Those excommunication warning

**SadOldGoth** · 01-17-2007, 18:36

Hi,
I'm playing as England and within two turns the Portugese and Holy Roman something attacked me. I'm at war with Venice and got the warning from the Pope to stop fighting them. So instead I counterattacked the Portugese, after which I promptly got another warning. So wtf, why can they attack me without any apparent problem but I get excommunication warnings?

I'm ready to just ignore the pope, get excommunicated and deal with those countries one after the other.

Any ideas or opinions?

**lars573** · 01-17-2007, 18:42

Don't attack them, let them attack you again. When the Pope hands out warnings they go to both sides. So the Venecians have also been told to stay away from you. As have the Portuguese. If they attack you again they get excommunicated. Same goes for you. They attack you, they get excommunicated, you can attack them at will.

**LordKhaine** · 01-17-2007, 20:47

If I recall you're safe to attack them.. in your own lands. You just can't attack them outside your own lands. And it's also safe to attack enemy fleets providing they're blockading a port of yours.

**FactionHeir** · 01-17-2007, 21:23

You are not safe to attack them in your own lands except if you are sallying out.
The French got excommed for ganging up on a quarterstack i had parked next to their capital. Was fun to see that after a heroic victory for me, the pope told me to have at em :)

**big_feef** · 01-18-2007, 00:56

Originally Posted by lars573

Don't attack them, let them attack you again. When the Pope hands out warnings they go to both sides. So the Venecians have also been told to stay away from you. As have the Portuguese. If they attack you again they get excommunicated. Same goes for you. They attack you, they get excommunicated, you can attack them at will.

It does seems that the Pope tends to take his own sweet time excommunicating an AI faction though. Milan and Portugal, the two main Western European troublemakers, tend to take close to 10 turns or more for the Pope to excommunicate the bastards... and I get excommunicated instantly it seems if I attack them when I get tired of them being silly.

One thing I would like to see is that they'd make it less likely for you to be excommunicated if your relationship with the Pope is very high... maybe it is that way; but I've always been excommunicated on the first turn I break the no-hostilities order.

**PureFodder** · 01-18-2007, 02:34

If you have the resources to bribe your way up the Pope-o-meter to 9 or 10 chances are you'll get a slap on the wrist for disobeying the Pope. When I had my guy as Pope I lost 2 Pope points for breaking 3 Papal warnings in one turn.

400 florins a turn for 5 turns should rocket you up to full Papal love.

**LordKhaine** · 01-18-2007, 03:06

Oddly enough the first time I ever got excommunicated was also the first pope of my own faction. Spend all that time getting him to be pope.. and at the first chance he excommunicates me! I didn't get back into the popes favour for over fifty years. During this time I'd beaten off several large crusade armies and been hated by the entire catholic world. It also lasted for the duration of three popes, and even continued for a short while *after* my faction leader had died.

As you can guess, after this experience I haven't bothered to get my own pope elected again

**Slug For A Butt** · 01-18-2007, 04:03

Originally Posted by PureFodder

If you have the resources to bribe your way up the Pope-o-meter to 9 or 10 chances are you'll get a slap on the wrist for disobeying the Pope. When I had my guy as Pope I lost 2 Pope points for breaking 3 Papal warnings in one turn.

400 florins a turn for 5 turns should rocket you up to full Papal love.

Can you bribe the pope with that little? I've found that as my ranking on the Pope-o-meter gets higher, I seem to have to throw more money to the Pope slush fund to get an increased ranking. Will gifting him 500 over two turns have the same effect as 1000 over one turn? I guess I'm asking if it is cumulative or do you have to make a big donation at once to make a difference?

**lars573** · 01-18-2007, 04:58

Originally Posted by big_feef

It does seems that the Pope tends to take his own sweet time excommunicating an AI faction though. Milan and Portugal, the two main Western European troublemakers, tend to take close to 10 turns or more for the Pope to excommunicate the bastards... and I get excommunicated instantly it seems if I attack them when I get tired of them being silly.

One thing I would like to see is that they'd make it less likely for you to be excommunicated if your relationship with the Pope is very high... maybe it is that way; but I've always been excommunicated on the first turn I break the no-hostilities order.

I'm always M/M BTW. Also I always back off when McPontiff tells me too. And after 4 turns or so the other faction will attack an be excommed.

**Moah** · 01-18-2007, 13:44

If you've had the excom warning it's too late to imporve relations - you must back down. The relations apply when the pope warns you: If they're good your standing will fall if you fight on. If they were bad you'll get excommed. So you need good relations *before* you attack the other faction.

P.s. I'd just like to echo the others who say make an alliance with the pope. I was too slow in my first game with France (VH/Vh) and they allied with HRE (go figure). Although I could still bribe to get pope-o-meter up, call crusades etc I could not make him break the alliance and could not get the HRE excommed. No matter what I did they always stayed high and my rating fell wihtout constant cash, because I was at war with his ally. Very expensive.

In this game as scotland I allied and am paying a miserly 200 florins a turn. I'm at rating 7-8 and the English have been excluded from the grace of god!

**gardibolt** · 01-18-2007, 19:39

It's interesting; I get the same reaction from the pope if I promise a tribute of 200 fl for 10 turns as I do if I give him 1000 fl in a lump sum (haven't tried 2000). I wonder if he adds it up every time making it look like you're giving him much more than you really are?

The danger of excommunication is that everyone and his brother can attack you (and will). Your allies will turn, and crusades can be called against you. Unless you like living dangerously, excommunication is to be avoided.

What is effective is provoking the other side so THEY get excommunicated. Move a small stack of expendable troops next to one of their larger stacks but don't attack. The AI can't resist. Keep doing this and soon your foe will be on the outs with the pope and you might even get to call a crusade against him. Heh.

**Von Nanega** · 01-19-2007, 13:25

One of my favorite tricks, (only works if you are allied with the Pope) is to attack an enemy with the Popes Fleet/Army standing next to you. Instant excomm for the faction you attack!!!!!