KotR cataclysmic event discussion thread

[FactionHeir]

Depends on how long it takes for people to pick up saves and play them and the chancellor's game speed in general.

OK's term seems to be dragging out for a very long time due to having to wait the full 48 (if not 96 at times) and other stuff.
May I suggest that minor battles be autoresolved where possible? During my term, if there were rebel stacks or small enemy stacks somewhere, I didn't bother sending a player avatar to fight it if a garrison or captain led stack could still get to it on the same turn. Saved a lot of time.

[AussieGiant]

I'm asking because I don't get back to Zurich until the 2nd of October.

I assume it will start before then?

[FactionHeir]

I doubt it'll start before then. Probably 10th Oct is a better estimate.

[Privateerkev]

I personally disagree with all the attempts to use this event to overhaul the game in the middle. I see this as an event and then we deal with its aftermath. We might pass a new CA or two but I assume that the Charter basically will look the same after this is all said and done. I like the game the way it is. After this game, I'm willing to talk about a new game thats a little different. I want this event because it will be fun, not as an excuse to overhaul everything right in the middle of the game. Maybe its because I'm new. I haven't gotten bored with how everything goes because I am still learning how everything goes. But, it seems like some of the more veteran players are chomping at the bit to remake the whole game or ditch this one and start new. I want to make clear that, that is not why I am supporting this event idea. If we want to overhaul the whole game, that is a whole other discussion in my opinion. There should be separate discussion about it. It does not need to be folded into this discussion. Yes, after this event, things will be different. But, they probably won't be drastically different. And if they are, I rather that we get there naturally and not pre-plan it because a few people got bored.

[AussieGiant]

I also don't want to overhaul everything right now.


Guy's the game will change due to the event in my opionion.

Again we are in danger of talking ourselves into a stand still.

Lets have Econ and TC go ahead and see where it takes us.

Both men have confirmed that nothing will happen to any avatar is a person has a problem with it.

[econ21]

I'm asking because I don't get back to Zurich until the 2nd of October.

I assume it will start before then?

Factionheir's estimate sounds about right. If we assume 2 days/turn and the event happens around the end of Siegfried's reign then we looking at around 5th-14th October.

Some of the ideas in this thread for reforming how Houses work etc are interesting, but at the moment my thinking is that we will have 20 turns where wierd stuff may happen (e.g. taxes may be raised against build queue orders), then we will be back to playing as usual (just in a more challenging environment). The advantage of keeping with the existing rules is that people know how things work. Issues like people switching Houses can always be dealt with when appropriate for in character reasons through OOC CAs. I think CAs provide a good way of incrementally changing the game rules.

[econ21]

Perhaps also we could make it "first come, first served" regarding rebellious provinces. Throw away the Kaiser's right to assign provinces and instead make it that whichever House take a settlement keeps it. That knock down the geographical assigning of the provinces.

We have an unwritten convention that when a province is lost and retaken, it automatically returns to the House that held it. I think we should end that convention and make things more up for grabs. The Kaiser can allocate them afresh - and rewarding their liberators would no doubt be one consideration. It will add spice to the game. Just destroying and exactly recreating what we have now is not so interesting.

[FactionHeir]

Quite.
Although with all those events, maybe the house taking the settlement gets to keep it rather than it being assigned.

[econ21]

Although with all those events, maybe the house taking the settlement gets to keep it rather than it being assigned.

I think central authority will break down for a while - so they could keep it during the Chaos. Afterwards, I would like the Kaiser to decide - keeping things ambiguous increases the role of politics and I don't want the event to just lead to a House vs House land grab (although some unscrupulous generals are free to push it in that direction).

[FactionHeir]

That would leave all of Swabia unassigned or assigned to another hose though

[TinCow]

I'm asking because I don't get back to Zurich until the 2nd of October.

I assume it will start before then?

Definitely not. We will be working on many events to build up the story during Siegfried's term, but it will not actually begin until the end of his term (1320). So, we have the rest of OK's term and then all of Ituralde's term before the event formally begins. That doesn't mean it will be boring until then. The plot will start to roll as soon as Siegfried takes over and there will be plenty of surprises, with the situation growing more and more serious until it finally pops in 1320.

[AussieGiant]

Definitely not. We will be working on many events to build up the story during Siegfried's term, but it will not actually begin until the end of his term (1320). So, we have the rest of OK's term and then all of Ituralde's term before the event formally begins. That doesn't mean it will be boring until then. The plot will start to roll as soon as Siegfried takes over and there will be plenty of surprises, with the situation growing more and more serious until it finally pops in 1320.

Ok that's enough TC!! :)

I'm leaving again in the middle of November so I hope we can squeeze everything in there.

[Kagemusha]

Well it seems my idea is overruled by the majority. Maybe some other game. Although it seems to me some of you are not understanding what i proposed, but that could be just because of my limited grasp on English language. To me it is not very exiting to loose some cities,characters and buildings, since because after couple Chancellors we are back to square one. The AI simply is no match for us, without real internal struggle.

[Privateerkev]

That would leave all of Swabia unassigned or assigned to another house though

It seems the Swabians will just have to learn the art of "Kaiser butt-kissing", like a lot of us have. And, if you've been paying attention to how things are going in-game, throw in some "Empress butt-kissing" too.



You can plot against the Kaiser all you want, but you better be really good and really sneaky about it.

[TevashSzat]

It seems the Swabians will just have to learn the art of "Kaiser butt-kissing", like a lot of us have. And, if you've been paying attention to how things are going in-game, throw in some "Empress butt-kissing" too.



You can plot against the Kaiser all you want, but you better be really good and really sneaky about it.

Begins to hope that you can hire other factions to assasinate your faction leader....

[FactionHeir]

The Danes actually have tried but failed. Guess we have to pay them better

[Tamur]

No, they failed against Fritz as well. I think what we need is to give the Danes enough money to establish a company which gives motivational speeches at assassin training institutions...

"Assassins from other countries are chased by their own snakes. Or stand exactly where their victims can break their noses with a suddenly opened door. Or hide in squeaky-lidded barrels with primitive blow-guns. But not you! You are good. You are great. You are totally in control. You are Danish assassins!"

[econ21]

As promised, tomorrow (Friday) I will be putting up a poll to see if the planned event is authorised. I am thinking about the following phrasing:

In the next 20 turns after the coming Diet, econ21 and TinCow are authorised to engineer a cataclysmic event and ensuing chaos. They will take control of the savegame (as Chancellors do) but may do things for out of character reasons to simulate the event/chaos that no Chancellor would do. For example, disbanding armies, raising taxes, limiting recruitment etc. This will involve suspending some parts of the Charter during this period (e.g. Emergency Diets will not be able to immediately undo what is being engineered).

Shout out now if you think the poll should be re-phrased. But it's not meant to be a very precise proposal, more a vote of confidence in TC and I acting as gamesmasters to create and oversee the event.

[Privateerkev]

Maybe something that makes clear that it will only be 10 turns of catyclysm after 10 turns of build up. So, only 10 turns where the rules are suspended and we interact with the special OOC only Chancellor. Also, has it been decided whether TC will be just an OOC Chancellor or will he have to play an IC one as well? He mentioned, and I support, an idea where there is only an OOC Chancellor for 10 turns.

[econ21]

We still have to work out the details, such as the timing of the event. I'd like the 20 turn flexibility, if only to allow us to ratchet up the tension and keep you all guessing about exactly when the @#$%^&!!! is going to hit the fan. At the moment, the thinking is that Lothar won't be Chancellor, so when he controls the save, TC will be acting as a disembodied Games Master fulfilling much of the role of the Chancellor rather than as Lothar. But I don't want to reveal the exact nature of TC's stint.

[Privateerkev]

I guess it doesn't matter how long or short the cataclysm is. I just want to know for sure when the interaction between us and the chancellor will change. It can happen during the Kaiser's term. Its just that, when it begins, I want to know it begins. Otherwise, I'll be pm'ing Ituralde IC about tax levels when its really part of the cataclysm.

So, I'm all for giving you guys 20 turns flexibility. But, I'd feel more comfortable knowing when we are suspending the Charter and when we are to interact with an OOC Chancellor. I'm not asking for that answer now. I just want it to be clear and obvious when it happens since we are so drastically changing the rules and chancellor/elector relationship for the duration of the event.

I guess the jist of what I'm saying is; If you need us to act different, we need to know when to act different.

:D

[TinCow]

It will be like this:

For the first 10 turns (Siegfried's Chancellorship), the game will generally proceed as normal. This will be the time when we start building up the plot to explain the cataclysm. For the most part, normal Edicts and laws will be obeyed. The only difference will be that (1) we may have to do a few 'illegal' things a couple times to advance the plot and (2) there will be no possibility of impeachment. You will still be issuing build orders for your provinces, the Household Armies will still do whatever the Dukes want, and the Reich will generally proceed about normal business (though things will become increasingly tense). Keep on scheming and ploting like normal, you guys seem good at that. A few players may even have rolls to play in helping the plots develop, so normal interactions with other players will work smoothly.

At the end of the first 10 turns (1320), when we would normally have a Diet Session, the cataclysm will begin and continue for the next 10 turns. I will give specific OOC instructions to you at that point, but generally everything changes. There will be no election, no legislation, and the only thing you can count on is that the world isn't going to be a pleasant place. This will be the period when I am 'DMing' the game. You can give build queues for your provinces and orders for your armies if you want to, but it's unlikely that I will allow much construction at all and any army orders will quickly become totally obsolete. At the same time, you will have far more control over exactly what your avatars are doing, should you wish to. As I said before, I will give you a few general choices that I think represent logical decisions before you. However, you are also totally free to tell me to do anything you want with your avatar. Just remember that I will manipulate the game world around you, no matter what you do, so no result is guaranteed. For example, you can tell me that you're going to march south until you're out of movement, but I may toss an army in your way if I think I have reason to do so.

When the 10 cataclysm turns are over (1340), all laws and game rules will go back into effect. There will be a normal Diet Session and an election for Chancellor. Everything will then proceed as it always has, except that the Reich will be in a much more difficult and challenging position.

[Northnovas]

Too easy, very well explained TC. Looking forward to the Dark Age of the Reich.

[AussieGiant]

***ANNOUCEMENT***

Gentlemen,

It's a leap of faith...inherent with all leaps of faith will be your acceptance of removing the "CONTROL FREAK" part of your personality at the front door.

Please note there will be a "CONTROL FREAK" detector test at the front entrance to assist you with this process.

Anyone trying to sneak their said; "CONTROL FREAK" characteristic into this session of the game will be ask to leave or strip down naked for a full cavity search so the removal of the said; "CONTROL FREAK" part of your personality can be done without incident.

Please note, those that successfully circumvent the security procedures in place will be easily identified as they will be having a REAL BAD TIME PLAYING THE GAME.

Moments of frustration, screaming, crying, wanting their mommy, a security blanket and other such pacifying devices will be clear signs of a successful breach of the security system in place.

Those of you planning on doing this should be aware of this before hand.

A full set of Terms and Conditions will be sent to you in the near future.

Please have your legal council, mothers, sisters and other people warned in advance of the removal of you control freak personality by this game.

***END OF ANNOUCEMENT***

[Privateerkev]

Yes AG I totally agree its a leap of faith and I will take it. But, I am well within my rights to ask the parameters. They are asking for things from me. I asked for things from them. And they have answered quite well. No cavity search will be required, and if it is, it certainly won't be performed by you.

[econ21]

This was a useful discussion. The vote thread is now up. Further general discussion can continue in the OOC thread. Queries and proposals about specific avatars' roles in the cataclysm may be best done by PMs to TinCow or I.