATE: Pontos, Hayasdan, Sauromatae, Pahlava, and Sweboz added. Goidilic and Galatian units also added.

[gamegeek2]

I have updated the OP with the Ptolemaic, Baktrian, and Seleukid units. I'm sorry I didn't finish the Saka, but it's 2AM here in the USA and I want to get this thing out so that our European players can have a crack at it before I get home later today.

I didn't check it thoroughly because it's so late, and (as always) if you find problems, please inform me as soon as possible. Thanks!

[gamegeek2]

Just updated with a few quick corrections to the Taxilan Agema, Peltastai Indohellenikoi, and AS/Ptolly bodyguards.

[gamegeek2]

Apparently I didn't upload the right EDU file last time...whoops! It's now up front.

[gamegeek2]

I have once again updated the EDU without the Saka, because I am frankly concerned about the power level of the Saka were I to stat them right now. I feel further testing is most definitely required before I complete the EDU with this very important faction.

UPDATED 10:52 PM

[The Celtic Viking]

LazyO,TCV; Guys, please, respect the opinions of others, without saying "pathetic" and clapping ironically.
Otherwise you two will do a new edu and only you two will play it.

Sarcastically.

Anyway, if you don't want your opinion to be criticized, then keep it to yourself. If you go public with it and suggest that we make changes that will affect others, then you should expect that other people might have their own opinions as well. It just won't do to give your opinion and then cry foul when someone disagrees.

We want to improve the edu to make it realistic and have fun, every suggestions are precious.

The thing that I'm saying is that some romani units were weakened compared to the original edu.
So I think this is not the right way for having a good balance between factions in game.
This is my suggestion, nothing else.

I have given you my criticism of your suggestion, which you have completely ignored twice now. See, that's what annoys me: your attempts to shift the focus anywhere but to my arguments. It seems to be an attempt to obfuscate the fact that you can't answer my points, because that would mean that I could actually be right. Which would mean that the arguments you've made would be invalid.

And that's just not possible.

[-Stormrage-]

I move to Give ALL archers Poor morale. This will cause them to insta rout at cav charges which is historical. An archer in the feild of battle would *** in his pants when he sees cav running towards him. The current system makes it so u need 2 cav charges to rout even the persian archers.

[Ludens]

Anyway, if you don't want your opinion to be criticized, then keep it to yourself.

This is absolutely true, but you can still criticise someone without getting disrespectful. If you can't say it politely, don't say it at all. That applies even when the other guy is talking nonsense.

[vartan]

I move to Give ALL archers Poor morale. This will cause them to insta rout at cav charges which is historical. An archer in the feild of battle would *** in his pants when he sees cav running towards him. The current system makes it so u need 2 cav charges to rout even the persian archers.

The problem with this is that missiles on skirmish mode would not receive any charges at all. Units could only pursue them. Hence, you still have to rely on using a relatively high attack, lethal unit (such as overhand spear light cavalry) in order to take out missile units.

This is absolutely true, but you can still criticise someone without getting disrespectful. If you can't say it politely, don't say it at all. That applies even when the other guy is talking nonsense.

Yes. Thankfully, we have not had any disrespect in this thread (you know what I mean, dearest Ludens). As for nonsense, a friend once said that nonsense can only be fought against with nonsense. Perhaps. But no worries, you won't see that in this thread.

[-Stormrage-]

I still insist Archers be given poor morale. Not all players use skirmish mode and if an archer is pursued by a cav it will rout almost immediately after a few seconds of engagment which is how it should be.

Poor morale to Archers.

and could more units have Bonus fighting cav in 3.0 ?

[gamegeek2]

I still insist Archers be given poor morale. Not all players use skirmish mode and if an archer is pursued by a cav it will rout almost immediately after a few seconds of engagment which is how it should be.

Poor morale to Archers.

and could more units have Bonus fighting cav in 3.0 ?

Missile Morale is being addressed in the upcoming update, which will make some other missile changes and add the Getai.

[Burebista]

Missile Morale is being addressed in the upcoming update, which will make some other missile changes and add the Getai.

Just don't nerf them please :) . Finally they are a viable faction , and only thanks to the Balcanic merc celts.
Suggestions for Getai :
Galla-thraikes and Taxeis triballoi are prety weak for their cost
We don't have a good AP unit. Maybe bump Pelekyphoroi Komatai ( 8 Att 16 Def no jav) a little? 100 unit size or smthing?
Drapanai ...just BAD
Ischiroi Orditon ...useless