Originally posted by Burakius
even when cheatring with addmoney you CANT defeat them

Oh yes you can. With about 3 really good assassins (+8 or better) you take out all their generals then eventually the heir and faction leader. At this point they turn into rebels. This also works with the Timurids. It may be cheating a bit, but it does make the game a little more playable. Besides, after the amount of punishment they both gave me, it was the only way to save my eastern forces from annihilation.