Turkey Recalls Ambassador Over Genocide Resolution

[PanzerJaeger]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/10/...ans/index.html

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,301221,00.html

ANKARA, Turkey — Turkey ordered its ambassador in Washington to return to Turkey for consultations over a U.S. House panel's approval of a bill describing the World War I-era mass killings of Armenians as genocide, a Foreign Ministry spokesman said Thursday.

So, is it worth risking US relations with Turkey which are crucial to the progress of the Iraq War to make sure the Armenian Genocide isn't lost in history?

[FactionHeir]

I'd say so, yes.

Relations may be more or less useful for the 'war', but there are other nations in the region too which are US vassals.

Besides, wouldn't it be ... hypocritical to not denounce a genocide just because you want to be in someone's good will? Denounce terror and genocide and those who do not support you, but your friends can do all that and get away with it?

Of course that would be nothing new.
So what's next? Darfur is not a genocide?

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Seems a bit late and pointless to denounce it really, what purpose does it serve? How is the current Turkish government responsible.

[PanzerJaeger]

Seems a bit late and pointless to denounce it really, what purpose does it serve? How is the current Turkish government responsible.

They are not responsible, but they deny it at all costs.

[FactionHeir]

Its not like the current German government is responsible for the holocaust either though.

Either way, this is not about which government is responsible, but to highlight the plight of those affected and their extended families and survivors. If Turkey feels not directly responsible, then they shouldn't make a fuss about it.

[The Wizard]

That's the weird part. Neither the Turkish Republic nor its founders had anything to do with the genocide (unlike the German state which is the legal successor to the German Reich; mind you we're talking legalities here, if we're talking practical matters it's something different), but it's the Turkish Republic that is so virulently denying it was a genocide in the first place, allowing the Armenian state (rightfully so after that) to demand an apology.

The question here is how far are the Turks willing to go. If they cut off U.S. air supplies they're risking a whole lot -- their position in the NATO and their supply of fresh craft for their air fleet. I don't think they'll try stuff like that; in a bluffing game it's big ol' Uncle Sam that's got the cards.

[Samurai Waki]

I think the Turk's refuse it on a matter of pride (not that this is necessarily a bad thing) as it can be argued the the Armenians weren't exactly peaches to begin with either. I don't condone mass killings of any kind, (der) but I'm of the belief that this was an armed uprising handled very very incorrectly, not a genocide.

[AntiochusIII]

They are not responsible, but they deny it at all costs.

Probably they thought some illusory "national pride" is at stake.

Bah, nationalists.

[Devastatin Dave]

Seems a bit late and pointless to denounce it really, what purpose does it serve? How is the current Turkish government responsible.

What's the purpose? Well its so the dems and there 5th column liberal buddies can cut of the supplies to the troops they're always talking about "supporting". There was a time when citizens of the United States and their representatives wanted whats best for the country, not anymore. San Fran Nan should be tried for treason.

[Louis VI the Fat]

You too, eh? Quite a déjà vu.

[Tribesman]

Bad timing eh , a day after cross border shelling and a week before a vote on invasion .

[IrishArmenian]

Yes, really. And they think we work with the PKK! I support the idea of a Kurdish nation in Northern Iraq, but I will not tolerate terrorism or the killing of innocents. I really hope that with this we can join Georgia in being supported by the US rather than Russia. Georgia really came out of the USSR firing on all cylinders, which I truly do admire-- although they didn't have to deal with a devastating earthquake and some stupid conflict caused by nationalism and a lack of truly caring leaders.
Why the cynicism? We're human but we're not evil.

I apologize, I seem to display the Armenian stereotype of being a political one-trick horse. We're not actually like that, but I don't really think that the crowd here at the .Org is the closeminded generalisation favoring group.

[KukriKhan]

Bad timing eh , a day after cross border shelling and a week before a vote on invasion .

Yes, indeed. If Turkey, further emboldened by anger at the US resolution, launches anti-PKK attacks into northern Iraq, what leg has the US to stand on if Iran does the same, to respond to their PKK cross-border attacks? Repel Iran, but not Turkey? Or repel both Iran and a NATO ally? Or stand there crying "stop"?

And, as a side note, if we're gonna offocially deplore genocides (a term not coined until 1943), how soon will we see the resolution deploring the genocide of native americans?

[Husar]

Irish Armenian, I like to hear your opinion and to me (ok, I don't really know a lot about the topic ) you don't sound very biased. Maybe biased towards peace and understanding.

That said, I don't know what's so bad about acknowledging the bad things someone else has done, is it just because he happened to be born inside the same national borders?

I don't know why the US even thinks about how to look upon this but then big organizations always want to say something about events that hardly have anything to do with them.
Guess it's to show support for the armenian community as some said.

[Tribesman]

Now heres a thought that perhaps one of the Turkish members could ponder .
If people in Turkey campaigned against 301 which is used to cover prosecution for calling the events genocide , would they be breaching that law by their actions?

[IrishArmenian]

Irish Armenian, I like to hear your opinion and to me (ok, I don't really know a lot about the topic ) you don't sound very biased. Maybe biased towards peace and understanding.

Alright, you asked for it.
It is stupid that such an issue is debated by the American congress. They may be the ones who decide what to do about it, but they are politicians, not historians!
Of course its Genocide! Such an affront to human rights is generally called a genocide, yes? The American Indians, the Jews, homosexuals, Gypsies and others in World War II and many others serve as examples. Real 'repopulation attempts' include provisions, whereas Armenians were marched into the desert with absolutely nothing, shot if they stopped! Real 'repopulation attempts' do not involve gang-rape and burning at the stake. The once prosperous and esteemed Armenian population--known to some historians as 'The Jews of the Ottoman Empire' in that they were an ethnic and religious minority that held mostly financial and administrative positions--suddenly dissapeared should've raised a few eyebrows, and it did amongst many people, including many Turks, who thought of us as a productive and respectful people. All of a sudden, we were no where to be found. We couldn't've possibly fallen of the edge of the earth, so what happened? Its quite obvious when one pursues the facts.
I'm also disgusted with my wayward brothers who seek violent revenge against the Turkish people for it, though. Sure, I think that we were wronged and well, got the shaft when Armenia emerged--Lake Van and Ararat are all I ask, but I digress--but pinning this on the Turkish people or the Turkish government is simply idiotic. As I stated earlier, the Genocide was the work of nationalists and the scum of the empire, recruited from the prisons. Sure, the Turkish government has downplayed the Genocide in a rather insulting fashion, trying to cover something up that was in no way their problem, inadvertently making it their problem, but they didn't commit the Genocide. The Turkish people didn't do it, come on, many hid us from the authorities, risking their lives and the lives of their families*. That is true brotherhood! It saddens me that many of our Turkish brothers have been indoctrinated by their government, but they might be saying the same about me, so that is a pointless endeavour.
Still, people are entitled to their own opinion. The law that was put up--did they succeed?--in France really hurts the cause. That idea of making it a law would reduce France to the level of the present Turkish government, which can arrest one on the grounds of 'Insulting Turkish Identity', which is a load of rot!
The whole situation makes me excruciatingly angry. If there was admittance, compensation, we could go on living our lives as brothers, but no! Some ten-watts on both sides think that compromise for the weak. What fools! They are obviously blind to the way the world works.
I admit, some Armenians, in retaliation for the Hamidian Massacres of the late 19th century, in which hundreds of thousands of Armenians were killed, massacred some Turkish towns. Terrible! Atrocious! I am truly ashamed that they did that in the name of Armenia and the Armenian people!
What wee need is to forgive, have a coming together, and the prosper as brothers, as we should! "No!" says the nationalist, "We should punish them for their insolence!" The politicians cater to what they percieve as the masses, but if they looked to the real masses, they'd see people tired of feuding and wanting to set their differences aside. No politicans want that, though, then people actually unite, which politicans fear the most.
This is merely an issue of people thinking that through adament denial, they can rewrite history, which is absolute bollocks.
*"There is no evil without the smallest measure of good"
--Armenian proverb