Out of Character thread

[Lucjan]

I have to say that both TinCow and Ivarrwolfsong's stories are worth noting. Good reads, and hopefully we'll see more of them popping up soon.

I myself am in the process of one.

[IvarrWolfsong]

Thanks for the compliments...

now get back to building churchs! <<cracks the Holy Bull Whip of St. Indianus Johans>>

[econ21]

Good work, TinCow - it would be good to see attitudes to the Papacy as another fault line in the Diet (along with regional loyalties). I think I learned some history from your story too.

[Ignoramus]

I was just thinking, why should we be friends with the Pope? Apart from the Inquisitors, it would be fun to get excommuniated as well as historical.

Oh, and was there a mod that removed Inquisitors? I was thinking that may that might have been a good idea.

[TinCow]

Good work, TinCow - it would be good to see attitudes to the Papacy as another fault line in the Diet (along with regional loyalties). I think I learned some history from your story too.

I have been planning to be Anti-Papal from the start... hence my solo vote against 1.1. It makes sense to me, because the Investiture Controversy was only 5 years before our game was meant to begin. It's also the reason that CA gives the HRE very low starting relations with the Pope. I figured the start of the game is the only time when we can realistically connect to history, since from here on out it diverges. Plus, Rome is one of our victory requirements, so at least an Anti-Papal stance has some basis in gameplay as well.

It should be easy to role-play that regardless of any traits acquired anyway. If Anti-Papal avatars get religious traits, just play like they are holy, but don't acknowledge the Pope as the rightful head of the Church. If they get non-religious traits, well... it's even easier to defy Rome!

For reference, this is the map I used to figure out what territories were 'lost' in the previous few years:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...1/HRE_11Jh.PNG

[Ignoramus]

I have a few suggestions:

That the Counties be named after the territory rather than the settlement. I.e. The Count of Hamburg would be instead the Count of Saxony, the COunt of Metz, Burgundy etc.

Also, are we going to make Saxony a separate House? They were the most important Duchy to the Emperors, so I think it would be a shame not to include them.

[pevergreen]

I want to Splinter off in some direction (holy land?) as teutonic house! Fun!
It may be easier to keep 4 houses though.

[IvarrWolfsong]

With Peter being in the House of Bavaria and Max's hate for Pope Greg, I see some friction ahead =).

[OverKnight]

With Peter being in the House of Bavaria and Max's hate for Pope Greg, I see some friction ahead =).

Friction? There's no friction. You obviously you haven't been to the House of Bavaria weekend retreat yet. We eat smores, sing cumbayah and make decorative ashtrays for the other Houses. Max is just one of those misunderstood gruff, but with a heart of gold, tough guys.

Otto, on the other hand, is just "Eager". All exclamation points and puppy dog idealism. I hope he gets "Horribly Scarred" or something so I can darken him up a bit. At least he threw a small chapel your way in the build queue Ivarr.

Edit: The book I ordered on the HRE should arrive today or tomorrow:

http://www.amazon.com/Rise-Fall-Holy...e=UTF8&s=books

It was the best pick out of a limited field considering I don't speak or read German. I'm looking forward to having more background for my posts.

[econ21]

That the Counties be named after the territory rather than the settlement. I.e. The Count of Hamburg would be instead the Count of Saxony, the COunt of Metz, Burgundy etc.

Also, are we going to make Saxony a separate House? They were the most important Duchy to the Emperors, so I think it would be a shame not to include them.

I want to keep just the four houses both for transparency (so we can read them off the family tree) and for simplicity (four factions seems enough when there are only about three players in each).

But if Counts want to change their titles, that's fine. Ditto Dukes with their Houses. Lucjan did raise the issue of a House of Saxony a while back.

I want to Splinter off in some direction (holy land?) as teutonic house!

Having one faction become like the Teutonic Order, facing off with the pagans in the east would be fun. Ditto, another becoming a Kingdom of Heaven in the Holy Land. These are all characterful role-playing possibilities for the Houses to consider - they should communicate with the Emperor and Chancellor to see if they will play along. (I would if I were in one of those offices.)

[Dutch_guy]

Just a heads up, Carl posted this fix in the Citadel - it might be worth checking out.

[econ21]

Just a heads up, Carl posted this fix in the Citadel - it might be worth checking out.

As I understand it, players can change weapon stats and animations without it affecting the savegames. So if people with a battle to fight want to use such a fix when fighting their battle, I don't think that would cause any problem for other players.

[Dutch_guy]

As I understand it, players can change weapon stats and animations without it affecting the savegames. So if people with a battle to fight want to use such a fix when fighting their battle, I don't think that would cause any problem for other players.

Exactly, sounds like something we'd want to have. Or well, at least those who're fighting the battles.

[Lucjan]

I tend to lean against this, it could allow the overpowering of weapons and instigate victories where we, in every right, should lose. I'm looking forward to a difficult game this time, not a repeat of the victory after victory after victory we had in the Rome pbem.

[Dutch_guy]

. I'm looking forward to a difficult game this time, not a repeat of the victory after victory after victory we had in the Rome pbem.

I agree 100 %, but would you like facing Varangians who weren't able to hit a three foot pole in the ground if their life depended on it ? Same for Janissaries, Billmen, and an assortment of other units. Some which we may even have to use ourselves. I don't want to make the game easier guys, I just want to play it the way the programmers intended it to be played - with somewhat effective 2H units.

[pevergreen]

I will be using those fixs, but the shield benefits everyone. The pike wont help us for a while, neither will the two hander animation fix. So no problem.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Just a heads-up:

Braden has the savegame, as he is about to assault Prague (he does have the option of continuing to starve the defenders as the odds are more even than the previous battles).

It is 1098, which means the midterm is coming up very soon. The savegame can be viewed at kotr1098-1.

A report will be coming up tomorrow.

[pevergreen]

awsome!

[Braden]

Just got the PM Lucjan thanks, will think about it but I'm likely to wait a bit to even the odds a bit more in my favour (also seeing as my experiences thus far with the current settings have been "less than favorable").

But I'll consider the options when I've looked at teh save file tomorrow night.

[GeneralHankerchief]

No worries. Hopefully what you lack in troop advantage you make up for in equipment advantage, as strategic use of them has served us well recently.

[econ21]

There's no dishonour in starving out enemy settlements - I routinely do it in my solo play. A sally defence is so much easier than a siege assault. And when fighting rebels, it is not like there is much of a rush.

If we go for Antwerp, with the scarey Flemish pikemen, I'd be inclined to starve them out. It's hard to use archers in a siege assault and pikemen really don't like archers.

[Lucjan]

Going after Antwerp now would actually put us in conflict with the Danes. Check the western border colors of Hamburg. The sneaky buggers used a fleet to land in the low countries and took Antwerp soon after.

[pevergreen]

Hmm..we should take the Danes out, but it would be awsome to leave all the factions ingame. I try to do it.

[Dutch_guy]

Hmm..we should take the Danes out, but it would be awsome to leave all the factions ingame. I try to do it.

Indeed it would, bit problematic though of course.

[Braden]

For a change, I'm at home today so will look at this battle now.

Starving vs Assault - I'm usually ok with assault but I always allow myself a 2:1 advantage normally (i.e. in Rome). I've not had that benefit with Medieval 2 so far and havent now.

I've tried speading deployment but the AI has just reposted his defenses to compensate.

Lets have a look at this save then huh?

(BTW - still hoping we haven't modded this from version 1.1 as nothing appeared to be set in stone about add-ons etc)

[GeneralHankerchief]

Actually, we are using one small mod that fixes some vices and virtues in the game. You can download it from the first post in this thread, and the instructions are in the readme.

[econ21]

Going after Antwerp now would actually put us in conflict with the Danes. Check the western border colors of Hamburg. The sneaky buggers used a fleet to land in the low countries and took Antwerp soon after.

Interesting - thanks for the heads up. And I gather the Milanese have taken Dijon? Looks like the borders are being drawn.

I know we are all "lower house" generals and should check out the savegames ourselves, but it is good to have information on this kind of thing for those of us busy with other stuff.

[Lucjan]

Poland has also taken Magdeburg but Breslau is still open. Dietrich prodded the kaiser to let him take Magdeburg before the Poles or Danes could get there, but he didn't bite.

However, in terms of neighboring rebels. We've got Stettin, Breslau and Bern left. Everything else is in some faction or another's hands.

My personal inclination is an alliance with the Poles, and leave our other neighbors to their own devices while we work to strengthen our current borders just about everywhere. I'd advocate taking Bern, but nothing else. This is where overexpanding could bite us bad. I'd also suggest concentrating an army in both Hamburg and Staufen. Antagonizing the Venicians and the Danes into declaring war shouldn't be difficult, and the territory we could wrest from them in the form of Arhus and Venice would solidify the Reich's northern frontier and connect our Italian holdings to our core, while at the same time taking the two most prominent trading cities on either side of the continent. Venice giving us sway over the Adriatic and an opening into the Mediterranean, and Arhus giving us absolute control of the Sund, and essentially the Baltic and Scandinavia in the process.

[Braden]

ok, installed the VnV mod but one question?

the two .txt files need to be in what folder in the .data directory? I have then just currently sitting in the .data folder without being in a subfolder.

now, I opted for maintaining the siege as I went back on a past save file and as Prague has Sergeant Spearmen plus "whatever" and I only have a one unit advantage in numbers I really think assaulting now...in Winter and without waiting for a potential response for re-enforcements would be silly.

BTW - have not tested the game yet since installing the VnV mod.

[OverKnight]

I put the files in the main data folder. The bat file is in the M2 main directory. I have been running the game fine with no problems. Of course medifix is subtle for a Mod so it's tough to tell if it's working or just vanilla. From some of the traits and retainers I've seen though, I think it's working. Governors aren't morphing into syphilitic morons and such.

The upcoming Diet should be interesting, from reviewing WotS it seemed that one of the main dividing points was expansion versus consolidation. Throw in the four Houses and there should be some fun oratorical broadsides coming up.