Sega acquires Total War Developer

[Bob the Insane]

No, that is incorrect. Sega now own the rights to TW and the rights to publish it. as i've said in another post, Sega now also have the ability to take away TW from CA and give it someone else.

edit-just because someone publishes a game, does not mean they own the rights....for example-Nintendo Published all Rare games, they did not own the rights to them though, when rare left, they took all their properties with them. This is different though, as CA are now part of Sega, and anything can happen.

Sounds like the whole Medal of Honor:AA then Medal of Honor:PA, Men of Valour, and Call of Duty farce...

MoD:AA rocked... Then coders left (made CoD, which rocked), orginal development company left (made MoV, whcih was okay in a console converstion kind of way) and left EA with just the Medal of Honor name (which was applied to MoH:PA which was pretty but stucked)...

Just goes to show where the real talent (and company value) is and I hope Sega realise this better than EA...

[Duke Dick]

it happened with Championship Manager and Football Manager, both made by Sports Interactive. SI left and made there own game, but couldn't use the CM title or anything relating to it, even though they created it....

[Kazuma]

I think it's good that Sega acquired Creative Assembly and the rights. Sega is a veteran in the games industry. So they will probably support CA well.

[frogbeastegg]

Sega's portfolio of created and published games: link. I have confidence (so far as I have confidence in any games company) that they will produce good, polished and supported games. They already produce niche games and oddball games - games they know will not sell in massive quantities.

Monkey Ball is for children?! Gah! Have you never played on the expert stages? That game's difficulty is brutal! It might look all happy and cheerful, but I still hear the monkey death scream in my sleep, years on. It took hours sometimes for me to finish a 30 second stage. Ok, you can argue expert is only expert, but they made up a good half of the game and the medium level was also quite nasty in many places. The child friendly stages made up ... oh, 10 levels out of about 200. [/monkey ball survivor's side story]

[Zatoichi]

This just in from Shogun over at the .com website:

"So by now you will all be aware that Sega has bought the Creative Assembly and that we have also announced a new console title Spartan: Total Warrior. www.totalwarriorgame.com/

Before everyone gets too worried, it's worth taking a moment to pause before panicking at the news that CA has been bought by Sega. The deal secures the future of CA as a development group, which is pretty much the same as saying the deal secures the future of the PC Total War games as well as the opportunity to branch out into different platforms. Hopefully, you'll see that as a good thing. If you've enjoyed the games so far you'll be able to carry on enjoying new games in future.

The Total War and Total Warrior brands are very different beasts and the Total War franchise will continue to push the genre forward whilst staying true to it's impeccable heritage."

So, there you have it. It is good news, and there's no need to panic - it's official! I wish them all the best - I want to go on playing quality TW PC titles for many years to come, as I'm sure does everyone here.

Now, about that 2 patch deal...

[drone]

Does anyone have a feel for Sega's overall policy on beta testing? I've always had the feeling that R:TW should have been beta-tested on a large scale since it was a big break from the previous releases in the series.

Edit - Yes, I know they do consoles mostly, but any take on PC game testing?

[SpencerH]

I was thinking along the same lines earlier. As console game developers they may have a different business model than that apparently in use by PC game makers ie one that requires more rigorous beta testing.

[General Carnage]

Sega are one of the largest gaming companies ever, although I am not sure I trust them to swap war dogs for war blue hedgehogs.

[General Carnage]

trust them not to*

[BDC]

Sega are one of the largest gaming companies ever, although I am not sure I trust them to swap war dogs for war blue hedgehogs.

Hehe. Warhogs.

Maybe you can super-speed them to splat the opposition.

[Gregoshi]

As console game developers they may have a different business model than that apparently in use by PC game makers ie one that requires more rigorous beta testing.

One big difference is that with consoles you have a fixed and known hardware configuration. With console development, you don't have to account for endless configuration combinations based on CPU, RAM, graphics card, sound card, Windows version, DirectX version, driver versions, etc. Also, the hardware for a console remains fixed for 5-6 years during the life of a console system, while PC hardware is changing and improving every month. User interface options are limited by the game controller buttons/sticks so the games are more "simplistic" than a comparable PC game and therefore less prone to introducing errors. PC and console games are different beasts and I don't think comparison of testing methods is exactly fair.

Here I am quoting and disagreeing with you again SpencerH. I'm not stalking you - honest!

Another observation: if the CA folks had a dollar for every Sonic/hedgehog wisecrack they've read the past few days, they could all retire and buy their own island.

[HoreTore]

Don't think there's anything to worry about the Total War series being destroyed by Sega...

It seems to me that Sega are changing their strategy towards producing highly realistic and "grown-up"-games, with first buying Football Manager, an INCREDIIBLE game I must say, I've played the series since Championship Manager 95/96 , and now bying Total War...

They did a great job with Football Manager 2005, with both making it much more detailed and also improving the processing time of the game(a BIG problem with those games...). I'm hoping they'll do the same thing with Total War and make it much more detailed...And perhaps they've got the resources to make a great AI

[Quietus]

Don't think there's anything to worry about the Total War series being destroyed by Sega...

It seems to me that Sega are changing their strategy towards producing highly realistic and "grown-up"-games, with first buying Football Manager, an INCREDIIBLE game I must say, I've played the series since Championship Manager 95/96 , and now bying Total War...

They did a great job with Football Manager 2005, with both making it much more detailed and also improving the processing time of the game(a BIG problem with those games...). I'm hoping they'll do the same thing with Total War and make it much more detailed...And perhaps they've got the resources to make a great AI

I hope you are right. There's still no telling though. Sega = Dog. CA = Tail. But the tail doesn't wag the dog

That's why we need CA Devs to speak up about changes to expect (or not to expect). Je'Rome are you there??

[SpencerH]

One big difference is that with consoles you have a fixed and known hardware configuration. With console development, you don't have to account for endless configuration combinations based on CPU, RAM, graphics card, sound card, Windows version, DirectX version, driver versions, etc. Also, the hardware for a console remains fixed for 5-6 years during the life of a console system, while PC hardware is changing and improving every month. User interface options are limited by the game controller buttons/sticks so the games are more "simplistic" than a comparable PC game and therefore less prone to introducing errors. PC and console games are different beasts and I don't think comparison of testing methods is exactly fair.

Here I am quoting and disagreeing with you again SpencerH. I'm not stalking you - honest!

Another observation: if the CA folks had a dollar for every Sonic/hedgehog wisecrack they've read the past few days, they could all retire and buy their own island.

I wasn't aware you were stalking me (unless you're also Kukrikhan) Disagreement and discussion is good. How else are we to correct errors?

I dont disagree that there is a difference between developing console and PC games but just to be clear, I'm not talking about bugs caused by different hardware configs. I'll also accept your assertion that console games are more simplistic (since I have no knowledge of that) and I assume, therefore, easier to de-bug. Testing methods may be different as well. But with all due respect, so what?

The last three major (IMO) and hugely anticipated PC strategy games CIV3, MOO3, and now RTW were all shipped with major bugs. They didnt CTD, but CIV3 required ~5 patches, RTW has 2 so far and is still plagued by major bugs, and I dont personally know about MOO3 except that there has been many comments that it was released too early suggesting the same pattern. I think that this increasingly common situation is unacceptable. Must we wait until a game is sold in the bargain-bin so as to ensure it has been patched enough to be bug free?

My comment was not a crack at the developers. I understand that they are under huge time constraints to fulfill their contracts with the producers. The point of my comment was that perhaps with a console game producer CA would be allowed the time to test more rigorously (and that would benefit us all). I think Sega buying CA may be a good thing. I have no reason to believe otherwise.

I'm so misunderstood

[BeeSting]

Anything is better than Activision.

[Jagger]

From here: http://www.totalwarriorgame.com/

Even with these large numbers, however, Roxburgh doesn't view Total Warrior as a strategy game -- he sees it as an action-adventure game where players have to play smartly. "Spartan: Total Warrior is absolutely not a hack and slash game," he says. "Players who attempt to button bash their way through the game will end up flat on their backsides pretty quickly! It's a system that we describe as 'action and reaction.' This basically means that players will have to tactically act and react to the shape of the battle around them so as not to be overwhelmed by the huge numbers of enemies."

and more:

Like the Total War series, Total Warrior puts the player into a historical setting, but don't go into the game expecting something historically accurate. "It's important to realize that this is not a historically accurate game at all," says Roxburgh. "The Romans never met the Spartans in real life as there was a mere matter of two hundred plus years between them!"

and more:

The mythological creatures and settings that make up a big part of the game as well. "We made a very early decision to tap into some of the really cool stuff from ancient Greek mythology in order to enable diversity and add a lot of flavor to the enemies and situations that the player finds themselves up against," says Roxburgh. "We chose the creatures that we thought would be the most fun to confront in terms of gameplay and visual impact."

They say it isn't a slasher but sounds like a first person slasher or fantasy slasher. And definitely not historical.

They are a long, long way from their roots.

And I am not buying a console.

I am sure they will do well........... but who will fill the niche they are abandoning.

[Red Harvest]

I don't doubt that they can bring more to console gaming. I have a "live and let live philosophy." I hope the console players get great games, and if they get some strategy games that really make them want to play even deeper PC strategy games it would be a plus. But I also recognize that often organizations can really only focus well on one major mission. And that is why my concern is that TW will get hind tit as a result of this. Good intentions are often not enough. I very much want my intuition to be wrong on this.

[Gregoshi]

I am sure they will do well........... but who will fill the niche they are abandoning.

Jagger, they are NOT abandoning their niche. I'll quote my post from another thread:

-----
It seems like the biggest fear is that the console effort will somehow diminish or detract from upcoming PC games or worse, that this spells the end of the PC Total War games. What some fail to realise is that CA is not a one game shop. And as others have pointed out, all signs (CA job listings, etc) point to more TW games. According to the SEGA shareholders' "Aquisition sheet" (from IGN.com):

"The markets of the consumer business, which Sega Sammy Group regards as one of its core businesses, have expanded rapidly in North America and Europe, while the Japanese market has seen sluggish growth. Hence, for our business development in the future, the North American and European markets have been growing in importance. Under these circumstances, Sega Sammy Group is promoting the concentration of its management resources on growth areas in its consumer business, relocation of its development resources for better productivity and unification of its development and marketing strategies.

The Creative Assembly Ltd. has produced good results and has an established brand identity with the "Total War" PC series, whose titles have sold over a million throughout North America and Europe. By acquiring the shares of The Creative Assembly Ltd., Sega Sammy Group will be able to obtain competitive titles and a strong brand in the North American and European markets, in addition to expand product lines and increase sales volumes dramatically. Furthermore, we believe that we will be able to make good use of the development engines produced by The Creative Assembly Ltd. to expand future titles, as well as developing new ventures for next-generation platforms with the team."

SEGA bought CA for precisely what it is and what it can be in the future. I don't see any negatives in this short of inventing them myself.
-----

[Nelson]

I am sure they will do well........... but who will fill the niche they are abandoning.

Gregoshi is right. We have no reason to believe that CA is in some sort of a zero-sum situation. More console need not result in less PC.

[Age]

What will this do to the TW series and possibly a new TW game and what about MTWVI?I hope they countiue the series as I would like to see more done with the Vikings.I posted about that in another thread.

[Gregoshi]

Age, it won't do anything to the TW series. There are a couple of posts in here from CA employees (they have the purple/white CA shield as their avatar) in which they state emphatically that the TW series will continue. Also, CA has a job listing on their web site: "We are looking for a Lead Artist for our next Total War PC title..." Lastly, in the SEGA aquisition sheet it sent to its shareholders I quoted in my previous post, SEGA bought CA because they make the TW series. They want the TW PC games to expand their North American and European market share - which is where the money is these days.

[Jagger]

I am going to take a wait and see attitude.

And it is a zero sum game. More console means less PC unless they hire a bunch of new people. Sadly though, in creative work, bigger is not always better.

[Red Harvest]

Sadly though, in creative work, bigger is not always better.

Isn't that the truth!? I present Microsoft as Exhibit #1. I can't think of anything particularly original coming from this behemoth. Creativity is coming from smaller companies that they then acquire or crush.

[sharky]

People, First of all, SEGA make some very grown up games,
There mascot may well be a Blue Hedgehog, but There skill at making
Games of all kinds is almost unmatched.

P.S I'm a fan of sonic games, and I wouldnt say they were childish,
Most of them are aimed at teen's:
Sonic Adventure 3: Shadow of a Hedgehog


ANYWAY,

The take over of CA must be pretty worrying for some people,
But I want to voice my opinion of why
CA are now in the best hands possible.

I'm a Massive fan of SEGA and have been since I can remember,
They basically wrote the book of gaming and have made some of the
most out standing games ever.
But in 2001 the DreamCast flopped and thousands apon thousands
of SEGA fan's almost new it was the end for SEGA.

Then Came along Sammy, a company with more money then you could imagine
and some VERY big Idea's,
Sammy bought SEGA, and every SEGA fan went into panic
'What if they destroy SEGA and SEGA's games??'

Little did we know Sammy was the best thing that has happened
too SEGA since the Genesis, As for the day of the Merge (Oct 1st 2004)
SEGA are now the Biggest (richest) Games company in Japan.

Sammy didn't only want SEGA for its house hold name and
its massive home console franchise list but SEGA
own's 70% of the Arcades in Japan and loads around the world.
They also own the 3rd biggest Anime company in Japan
with animes like Akira and Ray Earth.

SEGA's plan now is too be come the biggest 3rd Party games Developer
in the world and they are going to be buying some smaller games companies
like CA, too appeal more to the western market.

So if none of that made any sense too you at all,
Why is SEGA going too be good for CA and Total war?
Well
1) SEGA will be pumping money into them so they can make better games then ever before!

2) The SEGA name alone will bring literally thousands more fans too the series

3) SEGA will let the CA team too there own devices to do what they like unlike A company like EA which would ruin the Total War franchise

4)You'll never have too see CA's talent wasted again on another EA Sports Rugby title, (cheers to that)


As for Spartan, Well it's nothing like a normal Total War game but It
does look VERY VERY fun, and Trust me its going too wipe the floor with
the Dynasty Warriors series.

[sunsmountain]

Sega is good at creating software, i enjoyed a lot of SEGA games being a Nintendo fan at that time.

They just suck at making hardware. Sega CD anyone ? :)

They lost that battle, but SEGA didnt lose the war. Looks like Nintendo is headed the same way: Play station and Xbox are crunching it like a japanese fortune cookie.

[Zatoichi]

OK - more news over at the .com, this time from a Sega rep:

http://p223.ezboard.com/fshoguntotal...ID=23489.topic

Seems like I've become the org's 'Unofficial Sega News Monkey'...

[Spino]

OK - more news over at the .com, this time from a Sega rep:

http://p223.ezboard.com/fshoguntotal...ID=23489.topic

Seems like I've become the org's 'Unofficial Sega News Monkey'...

Thanks Zatoichi! Here's the text from AlexSEGA's post for those of you who revile at the thought of visiting the Com's forums (and who could blame you... )

AlexSEGA
SEGA Rep
Posts: 2
(3/14/05 3:44 pm)
Reply SEGA and Creative Assembly - A Great Future for Total War
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi everyone. My name's Alex and I would like to introduce myself to you guys. I am Sega Europe's' Web community manager and I'm here to answer any questions you might have about Sega's purchase of Creative Assembly and moving forward provide you all with an opportunity to present questions or requests to Sega.

I'd like to take this opportunity to discuss the future of Creative Assembly, the Total War series and the upcoming Total Warrior games.

To begin with, the Creative Assembly staff who post on these forums will remain as the authorities voice on game issues. These guys are the true experts on the game and it would be foolish of me to expect to replace them. You've been dealing with these guys for years so there is no need for that to change.

My overall message is to remain positive. I'm sure that some of you are wondering why Sega bought Creative Assembly and why the first title that is announced is a console game - facts that I can appreciate would lead to concerns over the future of the PC Total War games.

Let me put on record that Sega bought CA because CA is the best developer of PC strategy games in the world. It's as simple as that. Sega is making a concerted effort to balance the range of titles we offer and PC titles represent a strategic (no pun intended) market that we need to compete in. We've proven with Football Manager and Children Of The Nile that we are able to publish PC titles that retain their core gameplay and appeal, and this will remain the case with Total War games. It's worth noting that within the UK, Football Manager outsold Half Life 2 during 2004 - a measure of how seriously Sega take the PC market and proof of our ability to successfully market PC games.

Spartan: Total Warrior has not deflected resources away from the Total War games. The R&D for the engine powering Spartan has been ongoing for over two years - since before the launch of Rome: Total War - and uses separate resources. Rest assured that Total Warrior does not diminish the importance of Total War.

Spartan: Total Warrior is not evidence of Sega attempting to "dumb-down" CA. Spartan: Total Warrior was a game conceived, designed and proposed by CA long before Sega thought of buying them. Spartan: Total Warrior is entirely driven by CA and Sega are only too delighted to be publishing this title as we think that it represents the pinnacle of current console gaming - this really will be the last great technical achievement on the current crop of consoles.

I appreciate that it may not appeal to all of you guys here and I'm not here to convert you to console gaming, but believe me when I tell you that this game is anything but a dumbed down kids game. In the same way that Shogun: Total War forever changed the strategy game, Spartan: Total Warrior will change how epic combat games are perceived.

It really is business as usual. Right now the focus is on Spartan: Total Warrior but the Total War series is not in danger and, we hope, will benefit from the support, resources and focus that Sega will pour into it. I say state categorically that there will be new Total War PC Strategy games from Creative Assembly and Sega.

And a follow up post...

AlexSEGA
SEGA Rep
Posts: 3
(3/14/05 5:38 pm)
Reply Re: Rome
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi guys,

Thanks to all of you for your feedback. I'll do my best to get your questions answered for you as quickly as possible. A couple of points though. FM05 was released in early November. The reason we bought CA should be obvious from my earlier post. It's a brilliant company who are the leaders at what they do. What better reason do you need!

Cheers
Alex

[Kraxis]

Interesting...

Positive thing that Alex came about and said all that, even if it is BS (which I doubt now). He had no obvious reason to come and play on CA's own frontyard. He could in most cases have cared less about PC people raving about a console game if that was the direction CA was going. The post itself is a confirmation that Total War will live on.

[SpencerH]

Thanks Zatoichi! Here's the text from AlexSEGA's post for those of you who revile at the thought of visiting the Com's forums (and who could blame you... )

Actually some of the rants are quite hilarious. Heres AlexSEGA, making what appears to be his first post at .com, rationally explaining why SEGA bought CA and how this will benefit all.

[sarcasm]Unfortunately, the response to his well written post may not have been quite what he expected [/sarcasm]

LOL I have mental pictures of this smiling guy in a suit being pelted by screaming monkeys armed with spoiled fruit.

I hope that Total Warrior is a novel step for action adventure games and I will certainly look at it when it comes out. As I think I explained above, I hope that CA does benefit from SEGA ownership and I dont believe that SEGA ownership means that TW PC games are dead. That doesnt change the fact that I will not buy an expansion unless RTW is de-bugged first and I will continue to agitate for that on the forums I visit (which doesnt include .com since I'd be banned before I finished a post).

Batches? We no need no steenkin batches!

[Browning]

Perhaps we should direct this AlexSEGA to this forum - the people here seem to have a more adult attitude than those at .com (hope not to offend anybody too much).