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    Default Re: The Org bug list - ONLY post bugs here

    couldn't see a thread that seemed to talk about this here, was wondering if anyone here had experienced this? a number of people at TWC are complaining about this one

    Its not the AI, at least i don't think so, the AI, both battle and camp seems to be making some pretty good moves.
    BUT
    units, when ordered to attack, will pause, then half will charge the unit, the rest won't move. when the chargers get to the enemy, they stop, losing all charge benefits, then get hacked to pieces coz the rest of the unit is elsewhere. infantry, cavalry, meh, always seems to happens. when you order units to attack, at best i seem to be able to get 1/4 of the unit properly engaged, the rest will just mill around.

    no unit cohesion. as above, but units just seem to split up randomly, and the men do their own thing. my mailed knights, chasing routers, ended up halfway across the map (and note, the unit they were chasing wasn't spread out...)

    men do their own thing. so, i'm besieged, i sally forth, my archers step up. i give the archers an order to close and fire. there's 85 men in the unit. the bulk form line, draw bows, as expected. 15 walk in the opposite direction. 2 charge the enemy they're supposed to be shooting with drawn daggers. WTF???

    as for cavalry. i've seen people complain that cav seem weak. my experience is this isn't the case. the problem is the cavalry don't charge correctly. they stop just before they get to the unit, then walk up in melee mode, with swords not lances, so they ain't getting charge bonus. the only time i've managed to get my cavalry to properly charge, they had to start from so far away, it was ridiculous

    bonus' not working properly
    i'm not stupid, i know cavalry charging spears is suicide. so, my generals guard flanked a unit of spearmen that was already engaged, and charged from behind. net result. over half my cav die. apparently, spear milia have massive spikes sticking out the back of their armour to impale rear charging horses on.

    my personal favourite...
    seems if you give an order, i.e to attack a unit, and that order gets executed, your men will just sit around and wait for the next order.
    i was attacking a city, my knights had flanked the enemy, charged the rear of some highlanders, done their thing (eventually) the clock was ticking down, it looked like i'd won. but the battle hadn't ended. i looked round to find where the last enemy unit was. it was 3 spear militia. they were standing in front of my knights. who were doing nothing, but dying, one by one. you'd have thought, at least, that if a unit was attacked, it might respond.


    as i say, i don't think this is a bug. there seems to be some overall problem with the way men in a unit work together (or don't).

    to quote someone else on the issue
    Black Prince's experience matches my own. I've been playing the Total War series since Shogun. Although there's always been some issues with unit cohesion/pathfinding/group-dynamics, in the past it's mostly been limited to situations with obstacles (navigating around gates and buildings in RTW assaults, rock formations and cliffs in Shogun, etc) or chasing down scattered routers (especially in RTW), M2TW just takes things to a whole new level. You can't even depend on a unit to engage in full force on a flat, open field.

    The frequent inability of cavalry to charge effectively especially stings for me, as cavalry was the backbone of my favorite battle strategies. I've always liked to use a bunch of highly durable infantry (such as Shogun's Naginata infantry, or RTW's heavy Roman legions) to engage the enemy line while my cavalry circles behind them for a crushing charge to the rear. Nothing in RTW satisfied me more than seeing a phalanx unit shattered on impact as my Praetorian Cavalry smashed through their rear. I'm content with attempts to tone cavalry down for balance, as I admit they were sometimes rather over-powered, but their current implementation is terrible. They're basically just fast melee units that are weak against spears. Sometimes the game builds up incredible anticipation as I see my cavalry moving into position and lowering their lances... but then they halt the charge and march into melee with their swords. Why must they mock me so, oh Lord?

    I also saw comments from a developer diary (on GameSpot) about new mechanics being in place to prevent the so-called cavalry blobbing exploit, and thought it was a noble endeavor, but if this is the result then it was a failed endeavor.
    so i know its not just me. seems like a fairly serious bug with the battlemaps that for me is killing my game...

    Moderator edit:


    Maestro supports this: I want to second everything "The Black Prince" said. I keep experiencing appauling unit cohesion! The number of times I've set a unit to charge, only for them to get within 10 yards, stop, send in the front ranks on their own, who then stop and negate all their charge bonus and then get slaughtered whilst the other 80 men in the unit play patty-cake in the background and send in anoth 8-10 men at a time. This has to be fixed. It's most frustrating and I'm losing hundreds of men because of their inabililty to work as a unit.

    This "bug" seems to be most obvious and most destructive when you have a numerical advantage against a foe. You can set 3 units of heavy infatry against one lot of light cavalry (or whatever) and each unit will send a few men at a time to engage and play patty-cake inthe background. This totally loses the numerical advantage and takes a great number of tactics out of the game.

    All in all, I often find that each unit of men is spread over a wide area, completely disperate from each other with no cohesion and no ability to engage the enemy cause for some reason a few men have gone walk-about and the rest want to wait for them so they doin't miss out on the fun.

    Basically, unless you stay perfectly still, you lose all cohesion and cannot fight effectively!
    Last edited by econ21; 11-13-2006 at 19:16.

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