Speaking of Israel...

[Husar]

I think one can have that thought without wanting to get rid of jews.

Even the "christ killer" argument is silly because if you care a lot about christ, you should know that he wouldn't want you to avenge him.

Nonetheless I find it strange how so many Christians support jews per default even though the jews reject Jesus as the messiah. Does that mean if I convert from Christianity to judaism I still go to heaven but can follow completely different rules?

[Hooahguy]

Bear in mind, the people who allowed Israel to be founded were Christians, the people in the West now think like Christians even if they are not. Christian thought says that it is better to die than to do evil, and that you turn the other cheek when someone hurts you.

Jewish though demands and eye for an eye - one straw poll I saw on Youtube had a lot of Israeli Jews saying "yes, they believed in vengeance". You'd never get anyone in Western Europe or the US saying "yes, let's take revenge on those people."

Its one thing to say that Christian theory detests violence, but then you look at the Spanish Inquisition, the thousands of religious pogroms incited by how the Jews killed Jesus and other things like that, and finally the Holocaust where most Christian leaders stayed silent as millions were murdered, and you wonder why Jews as a people tend not to trust other people who arent within the fold? Undoubtedly Christian-Jewish relations have improved over the past 70 years but the distrust will always be there. Is that a fault in the way that the Jewish community thinks? Absolutely. But is that kind of distrust expected? Absolutely.

And I think you overestimate the way that other people in the West thinks when it comes to vengeance. Just look at post 9/11, everyone was clamoring for vengeance and Im sure there are examples of that in Europe as well.

So, when this argument is put forward - I've seen it before - it basically tells the Christianised populations in Europe etc. that the Jews are not actually "like us" and that they are not forgiving, that they will take the worst possible lesson from a bad situation.

The problem is that the way Israel is reacting is how Europe would react to things like this before the whole human rights idea took hold. Judaism as a culture is very big on memory, and has many prayers and songs how through the generations "they" tried to kill the Jews but we survived. So its a very "survivor" mentality which feeds into this idea that now that Jews finally have a state to call their own, they will fight tooth and nail to keep it safe from all threats, and right now the biggest threat are the Palestinians. So what do they do? They take the lessons that were learned from centuries of persecution and apply it to that threat.

Nonetheless I find it strange how so many Christians support jews per default even though the jews reject Jesus as the messiah. Does that mean if I convert from Christianity to judaism I still go to heaven but can follow completely different rules?

From my understanding its from the thought that if all Jews go back to Israel it will trigger the messiah coming or something along those lines.

[Rhyfelwyr]

From my understanding its from the thought that if all Jews go back to Israel it will trigger the messiah coming or something along those lines.

Yeah its kind of funny, you have these Christians pushing the Zionist agenda so that their messiah will come back, but then you have the ultra-religious Jews opposing it because they believe their messiah has got to come before they can return in the first place.

It is only American-type Evangelicals that believe that sort of stuff by the way, the historic position within mainstream Christianity never advocated such thought. This is because these (largely) American 'dispensationalists' believe that God has continually dealt with humanity through various separate 'dispensations' of his grace, and so the promises given to the church are separate and co-exist with the promises given to the Israelites. The traditional view on the other hand known as 'covenant theology', is that that Jesus himself, and by consequence the church, are actually the fulfilment of the promises given to the Israelites, rather than a something separate in their own right.

This is why dispensationalists are eagerly awaiting for a literal third temple to be built to make sacrifices (in accordance with prophecy), while adherents of covenant theology believe that Jesus himself was that third temple and the last ultimate sacrifice (thus fulfilling the prophecy). I would say the latter view makes more sense in light of John 2: 19-21:

"Jesus answered them, “Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days.” They replied, “It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and you are going to raise it in three days?” But the temple he had spoken of was his body."

Anyway, these differences are why dispensationalists believe the Jews must return to their land and build their temple, but all that is irrelevant to those who believe in covenant theology. Sometimes people try to play the anti-semitism card against covenant theology beliefs and slander it as 'replacement theology', as if the church replaces Israel. But this is a misrepresentation because they would believe that the church is the fulfilment of the promises to Israel, not a replacement. And in fact the truth is that covenant theology offers the Jews a higher standing in Bible prophecy, since they believe that the prophetic in-bringing of the Jews prior to the apocalypse is not a physical in-bringing into an area of land, but a spiritual in-bringing into the church that will see them gain an everlasting inheritance. This is why, admist the apocalypticism of the British Civil War, Oliver Cromwell re-invited Jews into Britain to be part of his 'godly republic', after they had been expelled hundreds of years previously.

Now, it is partially because of the misrepresentations of covenant theology that the Israeli government was enraged at a report by the Church of Scotland on the promised land issue. I say partially because frankly solid theology wasn't at the heart of that report, the Church of Scotland has been infested with liberals including those of the unquestioning 'free Palestine' mentality who thought they would go a little beyond the bounds of theology and include a wee critique of Israeli government policy. But theological misunderstandings were still partly to blame.

Not sure why I ended up writing all that, hopefully it will maybe give a broader understanding of the Christian position on the issue.

[Idaho]

The average age of Gazans is 17. It's one of the youngest populations in the world. Quarter of a million are under 10.

Respected British news anchor makes a plea for the children of Gaza. Well worth 3 minutes of your time:

[Fragony]

The average age of Gazans is 17. It's one of the youngest populations in the world. Quarter of a million are under 10.

So what, is it Israel's fault that they drop one every 9 months, they breed like rabbits over there. Get less kids, less get killed by being used as human shields.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

So what, is it Israel's fault that they drop one every 9 months, they breed like rabbits over there. Get less kids, less get killed by being used as human shields.

Where to begin with this one....hmmmm.....nope, not worth it.

[Fragony]

Where to begin with this one....hmmmm.....nope, not worth it.

Oh noes disaproval is mine. If it wouldn't be for the billions of aid they would starve to death instead of being collateral damage. They are the victims of the war Hamas wages on Israel, not the victims of Israel's retaliations. At least it's quiker. Hamas needs dead kids more than a junkie needs crack and they make damn sure that as many as possible get killed.

Pallywood.

[drone]

The average age of Gazans is 17. It's one of the youngest populations in the world. Quarter of a million are under 10.

Respected British news anchor makes a plea for the children of Gaza. Well worth 3 minutes of your time:

This guy knows nothing.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

But seriously, if the demographics are accurate the next generation of Gazans will be a serious problem for the Israelis.