..Thoughts on the game, bugs and patches

**SpencerH** · 03-08-2005, 12:57

Originally Posted by Old Celt

I disagree that the siege bug is crippling. It is a serious bug, yes, but there is a simple workaround, and so the game is still playable until such time as a patch or expansion can be gotten for it. I don't think it is any worse than the primary/secondary bug, and that wasn't crippling. But to hear some people talk, you would have thought that was the worst bug ever discovered.

Leaving the game continuously turned on is not a realistic workaround.

**Old Celt** · 03-08-2005, 15:52

I don't disagree that CA is responsible for the bugs. I do disagree that the siege bug was introduced with the patch. Testing suggests it has been present since 1.1, and perhaps even with 1.0, but I haven't read conclusive evidence for the status of 1.0.

I understand that leaving the machine running might not be feasible for some people, but it is simple and effective. Also, the AI does get back on track after a reload, so it's not like it's broken for good when you do need to load it.

No, I'm not saying customers should be responsible for fixing anything. What I'm saying is that we can help ourselves if we choose, rather than just waiting for these jokers to do something. I don't know about you, but I'd rather fix what can be fixed now, because I like the game and don't want to wait for October to get better gameplay. It isn't good, but it is preferable to the alternatives of not playing at all or living with the pain.

A fix for the horse archer problem was posted on this forum about a month ago. It involves changing ONE word in the unit description file for each of the affected units, and those units are listed with the fix. If you cannot find the fix in this forum, I can dig up a copy of it and post it back here, but that might take some time.

**Quillan** · 03-08-2005, 16:05

The fix for the horse archers is stickied over at www.twcenter.net , though I forget just which forum it's in.

**tai4ji2x** · 03-08-2005, 16:09

Originally Posted by Old Celt

I don't disagree that CA is responsible for the bugs. I do disagree that the siege bug was introduced with the patch. Testing suggests it has been present since 1.1, and perhaps even with 1.0, but I haven't read conclusive evidence for the status of 1.0.

I understand that leaving the machine running might not be feasible for some people, but it is simple and effective. Also, the AI does get back on track after a reload, so it's not like it's broken for good when you do need to load it.

No, I'm not saying customers should be responsible for fixing anything. What I'm saying is that we can help ourselves if we choose, rather than just waiting for these jokers to do something. I don't know about you, but I'd rather fix what can be fixed now, because I like the game and don't want to wait for October to get better gameplay. It isn't good, but it is preferable to the alternatives of not playing at all or living with the pain.

A fix for the horse archer problem was posted on this forum about a month ago. It involves changing ONE word in the unit description file for each of the affected units, and those units are listed with the fix. If you cannot find the fix in this forum, I can dig up a copy of it and post it back here, but that might take some time.

- although the siege lifting on its own may have been there all along, there is speculation that 1.2 introduced other AI-forgetfulness upon reloads.

- leaving a machine on is wasteful of electricity

only half-joking, but that aside, if you're one of those who can only play 2-3 turns a night (esp. each turn gets longer on average to complete as your campaign progresses), the AI "getting back on track" is nearly impossible.

- if you can even get connected online anymore, the horse archer fix won't work there.

**SpencerH** · 03-08-2005, 16:22

Originally Posted by Old Celt

I don't disagree that CA is responsible for the bugs. I do disagree that the siege bug was introduced with the patch. Testing suggests it has been present since 1.1, and perhaps even with 1.0, but I haven't read conclusive evidence for the status of 1.0.

I understand that leaving the machine running might not be feasible for some people, but it is simple and effective. Also, the AI does get back on track after a reload, so it's not like it's broken for good when you do need to load it.

No, I'm not saying customers should be responsible for fixing anything. What I'm saying is that we can help ourselves if we choose, rather than just waiting for these jokers to do something. I don't know about you, but I'd rather fix what can be fixed now, because I like the game and don't want to wait for October to get better gameplay. It isn't good, but it is preferable to the alternatives of not playing at all or living with the pain.

A fix for the horse archer problem was posted on this forum about a month ago. It involves changing ONE word in the unit description file for each of the affected units, and those units are listed with the fix. If you cannot find the fix in this forum, I can dig up a copy of it and post it back here, but that might take some time.

I have no conclusive evidence but I doubt that the seige bug was present with 1.0. I didnt patch to 1.1 and played 2.5 long campaigns during which time I fought numerous city defenses against an aggressive AI. In contrast, playing in the same stop and start fashion I've not fought one city defense with 1.2 and the game has stagnated with no (or only little) change in the AI empires for 50-100 years. Clearly, the change came with the patch.

As for fixes, I agree that some 'workarounds' exist but disagree as to their value. There are ways to mitigate the worst of the 'true' bugs and if that was the only problem with RTW then things might be different. In my case though, I'm also disappointed with other issues such as the AI and gameplay/unit speeds (amongst others). Of course I can add a mod but, as with the bugs, the changes are not true fixes since many of the problems are hard coded. My time is simply too valuable to waste on band-aids that prove disappointing after investing many hours of play. I'm stopping my one and only 1.2 campaign and plan to go back to Gran Tourismo until something better (CIV4 maybe) or another patch comes along.

**Josephus V** · 03-08-2005, 21:35

Well, what it sounds like to me was the original version is the best and patches did nothing but cause trouble. I did see the siege bug (maybe) the other night. I had to reload and the Thracians ended their siege of my city. But the very next turn, they sieged again with twice the size army. I had to cancel my invasion plans a deal with them.

I've rarely seen Horce Archers in all my campaign so I have no experience with them and it seems minor. Also, I've never noticed supermen archers. I've routed many an archer unit.

Thanks for all the details though.

**Ciciocle** · 03-09-2005, 00:44

can someone please tell me what is the horse archer bug? i haven't seen anything buggy, but i didn't had much experience fighting horse archers. i tend to build empires in western europe :)

**drone** · 03-09-2005, 00:59

Originally Posted by Ciciocle

can someone please tell me what is the horse archer bug? i haven't seen anything buggy, but i didn't had much experience fighting horse archers. i tend to build empires in western europe :)

Short version:
They don't fire properly while moving. This can be fixed by editing the unit files.

Long version:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=43090
It's six pages long, with some ranting and bickering. Good fun

**Kraxis** · 03-09-2005, 01:25

It has been confirmed by several people over at com that the load siegebug was present in 1.1. Haven't read anything conclusive about 1.0 though.
So obviously something made the AI behave more conservative in 1.2, it could be that previously is was merely 'forced' to leave while now it forgets the purpose for its army's placement. Thus the army gets sent off to do other duties, which they didn't in 1.1.