The Kingdom of Outremer

[econ21]

Elberhard:

Good - we seem to be moving towards a consensus on the next immediate steps required to defend Outremer.

As regards the Chancellorship elections, at the moment there is a clear choice between a candidate who is joining us crusaders, Matthias Steffen, and one who will starve us, Lothar Steffen. Any other crusaders should think carefully before entering this contest, for fear of dividing the pro-Outremer vote.

[Privateerkev]

My fellow Crusaders,

The King has given me permission to present a CA I am working on so I can get your feedback and comments. This is my personal edict and I will present it but I wanted to get it looked over here because I believe it would get a more favorable reaction than if I present it in my own Ducal House. I am concerned with the practice of executing prisoners. I believe that when a man raises arms against the Reich, his life is forfeit. But, once he puts those arms back down, he is to be given quarter. He is to be saved. Murdering him after he surrenders is wrong and an affront to God. Therefore, I present this CA:

Charter Amendment 11.x:
(a) All prisoners are to be released after every battle.


Now, I have gotten comments from some of you regarding this.

Someone suggested that (a) look like this:

(a) Under no circumstances are prisoners to be executed without first offering them to be ransomed.

I prefer a strong no exception approach but I admit that it might be politically impossible to offer something with no escape hatch so someone also offered this:

(b) The Diet can override clause (a) for a particular faction for one diet session by a normal edict.

I had preferred to also include language banning sacking and exterminations but I agree with others that it will be hard enough to pass the prisoner one by itself. I welcome your comments and thoughts.

[econ21]

Elberhard:

Jan, as I have said privately to you, I think your amendment is a good one. Perhaps you could add a clause:

No settlement can be exterminated without prior authorisation from a Diet vote.

I do not believe this clause would reduce support for your amendment - I doubt more people favouring exterminating innocents than favour executing prisoners.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Conrad Salier:

I second the proposed CA.

Also, should I fall in battle to the Horse Lords I hereby recommend that Karl Zirn be named as my successor. He has served Outremer well for many years, and I do not wish another Jobst/Siegfried incident to befall the Outremer.

[Privateerkev]

Ebelhard, I like your idea and will consider adding it. You have a good point.

My king, hopefully we will not have to worry about succession in the Outremer for quite some time but I am glad the matter is settled and clear. Also, as my edict is a personal one, I will need seconds in the Diet itself. But, I wish it to be debated on here a bit longer first

[GeneralHankerchief]

Conrad Salier:

Bah! According to Lothar, we are allowed nothing but personal edicts.

In addition, Steward Ansehelm of Franconia has contacted us requesting support for his Teutonic Crusade. In return, he will support our venture. He is united, with us, against Lothar and I think we would do well to cooperate with him.

[Privateerkev]

I do not know if I can support Ansehelm's crusade into Russia unless he supports my CA to not kill prisoners. He is well documented as an executor. I am afraid I would be condemning all of those Russians and Poles to death if I supported his edict.

Also, someone still needs to second Edict 11.1

The King proposed it and I seconded it. We need one more to go into the Diet and speak up.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Conrad Salier:

The deal was Crusade for Crusade, not Crusade for Crusade and prisoners.

Also, our cause is not helped by you invoking the ire of two Dukes and a Steward in the Diet. I have appointed you as a Crusader Count, meaning that I have publicly placed faith and trust in you. Please remember that before you speak or otherwise I may have to reconsider my decision.

[Privateerkev]

My king,

I will say what I believe I have to say. Duke Arnold had my best friend killed and I suspect Ansehelm had a small part in it. As for Gerhard, he is the one that started it and I had to correct him on some matters. If I prove politically unpopular to you, then you must do what you must do. Either way I will serve the Lord. Hopefully you will not have to make that decision but everyone is putting great pressure on everyone else. I will not allow myself to be muzzled. The Kaiser himself has given me permission to speak on these matters and I will do so. And I respect why you are supporting Ansehelm's edict but you have to understand why I can not at this time. Which is ironic because it is Ansehelm himself that should be persuading me to vote for it seeing as we are in the same house.

[Northnovas]

Karl Zirn:

King Salier I am truly humbled by your recognition of my work here in the Outremer. Thank you!

Young Jan I like the merits of your edict but I find them restrictive. There should be a difference from battlefield to sieges. As you are aware I have the highest regard for our foot soldiers and that of the enemy. I will personally not execute or ransom the souls after a victory.
However, there maybe times and I have not personally been in that position but a battlefield victory may result in an eye for an eye depending on the enemy.
As for the sieges I can see this being more restrictive and the discretion of the Electors if a state of war is declared then the terms should be set with what should be done with occupied cities.
This is only my opinion unfortunately the fair play in war does not exsist in all men.

[OverKnight]

Matthias bows to King Salier

Your Majesty, Jan has withdrawn from the Diet for this session, I respectfully think this is punishment enough for any trespasses you feel he has committed.

He may be outspoken for the taste of some, but he has loyally served Outremer. Considering the political climate in the Diet, it would be wise to keep him in his position as the Franconian representative in the Holy Land.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Conrad Salier:

I have spoken to Jan privately. He will retain his position as Count of Edessa. Should you win the election I may be contacting you about his placement in terms of military strategy.

[OverKnight]

Of course, if elected, I will welcome any insights from you my Lord and my fellow Crusaders. With the new Crusade, the situation in Outremer will become even more hectic. Coordination will be key in destroying the Mongols while liberating Jerusalem at the same time.

[Privateerkev]

Jan arrives in Outremer after the fastest boat ride ever.

Man, I rather face the whole Mongol Army than stay one more day in that Diet session!

I'm sorry to do this after so many of you helped me with it, but there is no way I could present the CA I have been working on. I don't even think I could second it. It is just too attached to me in other peoples' minds. If someone else presented it, I would vote on it though. I still plan on voting. I'm looking forward to that part more than ever now. *rubs hands together*

[GeneralHankerchief]

Conrad Salier:

Gentlemen,

A few deals have been made. It looks like Matthias's Chancellorship and therefore Outremer's continued nourishment has been secured. However, so we do not go back on our word, I ask that all of you support the following measures:

CA 11.1.
The Bavarian edicts (regarding Sardinia/Sicily)
The edicts relating to the Teutonic Crusade.

In addition, so there is no confusion, I request that one of you who still has his Personal Edict propose the following:

Charter Amendment 11.x: The Kingdom of Outremer is to be accorded the same privileges regarding Ducal Edicts (namely, three per Diet Session) as the other four Houses.

It would be much appreciated.

[econ21]

Elberhard: I'm on it, boss.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Conrad Salier:

(OOC, to save room in my inbox) Jan, I'll see what I can do.

A reminder that, in return for securing Matthias's Chancellorship, we have to vote on certain other pieces of legislation. We must keep our promises, after all. I am once again going to mention the pieces that we should vote "Yes" on:

- CA 11.1, or any such CA dealing with disputed succession and Kaisers.
- The Bavarian edicts (regarding Sardinia/Sicily)
- The edicts relating to the Teutonic Crusade.

Thank you.

[Privateerkev]

(OOC: to further save room in your inbox)

My King, is there anything you want us to specifically vote against? I am assuming CA 11.4 is one of these. Any others?

[Northnovas]

Karl Zirn:

King Salier I come to report that the Crusade ended successfully with very little casualties on our part. Jerusalem is is safe hands. I hope we can properly defend it for the Christian faithful to return to the city.

I must say my King that I am disappointed in myself. It was truly an honour to lead the men to victory and to have the young nobles involved in the battle. Matthias truly lead like a knight and took command of the calvary as it ran through the streets chasing the enemy. I must say the von Hamburg also represented himself and his House well. He is less outspoken on the battlefield then in the Diet and carried out all assigned orders.

What I am disappointed in is the command I gave the troops to sack the city. The battle was over and has I carried on through the streets I was overwhelmed by the condition of the city held by the captures. I rode up to the Church of the Nativity and there I saw the graffiti all over the church. I was truly horrified and anger rose in me that someone must pay. It was at that moment a captain rode up and asked for the general orders to stand down the troops.

What should have been a standard order to occupy I ordered the city sacked to pay for the damages that were done. Shortly after my rage was gone, the troops were stood down. There was some repayment by the city and that money was channeled into repair cost of the city. Only some criminals and government officials were executed. Regardless of their faith none of the civilian population was touched.

I am sorry if I offended you or put disrespect on the Outremer and Crusade. I humbly apologize and will relieve my command of the garrison in Jerusalem and return to Damascus.

[Privateerkev]

Count Zirn,

I must say, I was certainly surprised to be standing in the town square watching Imperial Troops ransacking the city. I pulled one aside and asked him what in God's name was going on and he said it was under your orders. I went around town trying to find your command tent but could not. I was about to write you a letter asking about this...episode, but having read your report to the King, my questions are answered. I only ask that we somehow figure out a way to prevent something like this from happening again.

My King,

I do want to take this opportunity to say to you that Count Zirn executed the assault perfectly and ask that fact be factored into any decision regarding the after-battle...episode. While I think all could agree that passions should be controlled at all times, I think we have all experienced moments when they temporarily got the best of us. And while the situation was regrettable, as far as I know, it did not lead to the deaths of any innocents.

Humbly,
Jan von Hamburg


Now the question is, do we stay and defend the city or venture out and clear the area of threats?

[GeneralHankerchief]

Conrad Salier:

Well, what's done is done. I thank all parties involved for their honesty. The important thing is that Jerusalem is back in our hands.

However, I would make a request to Chancellor Steffin that a force remain in the area to dispose of any remaining nearby Saracen threats. I don't want to have taken Jerusalem just to see it lost next year. The city needs extra protection while the Papacy gets back on its feet.

[Northnovas]

Karl Zirn:

Thank you my King. It would be wise to "clean up the area". I still request that I be moved to Damscus. There are then enough capable commanders in the area.

[econ21]

Elberhard walks into the Crusader Council, unwashed, covered in sweat and sand.

Elberhard: Khan Orda is dead. Although his army consisted only of foot archers, he fought like a @#$%^&!!!ing demon and smashed four of my regiments. I wouldn't @#$%^&!!!ing believe it if I did not witness it myself.

I think that is the last of the Horse Lord invasion force, although it is clear they command a vast empire to the east and may return at any time.

Elberhard drops his helmet and slumps into a chair, eyeing Karl Zirn keenly.

Congratulations on your capture of Jerusalem, Karl. But you @#$%^&!!!ed up the occupation big time. Sacking the Holy City? What were you thinking?

Well, you told us what you were thinking: you wanted money to pay for repairs. @#$%^&!!! it, Karl, you may be an Austrian but out here you are a crusader! Forget about that profit and loss @#$%^&!!! while you are here and follow your conscience.

@#$%^&!!! it, I know I have no @#$%^&!!!ing right to admonish you. You acted within your orders. (Casts a sideways look at Matthias). And I know you are one of the most chivalrous generals in the Empire. But still, it does not sit right.

Looking at Jerusalem, with no churches or other holy buildings, I have a proposition to put to the Chancellor and the Council. Before we return Jerusalem to the Papacy, we should build new holy buildings - perhaps even a cathedral. This time, the Papacy should keep Jerusalem for good. We can take care of the Egyptians. But another threat is rebellion - by establishing churches, we should make sure the city is peopled by God fearing Christians.

And in view of Karl Zirn's actions, I suggest to King Salier that Karl be appointed temporarily governor of Jerusalem. Overseeing the construction of holy buildings, should bring home the fact that there is more to crusading than death and plunder.

[OverKnight]

Matthias speaks.

Prinz Elberhard, congratulations on defeating Khan Orda. With King Salier's success, we are rid of the Mongols for now. I wish I could say forever, but we thought that the last time. You, King Salier and Count Fredericus have done great work over the past few years to counter the Mongol threat. Particularly Fredericus, it was during his term that we gathered our forces and broke their power.

We will have Jerusalem for at least a few years. I had recruited a diplomat in Zagreb in 1262, but it will take some time for him to get to Durazzo. Repairs and church building will be a priority. We will also clear the area of the Saracen taint.

If anyone here is angry over the sacking of Jerusalem, then speak to me, not Count Zirn. I can assure you that only the heathen quarters of the city were effected, the intent was to cow the population. Much like when Otto von Kassel reclaimed the city for the Church the first time around. Repairs and Churches will be a priority. Our priests will also stay in the region until the word of God has been brought back to the residents.

[Privateerkev]

Jan returns from a scouting mission

My King and fellow Crusaders,

I have scouted the area just south of the city. There are three small units of Saracens that total up to a few hundred men. Plus, there is a navy in the lake with an army. The Papacy also has a navy in the lake with an army but they are not doing anything. If we wish, we can move now and take out the 3 forces south of Jerusalem. No reason to let them stay so close to us where they can make trouble. Since there is talk of a holding force around here, then I volunteer to stay and help. I am the most junior officer here so I will just fulfill a supporting role and someone more qualified can lead the garrison.

Command me for I am yours,
Jan

[GeneralHankerchief]

Conrad Salier:

Gentlemen, congratulations. We have eradicated the Horse Lords without any major deaths.

Outremer is still not safe, of course. We must send a message to the Saracens lurking around that borders will not be violated without consequences. I am all for Jan leading some sort of attack on the remaining areas.

In addition, Prinz Elberhard has contacted me about dispatching the Egyptian Sultan near Aleppo and I wholeheartedly agree. I request that some sort of force be sent to catch and destroy him.

Finally, as requested, Karl Zirn is the temporary Governor of Jerusalem until it is returned to Papal control.

[Privateerkev]

Then I will immediately ask that the Chancellor allocate me a force so I can venture south and engage the three stacks. He is more than welcome to lead, since he is the highest ranking officer in the immediate area, but then I would request to be assigned to him so I can take part and assist where I can.

[OverKnight]

My lords, it remains to be seen what path the Mongols will take from Baghdad. They could emulate the first wave and proceed south of the Euphrates towards Damascus, or the second wave going north of the River towards Edessa and Aleppo. Obviously the path they take will determine our strategy.

I hope they go north, as the Turks may blunt them a bit and there are more natural choke points. If they go south, it's a straight shot across the desert and the Egyptians are unlikely to get in their way.

All I can do now, until they choose, is rearm the men we have and perhaps recruit a few more units. When they choose, we can reinforce the settlements along their line of advance and position field armies to fall upon the forces that break from the horde.

I would welcome any advice you all might have. I know Prinz Elberhard, Count Fredericus and King Salier are old hands at Mongol fighting. Of particular interest to me is if you think gunpowder artillery might be effective against them? It's too bad we don't have those "rocket launchers" they've deployed against us. They would serve very well to break up a Khan's charge.

[Privateerkev]

As for gunpowder artillery, it makes sense to me to place these things up high in towers where the Mongols mobility does them no good. Placing these things on the ground just hamstrings our mobility. These are just my thoughts. Having cannons on towers will allow us to engage the Mongols far out if they siege. It should break up their siege equipment before it gets to the settlement. Then all of their mobility is useless outside of perfectly good walls. This also allows us to reduce our garrisons and spread out our forces among multiple settlements. I know many here prefer to meet these men in the field, and they are quite good at it I might add, but if we are going to do this "on the cheap", then we should think about using the settlements to bleed the Mongols upon our walls.

Like I said, this is just my opinion. All I ask is that I be allowed to move up to Edessa to protect my settlement if the Mongols come west. Until then I will continue to camp outside of the Holy City to support it.

Yours,
Jan

[GeneralHankerchief]

Conrad Salier:

Once again there seems to be four armies. I figure we finally don't have to pinch pennies to combat these guys, so let's meet them on even ground, with high-tech armies. I want the commanders who haven't had a chance to fight them yet on the front lines, preferrably the following:

- Jan, since he is Count of Edessa and it will probably come under attack first.
- Hans, since the reason he came back to Outremer in the first place was to fight the Horse Lords.
- Matthias, if you wish.
- I myself would like a final shot at the Horse Lords (OOC: mainly for story reasons).

As for gunpowder artillery, construction of towers in cities may be prudent in case any future threats make their way to Outremer, but for now I think we are proficient enough to handle the Horse Lords entirely in fieldwork.