If there was a RTW 1.6 Patch, what would you want in it?

[Warluster]

Hi all,

So, if there was a RTW 1.6 Patch, what would you want in it? Think of anything you'd want fixed, changed.

List:

[russia almighty]

Some Hardcoding removed (more factions , units ect)
phalanx's to be harder to breach
making parthia a fully civilized faction

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Modding

• The ability to install several campaigns within the game. Each one would be allowed up-to thirty separate factions, excluding rebels, all with their own separate set of up-to two-hundred units. Really comparable to the modding ability of M:TW VI.

Units - General

• Drastic unit balancing. All units would ideally work by a more "Shogun" system - cavalry get beaten by spears, spears get beaten by infantry and infantry get beaten by cavalry. No units beat everything - this rule also includes post-Marian infantry and cavalry.
• Light Units would get a more clearly defined purpose - heavy units are slowed down, the amount of speed reduction depends upon the statistics of their armor, while lighter units remain the same. Also, lighter units are given an increase charge bonus compared to heavier units and a higher defense skill rating, again to demonstrate their speed and agility.
• Heavier units gain a larger penalty in deserts - the larger the bulk of their armor, the worse the rating is.
• Unit upkeep and training cost drastically increased to prevent the mid-game steam-roll.
• The phalanx formation is toned down drastically. A good charge into the front can often break it up and force the men within it to fight with their swords.
• The M:TW statistic of "Disciplined" returns and "Impetuousness" is removed. Now, almost all units may charge without orders, although some may be more willing to this than others. Disciplined units, will hardly ever charge without orders and are not concerned by those routing around them unless they to are disciplined.
• The introduction of a logical recruitment system - units gain an extra experience point for each barracks level above the one required for them.
• The introduction of a AoR system - certain units can only be trained in the faction's homelands which gradually expand every few years to represent migration and adaption of culture.

Units - More Specific

• The majority of elite post-Marian cavalry units would ideally be removed from the game or toned down to more reasonable and accurate level.
• The statistics of all Marian infantry lowered drastically.
• The introduction of BI formations for most Germanic units, replacing the phalanx formation for their Warband, and some Celtic ones.

Buildings

• The introduction of more law boosting buildings such as courts and basilicas.
• The removal of Large Stone Walls and Huge Stone Walls - they provide a penalty to the defender rather than an advantage since the AI use better siege towers with each upgrade.

AI

• Drastic improvements here, especially in the field of diplomacy and campaign-map AI. It needs to coordinate it's forces in a more tactical way, knowing when to retreat to avoid a fight, gain more information before attacking and try to coordinate it's military machine with it's diplomatic treaties.

Misc

• The integration of M:TW civil wars, with lots of dissatisfied generals, as well as M2:TW general revolts, with one dissatisfied general. Combined, this would add a lot of interest to a game in the late stages as the player has to micro-manage the loyalty of envious generals and insure their happiness and satisfaction.
• The faction leader's effects now apply to all of his provinces.
• To combine with the above two suggestion, assassins can now kill their own generals/leaders if their loyalty gets to low or they become useless fools. Also, spies can watch out for these moves and inform the player about any plots that may be approaching!
• The fixing and polishing of as many graphical and physical bugs as possible - especially the dreaded, and now common, civil war bug and the horrible memory leak bug.
• The merging of R:TW and BI into one application rather than two - comparable to M:TW and VI really.
• The addition of BI features such as Night Battles and the Shield Wall ability.

It's such a terrible shame that the CA have finished patching and improving R:TW - there was so much that they could have done with it to improve it's ability to be re-played and it's interest and depth.

[Shieldmaiden]

I'm going to be dull and pragmatic:

1) Bugfixing. Implementing things listed in the 1.5 Patchnotes properly (Academy Law Bonus, Temple of Epona, etc) to begin with!

2) Tweaking Pontus and Macedon and making them playable without Modding. They have Introduction text, and I'm assuming they're just unfinished.

3) Re-balancing. Roman especially.

[The Spartan (Returns)]

It's weird though, I thought they would make another patch, because Alexander is 1.9 I believe.

[Shieldmaiden]

Alexander is 1.9 I believe.

Correct - but completely seperate, no BI things like Night Battles either...

[Ludens]

It's such a terrible shame that the CA have finished patching and improving R:TW - there was so much that they could have done with it to improve it's ability to be re-played and it's interest and depth.

Although I like most of your suggestions, what you are proposing is not a patch but a complete new game!

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

I know what you mean Ludens - it's just a idealism of what would be a positive direction in an upgraded version, although I understand that it probably would never happen, even if the CA were to be continuing the patching and optimizing R:TW.

[UltraWar]

Female alternatives to the current units.

[RickFGS]

Let me see....

Archers for Carthage- cmon everybody used them on ancient times, just because the balearic slinger got famous doenst mean hannibal had no archers....in fact he had a lot of them.

No phalanx units for german tribes - why is there a german unit making a greek phalanx? these guys didnt even had war tactics, they were all about ambushes and brute force, silly unit in my opinion.

Where is the Immortal unit for Persia? ok, this is after Alexander waste the Persian Empire, but then again spartans still exist in a formidable shape...

[redriver]

I'd want this CTD bug fixed. everytime I win last town standin' for a given faction... it's game over.

also, I'd like to see the large walls/towers bug fixed as well as other besiegin' bugs.

as far as content/balancin' there's way too much to mention heheh.

[Ludens]

No phalanx units for german tribes - why is there a german unit making a greek phalanx? these guys didnt even had war tactics, they were all about ambushes and brute force, silly unit in my opinion.

Where is the Immortal unit for Persia? ok, this is after Alexander waste the Persian Empire, but then again spartans still exist in a formidable shape...

Persia didn't exist in this point in time. Later it would be conquered by the Parthians, but those were steppe nomads, not true Persians, and their elite fought mounted, not on foot. So, unlike the Spartans, the Persians immortals were well and truly gone.

As for the Germans not using tactics, that's just plain wrong. Germans did not employ army drill like the Hellenes and Romans did, but they were skilled ambushers and generally less impetuous than the Celts. The German spear phalanx probably represents the shield wall, which was commonly used by lesser Germanic warriors.

[RickFGS]

Persia didn't exist in this point in time. Later it would be conquered by the Parthians, but those were steppe nomads, not true Persians, and their elite fought mounted, not on foot. So, unlike the Spartans, the Persians immortals were well and truly gone.

As for the Germans not using tactics, that's just plain wrong. Germans did not employ army drill like the Hellenes and Romans did, but they were skilled ambushers and generally less impetuous than the Celts. The German spear phalanx probably represents the shield wall, which was commonly used by lesser Germanic warriors.

Shield Wall is hardly a phalanx like the greek ones, take out the phalanx and give them better training and defensive strenght if you want to be accurate.

The first Persians were steppe nomad, so the Parthians are indeed true Persians, as for the Imortals they were revived many times like this article states, although you are correct, since the last true immortals were defeated in 333BC and this game starts almost 1 century after.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Successors

The title of "Immortals" was first revived under the Sassanids. The most famous of the Savaran units were the Zhayedan (Immortals) and numbered 10,000 men, like the Achaemenid predecessors, with the difference that they were cavalry. Their task was mainly to secure any breakthroughs and to enter battles at crucial stages.

Main article: Immortals (Byzantine)
The title of "Immortals" was again revived under the Byzantine Empire, under the Emperor Michael VII (1071–1081). His general Nikephoros reorganised the central field army ("Tagmata") of the Eastern Empire following the disastrous defeat of Manzikert by the Turks in 1071. The remnants of the provincial troops of the Eastern Themes (military provinces) were brought together in a new Imperial Guard regiment named after the Persian Immortals and reportedly also numbering about 10,000 men. These were however cavalry, like the remainder of the Byzantine field army.

Main article: Iranian Imperial Guard
The modern Iranian Army under the last Shah included an all volunteer Javedan Guard, also known as the "Immortals" after the ancient Persian royal guard. The "Immortals" were based in the Lavizan Barracks in Tehran. By 1978 this elite force comprised a brigade of 4,000–5,000 men, including a battalion of Chieftain tanks. Following the overthrow of the Imperial regime in 1979 the "Immortals" were disbanded.

So, ill stick to my previous statements, archers for carthage and no phalanx for germania.

[Shieldmaiden]

Shield Wall is hardly a phalanx like the greek ones, take out the phalanx and give them better training and defensive strenght if you want to be accurate.

I'd agree, not appropriate IMHO.

Ok, Rome isn't exactly authentic, but a German Phalanx is - possibly - more outlandish than Briton Head Hurlers, or Roman Flaming Pigs

[RickFGS]

Hehehe, still...

They did set pigs on fire a lot on those days, same as cows and everything with 4 legs they come across with :P

The head hurlers its kinda fantasy but then again it really puts the "barb" on barbarians, so its a nice touch.

[Shieldmaiden]

They did set pigs on fire a lot on those days, same as cows and everything with 4 legs they come across with :P

I wonder if a General actually tried using flaming pigs against elephants, or if its entirely fantasy? It might be a viable tactic...

The head hurlers its kinda fantasy but then again it really puts the "barb" on barbarians, so its a nice touch.

Yes, plus its only building on actual terror tactics.

Back on topic to "1.6"

I'd like to see Peasants changed - like in BI - to be only 50% effective if Garrisoned, this is so Town Watch, etc become useful.

I'd like to see the Diplomacy tweaked to be more consistent with the Campaign situation, and not feel so random.

And heresy, woo! I'd like the Marian Reforms to be delayed - to their historical date (107 BC, or say between 157 BC - 107 BC in RTW?) to give other Factions a chance before Rome goes "Uber".

This would entirely change the flavour of the Roman Campaigns, etc

[Ludens]

Shield Wall is hardly a phalanx like the greek ones, take out the phalanx and give them better training and defensive strenght if you want to be accurate.

The first Persians were steppe nomad, so the Parthians are indeed true Persians, as for the Imortals they were revived many times like this article states, although you are correct, since the last true immortals were defeated in 333BC and this game starts almost 1 century after.

I don't quite follow your logic. Both the Parthians and the Persians were steppe nomads, so the Parthians are Persians? Anyway, the Persians had ceased to be steppe nomads around 8 centuries before the start of the game. The immortals were revived by the Sassanids, not the Parthians, and as a cavalry unit, not an infantry one. The cavalry immortals are included in BI.

I agree that BI's shieldwall would be a better way of representing the German formation than the phalanx. However, the unit is not fictional: Germans used lances and dense formations. It doesn't require a genius to realize spears are more effective in a block.