Knights of the Round Table - Romano-British PBM (Goth mod - WoS style)

[econ21]

Table PBM FAQ (Work in progress)

The premise: This is a Romano-British PBM using Goth's All Factions Mod for BI. The aim of the PBM is to re-establish the Roman Empire as a Christian one, well defended against pagan invaders. If you have seen the film King Arthur, you'll get an idea of the premise (yes, it was a mediocre film - this will be a better PBM!). Each King will reign for 10 years (20 turns). Other players will each be assigned a general - a knight of the Roundtable - and be given quests to achieve. They will play out any battles that their general gets into.

Victory conditions: (1) Control all of Britain and Ireland; Rome; + ???
(2) All controlled provinces to be Christian.

The mod:
Goth mod 2.4.1: you can download it here:
http://www.g-unleashed.com/index.php?cat=34&pid=634&page=goth's_bi_mod
You can find the mod discussed here:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=41879
And also on the RTR forums.

Settings
Difficulty level: H campaigns; M battles.
Large units.
Timer on.
Pirate and bandit spawn =100.

Note: Edited descr_strat.txt file to make both starting generals Christian and to change the temples into churches:
http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/descr_strat.zip
On my computer, the file goes in:
C:\Program Files\Activision\RTW-Goth mod\bi\data\world\maps\campaign\barbarian_invasion
Only the first player needs to bother with this.


Playing arrangements
1. There will be two kinds of players - knights and elders.
2. Knights assume leadership of the Round Table (become "King") for 10 years (20 turns) on a rotating basis. They control actions on the campaign map, buildings etc.
3. Zimfan40 is the first King. Thereafter, Kingship and assignment of generals is determined by the order in which players post to confirm interest in this thread.
4. Knights will be represented by a general (elders too when there are enough). Where there are more generals than players, extra generals could be assigned to players based on family affiliation.
5. When the general of a knight gets into a battle, the King uploads the savegame and the knight has 48 hours to complete the battle. Failure to do so, leads to dishonour and exile from the Roundtable.
6. Elders will join in debates on policy and help decide on quests. An in-character thread (Rountable deliberations) will be created for such discussion. Decision making around the Roundtable will be consensual - the King should act according to the majority wishes of the knights and elders, weighted by half their generals influence. Formal votes (posts with polls) can be arranged for particuarly contentious matters, but the Kind should aim to build a consensus and rely more on informal shows of hands etc.

Houserules:
1. No extermination or enslavement (we're the good guys).
2. No retraining, except ships and full units (for upgrades).
3. 1 ship can only carry 1 unit.

Roleplaying and write-ups
Players should try to act in accordance with the vice and virtues of their generals. Where these permit, they are to roleplay brave knights, aiming to restore a Christian Roman Empire and protect it from invasion.
Subject to demand, we could have a Round Table thread for Will of the Senate type deliberations. If we go this route, perhaps the King should act according to the majority wishes of his knights (ie act like a chairman, rather than a dictator).

The playlist:
The Knights
Zimfan
econ21
Galagros
Ultrawar
DukeofSerbia - TBC
Wonderland

The Elders
GeneralHankerchief
El Diablo
Tiberius
Csar

****************************************************************

Original post:

In the Vandal PBM thread, Zimfan40 posted:

By the way, I don't suppose anyone would be interested in playing another pbem with me using Goth's All Factions mod? I gave it a try recently and you guys are right, it's fantastic!

I'm partial to the Romano british, or one of the other factions that's had a major unit roster revamp.

This started me thinking: to be honest, playing these vanilla PBMs does make me appreciate the realism mods more. Goth mod is beautiful mod for BI - it has excellent re-skins of units, tones down the combat to be slower and more realistic (it's less hardcore than EB or RTR, but not far off), introduces more factions, bigger hordes, a bigger map etc and crucially, in my experience is very stable. (Apparently, Goth's temporarily retired from modding, so there won't be any changes soon). Here's a taster of what it looks like (WRE vs Berbers):



Thinking about the Romano-British, it seemed that, like a lot of small factions, they might be great fun at the beginning, as you struggle to get established but possibly get bland as you get bigger.

So I was wondering what would make characterful objectives? Watching the movie King Arthur, I rather liked the idea of Arthur as a starry-eyed admirer of the ideal of an egalitarian Christian Rome. Maybe the aim of the Romano-British could be to establish a Christian Empire, including Rome? I'm even wondering if, to play in character as good guy King Arthur's, we rule out both extermination and enslavement[1]? That will make it much tougher, as squalor is a big problem in the WRE. But Goth's mod tends to be generous with money and, correct me if I am wrong, but I think the Romano-British should have the Roman type infrastructure to control it.

My imagination starts to run riot at this point - we could even have a "will of the Senate" type Round Table. Each player takes a knight, a general, and the King assigns them quests (battles, or even limited campaigns - take province X, defeat army Y). My inclination would be to get rid of the Consul election/voting on motions aspects of Will of the Senate and the wordy deliberations etc, but make this a more personal, small scale affair focussed around individual quests and stories of brave deeds. We could still have a deliberations type thread for in character comments, if people like, but it would be a council of war advising the King and we would be role playing loyal and brave knights not politicking Senators.

I believe factions branch into four families - so if we had four players, each controlling 1/4 of the generals. If we have more players, we could fit them in. If we have five players, the King could control only himself; if 6+, we could branch out further. I'd see the King as having more of management role, similar to the later Consuls in the Will of the Senate game - managing the economy, passing on savegames to players. A 20 turn reign determined by a fixed play order would probably be fine. I'd like Zimfan40 to take the first reign, if he's up for it, as it was his idea.

Playing a Will of the Senate type game would require a sustained commitment from the players, but in the original campaign that has not proved to be a problem: unless it's your reign, you just have to play out a battle occaisionally and keep up to date with current events. We would only be looking for serious players who could play out battles within 2 days of the savegame being posted (otherwise: dishonour!).

Anyone interested or want to suggest further ideas/houserules?

[Galagros]

Sounds like loads of fun (I've been keeping up with the Will of the Senate for a while now). I'd join, but I literally just got RTW and BI last night, so as you can imagine, I'm simply not familiar enough with the game yet (though I've been playing MTW for many years).

[Zimfan40]

I'd be honored to play the first reign.

Would each player have his own family member to control when it comes to battles like in the Senate game?

If so I should warn you, the roman brits' family is pretty anemic at the start, with only two members and no children. Once you conquer a few settlements, though, the babies and adoptions start rolling in.

[Dutch_guy]

Having trouble with your Acount Zimfan(40) ?

On Topic, I'm gonna pass on this one. I scarcely even have the time to post in the Will of the Senate PBM - let alone participate in a completely different,new, PBM.

Good luck anyway.

[UltraWar]

I am intrested in joining but I will need to do some looking at the WoS rules first

[DukeofSerbia]

Where can I download Goth mod? I'm interested.

[econ21]

Would each player have his own family member to control when it comes to battles like in the Senate game?

That's what I was thinking - each player would have their own general to control and the reigning player would give out quests to them. I'd be inclined to make the quests alternate - so each player gets a fair crack at the whip (I'm envisaging less politics in this one than in the Will of the Senate). But players could suggest characterful quests to the king.

I would not worry about there only being two generals at first - I think this will be a smaller affair than the Will of the Senate (partly because the Will of the Senate has recruited most of the active players and they may not want to commit to a second campaign). But hopefully we can entice a few more prospective players. If we make a good job of it, we may be able to attact more players as we play along (as the Will of the Senate has done).

I will need to do some looking at the WoS rules first.

The WoS rules are overly complex. We should start thinking up rules for this PBM.

I'm thinking about the following:

Victory conditions: (1) Control all of Britain and Ireland; Rome; + ???
(2) All controlled provinces to be Christian.

Playing arrangements
1. Players assume leadership as the Head of the Round Table ("King") for 20 turns. They control actions on the campaign map, buildings etc.
2. Each player is represented by a general. When their general gets into a battle, the King uploads the savegame and they have 48 hours to complete the battle. Failure to do so, leads to dishonour and exile from the Roundtable.
3. Zimfan40 is the first King. Thereafter, Kingship and assignment of generals is determined by the order in which players post to confirm interest in this thread. Where there are more generals than players, extra generals could be assigned to players based on family affiliation.

Houserules:
1. No extermination or enslavement (we're the good guys).
2. No retraining, except ships and full units (for upgrades).
3. 1 ship can only carry 1 unit.

Settings
Difficulty level: VH campaigns; M battles.
Large units.
Timer on.
Pirate and bandit spawn =100.

Roleplaying and write-ups
Players should try to act in accordance with the vice and virtues of their generals. Where these permit, they are to roleplay brave knights, aiming to restore a Christian Roman Empire and protect it from invasion.
Subject to demand, we could have a Round Table thread for Will of the Senate type deliberations. If we go this route, perhaps the King should act according to the majority wishes of his knights (ie act like a chairman, rather than a dictator).

Any reactions?

PS:

Here is the Mod Download:
http://www.g-unleashed.com/index.php?cat=34&pid=634&page=goth's_bi_mod

You can find the mod discussed here:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=41879
And also on the RTR forums.

[Orb]

Looks good, still, I don't think I'll have time to take part.

Well, when I get my main comp. to play medieval, you may seeing a themed Byzantine late campaign.

[Zimfan40]

Here is the Mod Download:
http://www.g-unleashed.com/index.php?cat=34&pid=634&page=goth's_bi_mod

Patch 2.4.1 fixes some minor bugs with 2.4 download here
http://forums.rometotalrealism.org/...opic=18386&st=0
Extract with Winrar then copy\paste the files into your bi\data folder

You can find the mod discussed here:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=41879
And also on the RTR forums.

Sounds good to me, just a few quick notes.

1. The patch link is broken, or at least I can't open it. However, Goth has kindly included it in the latest main install of the game. Just scroll down at that first link to:

MAIN:
Click here to download Goth's Mod v.2.4.1 full

2. Both starting members are pagan. Luckily, public order is very high in starting territories and conversion will be easy. I say we make the first Christian family member the new faction heir.

3. Have you played the Romano-brits in Goth's mod before? Their best infantry can only be made in Britain with a huge city level barracks. Their mainstay unit, the Pedites Romanii is pretty strong but won't hold well to the better Roman infantry. This means the huge advanced armies Rome will throw at us on very hard may prove troublesome for those of us who fall short of a Hanibal or Belisarius. I suggest that depending on the comfort level of prospective players high difficulty levels we consider putting the game at "hard" campaign difficulty. WoS has attracted most of the hardcore members, so this may make recruitment easier. More experienced players can adopt some extra iron man rules for their reigns.

[Zimfan40]

I took the liberty of starting a test game. Doesn't have the appropriate difficulty etc. It's just to make sure everyone who wants to play has the same version of Goth's mod.

File name KingArthurtest http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/

[econ21]

2. Both starting members are pagan.

OK, I've amended the descr_strat.txt file to make them both Christian and to change the temples into churches[1]. I don't know how to change the religion of the population, but conversion will be quick.

3. Have you played the Romano-brits in Goth's mod before? ... I suggest that depending on the comfort level of prospective players high difficulty levels we consider putting the game at "hard" campaign difficulty.

I'm happy to go with hard campaign. In WoS, some players were pushing for hard battles too, but I much prefer medium.

[1]I've uploaded the file as:

http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/descr_strat.zip

On my computer, the file goes in:
C:\Program Files\Activision\RTW-Goth mod\bi\data\world\maps\campaign\barbarian_invasion

I wonder, are there any other issues we need to work out? One idea I had was some constraints on our aggressiveness. Some possibilities:
(1) We do not delcare war for 10 turns - let the AI build up.
or:
(2) We do not declare war full stop - we wait to be attacked and turn the tables on our aggressors. This would imply that we do not target Rome and the WRE - ideally, we try to rescue it from pagan invaders.
or:
(3) We do not declare war on fellow Christians - ie factions headed by a Christian (sort of like with the Pope in MTW).

On the quest business - I've been wondering about letting the general do more than fight the battle. ie give them control of the game, at least so they can move their general around. The King could still determine the build queues, taxes, give instructions about the other armies etc. But let's see how it goes. I guess the closest analogy with the quest is with a Senate mission. We might even set a time limit.

Could there possibly be an Upper House version of this game? Perhaps a "Council of Elders" or something of the like?

I guess so. The Council could help direct policy as in WoS. But perhaps also assign quests. The more creative ideas we have about quests, the better.

So far the playlist is:

Zimfan
econ21
Galagros
Ultrawar - TBC
DukeofSerbia - TBC
Wonderland


Any more ideas or potential players?