Guilds (and what they do)

[Shahed]

Yeah I used a different spelling than M2:TW as well. I'm glad these guys made it to the game. I remember in 2003 I made a post about this cavalry and that it would balance somewhat the gameplay and be historically correct. Looks like thye might have been listening. The skinning is too plain though. Now I've forgotten what the standard was, yellow stripes over the horse's mail armor IIRC. Naturally they's also have bright display banners and heralds.

I believe in Turkish kapikulari refers to the system as a noun, where as kapikulu are the people in the system. The royal guards, chancellors, administrators etc... It's seperate from the rest of the other administrations. I guess the correct term in English would be Royal Administration or Royal Service (His Majesty's Service) and the like. Not sure 100% about that though, but IIRC that's the difference.

It's hard to tell about the explorer's guild. I'll get back if I notice a global bonus.

[Trithemius]

I believe in Turkish kapikulari refers to the system as a noun, where as kapikulu are the people in the system. The royal guards, chancellors, administrators etc... It's seperate from the rest of the other administrations. I guess the correct term in English would be Royal Administration or Royal Service (His Majesty's Service) and the like. Not sure 100% about that though, but IIRC that's the difference.

You might be right there; the "Six Divisions" were mostly (originally) people from the alti boluk (Palace School).

I have to admit that I was actually a bit sad that I got a "Chivalrous Knight" from completing jihad. Could I not get a "Ferocious Ghazi" or a "Loyal Bey" or something like that. At least I can be happy with the Swordbearer (even if I have to pretend it is silahdar.

[Handel]

It seems the theologian HQ easily appears in Rheims (where the HRE emperrors were crowned) or in Paris and London gets merchant HQ. I am talking only about the HQ guilds.

[Shahed]

You might be right there; the "Six Divisions" were mostly (originally) people from the alti boluk (Palace School).

I have to admit that I was actually a bit sad that I got a "Chivalrous Knight" from completing jihad. Could I not get a "Ferocious Ghazi" or a "Loyal Bey" or something like that. At least I can be happy with the Swordbearer (even if I have to pretend it is silahdar.

Impressive. You know your stuff.

It would have been awesome to see Muslim equivalents, yes. It would add a lot more variety and probably would be very educational for most. The icons should change as well. That would be ideal.

I also suggested that in 2003, Silahtar as a unit. I'm very happy with the Turk lineup though, specially the cavalry. They did a good job!

[Haudegen]

If you crack open the game files you will see that Toledo has an increased chance of being offered a swordsmith's guild, so yes. Most guilds have 'favored' cities.

Wow, interesting stuff. Which file is it?

[FactionHeir]

I think something is wrong with guilds.
I played both English and Milan long campaigns (up to turn 75 as at that time I'd have conquered just about everything and there was no point in continuing) and I have never been offered following guilds:

Theologician's
Mason's
Woodsmen

Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but I can't figure out why I never get those.
I pump out massive amounts of priests in all regions to root out heresy, especially in the holy land, and I do have quite a few cities/castles without any guilds which are producing priests.
I build something in every town/castle nearly every turn (as much as cash allows)
I trained massive amounts of longbowmen as the English.

So what gives?

Also, the descripts for Mason and Explorer seem a bit off from what the in-game descript says anyway. Mason in game only seem to give access to units but doesn't give boni (at least not listed) and Explorer will give you a chance of getting the intrepid explorer retinue for a general stayin in the town (if he hasn't too many retinues already)

[PseRamesses]

Something that seems to work rather well for me is to produce certain agents, units in certain cities. This behaviour generally produces the "right" guild in the "right" city.
As Spain I like to have the Thieves G in Leon, Ass.G in Zaragoza, Theo.G in Valencia, Explorers G i Lisbon etc etc so consequently I build each respective unit in theese cities. Seems to work in 8 out of 10 offered guilds. I´ve also applied this playing English, Byzantine, Fatmids and Turks and it seems to work well there too although playing the Turks/ Fatmids I usually have many settlements so I´ve to pass on more offered guilds.

[FactionHeir]

As a follow up to my previous post, why do people here seem to want the templar's guild and not the hospitaller's guild? IMO the Hospitaller's guild gives more benefits for the same unit.

[Beefeater]

FactionHeir - At a guess, partly because the Templars are so iconic with their blood red crosses on white shields, the faint whiff of conspiracy theory, and their inclusion in so many medieval stories (blame Sir Walter Scott), and partly because they seem to be harder to get than the Hospitallers.

[therother]

Epistolary Richard has released (with CA's permission) the data text files: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=73971

export_descr_guilds.txt would seem to have all the various guild triggers.

[todorp]

I like a lot the Guilds. It creates specialised towns.

The Explorers Guild is the one, which puzzles me. I captured Explorer Headquoters in Florence from Milan as Venice. It doesn't offer retraining. The only benefit I noticed from it is that some of my generals will rarely acquire an explorer advisor +15% movement. I expected that the individual units or ships produced there will have have better movement, but they don't.

I put in 6 generals and after about 10 turns 2 of them got an explorer advisor +15% movement. Unfortunatly these generals were the old grand fathers and the explorer advisors are not trasferable.

[Trithemius]

Epistolary Richard has released (with CA's permission) the data text files: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=73971

export_descr_guilds.txt would seem to have all the various guild triggers.

Cheers therother.

[Shahed]

Epistolary Richard has released (with CA's permission) the data text files: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=73971

export_descr_guilds.txt would seem to have all the various guild triggers.

THANK YOU for the heads up !

Wow ! explorer's guild has really high overall probability, you could get it in every single city just by doing nothing...lol !

Which file has the bonus which the guilds offer ?

[Trithemius]

Looks like the only unit that improves the likelihood of getting a Swordsmith's Guild for the Turks is Hashishim. That is a bit of a pain...

[Shahed]

You sure ? This is gonna cost me a bundle...

[Daveybaby]

I have never been offered following guilds:

Theologician's
Mason's
Woodsmen

Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but I can't figure out why I never get those.

I've had theologians and woodsmans as english. I found that if you specialise a region to produce one thing, e.g. archers in nottingham, and priests in york, and then produce all (or at least most) of your archers in nottingham, and most of your priests in york, you will get offered a woodsmans guild in nottingham, and a theologians guild in york once they grow to the required size (size 3 iirc).

Dont forget you can only have 1 guild per region. If all of yours have guilds then you wont get offered any others (other than upgrades for existing ones). So if the first guild you get offered in that region isnt the desired type, then keep rejecting until you get offered the type you want.

I pump out massive amounts of priests in all regions to root out heresy, especially in the holy land, and I do have quite a few cities/castles without any guilds which are producing priests.

Thats probably where youre going wrong - pump all of your priests from the same region, and that region will get offered the guild. If you do 1 priest from each region, no one region will get noticed for producing priests. Just remember it's what the *region* produces thats important, not your faction as a whole.

[Lusted]

After delving around in the data files Ca Oz released, it looks like you get an equa change of getting a Templar and Hospitallers Guild after doing a Crusade, but you also get an increased probability of getting a Templar Guild offer if you have a general in a city and he has more than 4 chivalry.

[dismal]

As Spain I have twice gotten missions from the explorers guild to take a city in France with a promise of them being very happy with me and giving me gold and a penalty of them not being happy with me, both came after I got the explorer HQ. So apparently guilds can like or dislike you as well.

The explorer's guild gave me a mission to take Dublin yesterday. I am Spain, and I am not nor have I ever been at war with the Scots who are a catholic faction in good standing.

So, this is a fairly significant request in my mind and it would be nice to know what cost/benefit it might have.

[Daveybaby]

Looking at export_descr_guilds.txt, it seems that failing a guild mission merely reduces your standing with that guild, which in turn means youve got further to go before you get the next guild upgrade.

Actually that doc pretty much describes everything guilds do, and everything you need to do to get them. It seems like there is both a regional score *and* a faction score.

Each guild has 3 levels, and you need scores of 100, 250 and 500 to get each level. Each 'thing' you can do to curry (or lose) favour with a guild adds to both the regions score and your faction's score. For example:

Destroying a guild:
-100 for the settlement's score (for that guild type)
-20 for the factions score (for that guild type)

Settlement upgraded:
+10 for the factions score (for ALL guilds)

Building a stone wall:
+10 for the settlements score (for mason's guild)
+2 for the factions score (for mason's guild)

etc etc.

[Shahed]

Can someone help me ? I think I'm having an issue getting the Merchant's Guild. It's 1155 and I've built insane amounts of bazaars and merchant ports everywhere. I've focused merchant recruitment out of Antakya (Antioch), and I have surely produced well over 20-25 merchants from this city.

I'm still not getting the option for merchant's guild in Antakya.

I am however getting an offer for Theoligian's Guild repeatedly although I never recruited a single Imam in Antakya.

[Kraxis]

That is odd... I have been spamming merchants from all over and I have been swamped in offers from the Merchants. In fact I turned down the offer for an HQ in Vienna (the tradebenefit would be too low there), so I'm wondering if I should destroy the Master Merchant in Vienna so I could get an HQ in another place.

But also remember that merchants winning and losing their fights will affect the guild. So make sure you win the duels a lot.

[Shahed]

I've won about 75K - 100K in duels in 176 turns. I train 2-3 to 10 and then send them slaughtering the others. I also run away real fast if I see a higher merchant coming (for my lower ones that is). So the balance is cetainly overwhelming, in my favor.

I can't build any more merchants, am at agent limit. Bugged ?

[dismal]

I can't build any more merchants, am at agent limit. Bugged ?

My sense is that the number of merchants you can have is a function of the number of markets you have. Probably one-to-one.

[katank]

I'm pretty sure higher level merchants enable a bigger pool. At any rate, I never seem to have problems with getting merchant's guilds.

Very silly question but just a sanity check. Does the settlement already have some guild in place? That's the only reason I can think of why you don't get an offer.

[Bob the Insane]

so I'm wondering if I should destroy the Master Merchant in Vienna so I could get an HQ in another place.

Maybe...

It is only a -20 to score for other settlements...

[Shahed]

Yeah the agent limit is tied to the number of markets, each level giving one more agent, I think.

There is no other guild at that settlement.

IIRC there was none when I conquered. If there was it must have been a Thieves guild (so many of those all over the place), which I destroyed.

Kraxis yeah I would destroy it and wait for one at my preferred location.

[Kraxis]

I came to that conclusion myself... But it makes no difference now, I'm starting a new campaign as soon as I can figure out how to enable a -show_err line along with the batchfile for the mod I'm making (basically a trait/ancilliary/unit fixer).

[Shahed]

Nice.

[Kraxis]

Woohooo... Got it working. Now I am almost rid of most of the really annoying vices. They will still be there to annoy me, but no longer will all generals have Bad Taxman and Royally Extravagant. And it should be possible to get the Good (admin, taxman, farmer, miner ect) as well.

In the coming days I will try to enable some of the cooler ancilliaries (custom armour, ornate armour, bodyguard and alod of others) and try to kickstart the princess starter traits that simply haven't got a trigger.

But damn I was just off topic there.

[Shahed]

I'm still not getting the darn merchants' guild in Antioch, or anywhere else. I've done ALL the trade buildings (wharfs and markets) and tained about 25 merchants from there.

Also I have trained about 60 spies from Damascus, but still no Thieves guild.