Jailbreak in Gaza

[Don Corleone]

Apartheid. Holocaust references. Facism. Yes, those nasty Israelis deserve all the scorn in the world, don't they Beirut? Why won't they just let those Palestinians blow up children at school and shut up about it? Why won't they just go away? Why won't they just shut up and die?

In all the years of arguing this topic with you, I've never once heard you offer a solution that doesn't coincide with the Palestinian solution... kill all the Israelis. Hmmm, and somehow, the Israelis are the thugs.

[Ice]

Apartheid. Holocaust references. Facism. Yes, those nasty Israelis deserve all the scorn in the world, don't they Beirut? Why won't they just let those Palestinians blow up children at school and shut up about it? Why won't they just go away? Why won't they just shut up and die?

In all the years of arguing this topic with you, I've never once heard you offer a solution that doesn't coincide with the Palestinian solution... kill all the Israelis. Hmmm, and somehow, the Israelis are the thugs.

It's fairly typical. I see it from both sides here actually.

Once again, both sides are at fault. The Israelis are starving the people of Gaza, while the government in Gaza allows and most likely funds rocket attacks in Israel. No one here is really in the right.

I guess pointless bickering about who has the moral high ground works better though than finding a solution.

[Ronin]

Apartheid. Holocaust references. Facism. Yes, those nasty Israelis deserve all the scorn in the world, don't they Beirut? Why won't they just let those Palestinians blow up children at school and shut up about it? Why won't they just go away? Why won't they just shut up and die?

In all the years of arguing this topic with you, I've never once heard you offer a solution that doesn't coincide with the Palestinian solution... kill all the Israelis. Hmmm, and somehow, the Israelis are the thugs.

they´re both thugs....both sides in that problem have long ago lost the right to call them selfs the "good guys"....I say try to keep the explosions to a minimum...and that´s as good as it´s gonna get.

[Beirut]

Apartheid. Holocaust references. Facism. Yes, those nasty Israelis deserve all the scorn in the world, don't they Beirut? Why won't they just let those Palestinians blow up children at school and shut up about it? Why won't they just go away? Why won't they just shut up and die?

I think you'll be hard pressed to find any post where I said that.

In all the years of arguing this topic with you, I've never once heard you offer a solution that doesn't coincide with the Palestinian solution... kill all the Israelis. Hmmm, and somehow, the Israelis are the thugs.

I think you wil be hard pressed to find any post where I said that either.

Anything else?

[Don Corleone]

I never said you advocate Hamas's exterminate all Jews policy. I said you've never offered an alternative, just that you agree with their conclusions. I've offered a 2-state solution as a compromise, and you've rejected it. You seem quite fixed on the idea that Jews must leave Israel. Where, according to superior powers of logic, should they go?

[Beirut]

I never said you advocate Hamas's exterminate all Jews policy. I said you've never offered an alternative, just that you agree with their conclusions. I've offered a 2-state solution as a compromise, and you've rejected it. You seem quite fixed on the idea that Jews must leave Israel.

I think the founding of Isreal where a population already lived was criminal. No bones about that. But I have said in the past, more than once, that since they're there, they're there, and they're going to stay there.

A two state solution is the way. I've said that before as well. But that means an independant Palestine, not a slave state permanently under the Israeli yoke and gun, which is what Israel wants.

You seem quite fixed on the idea that Jews must leave Israel.

You'll be hard pressd to find where I ever said that either.

Where, according to superior powers of logic, should they go?

Superior powers of logic? Arf! I think we'd need AdrianII in here for that.

[Xiahou]

Sounds like problem solved then. Egypt can surely take care of the oppressed Palestinians that they care so deeply about and with Gaza being abandoned, there will be no one to bother the Israelis. That was easy- should've done it decades ago.

[Beirut]

Sounds like problem solved then. Egypt can surely take care of the oppressed Palestinians that they care so deeply about and with Gaza being abandoned, there will be no one to bother the Israelis. That was easy- should've done it decades ago.

Egypt should help the Palestinians. So should every Arab country. It is shameful that the Arabs left the Palestinians to suffer under the Israelis for so long just to use them for political gain. With all that oil money they have, the Arabs (Iran as well) should be building schools and hospitals in Gaza by the dozens. Granted, the Israelis will blow them up as soon as they're built, but at least building them is a good start.

[Geoffrey S]

And as always Israelis become [insert adjective] Jews, murdering suicide bombers become freedom fighters, a debate becomes a series of disconnected attempts at justifying murder on either side, and I become rather bored...

[Paradox]

I'm glad Hosni Mubarak isn't being an ass about it this time, helping the Palestinians is something that not even our lazy middle-eastern governments care about.

[Husar]

And as always Israelis become [insert adjective] Jews, murdering suicide bombers become freedom fighters, a debate becomes a series of disconnected attempts at justifying murder on either side, and I become rather bored...

Why do you hate freedom?
Is that an attempt to stifle free speech? Are we here to entertain you?

That said, I do think the Palestinians have every right in the world to bomb Israel into the Pacific ocean and after that they have every right to take revenge on the UK who put the Israelis there in the first place, then they should nuke the US for supporting the UK and Israel, then Europe for trading with both and if they still feel a bit sad afterwards they can kill every Asian because they sold everybody their cheap goods. If that doesn't make up for their suffering I'd have to say that they're quite demanding but since I wouldn't exist anymore at that point, I won't have to think about that.

[Ice]

And as always Israelis become [insert adjective] Jews, murdering suicide bombers become freedom fighters, a debate becomes a series of disconnected attempts at justifying murder on either side, and I become rather bored...

Indeed.

We seem to be seeing eye to on this.

I keep wanting to post replies to both sides on this, but I just stop myself and decide it's really not worth the aggravation.

[Vladimir]

Whoever said genocide wasn't the answer is a fool. Kill the side that is less hostile to us.

Since this thread is based on emotion I might as well throw mine in. Given enough time no one will care.

Mind you none of this would have happen if Israel hadn't handed the land back to its "native" inhabitants.

(Last edit) There is no reason here thanks to the opening post.

[doc_bean]

Hamas and the terrorists are still supported by the people since Israel is still trying to expand and colonize Palestine further. The wall is often placed deep within what is officially palestine territory and there are several places entirely within palestine territory that are still occupied. Like Hebron, 400 settlers, 1100 soldiers to guard them.
No wonder the Palestians are still andry and still feel like they are fighting a war.

The Israeli government is imo still supported since they convinced the Israeli people that if they weaken for just the tiniest amount, they will all be killed by angry Arabs. Have you ever seen footage of Israeli soldiers guarding the wall ? Most of the ones I saw looked embarresed to be there. They have to be inhuman towards kids (who are not allowed to go the hospital if their papers aren't perfectly in order, even if they're bleeding half to death), and imo it kills most of them inside. I've heard a mother of a young man who was killed in a suicide attack say that she understands where the hatred from the Palestinians come from.

Both sides feel they have to be strong and tough, both sides support cruel and violent regimes. They have more in common than they'd ever want to admit

[Crazed Rabbit]

Hamas and the terrorists are still supported by the people since Israel is still trying to expand and colonize Palestine further.

Oh, by making unilateral concessions like withdrawing from Gaza?

CR

[x-dANGEr]

To the first, quite happily. Big mess all around largely caused by the Brits taking over, and the later Israelis capitalized on a situation in which the area was basically up for grabs.

Why should the Palestinian people take the hit when Britain promises and gives what it doesn't own?

[seireikhaan]

Don, are you telling me that depriving Palestinians of fuel and food is somehow going to deter attacks by radicals? You think sanctions which starve a populace is somehow going to make the average person LIKE Israel more, and thus diminish terrorist threats? Or do you think that getting revenge is more important than actually working towards peace?

[Don Corleone]

Gaza is an independentally controlled area. It's Palestine, if you're looking for a Res Publica to assign it to. Israel has no control there. What Israel has done is establish a wall where no weapons will pass from Egypt to Gaza. Sooner or later, when your neighbor continues to shell you, you try to limit his access to weaponry.

But if anybody read the link I posted (and for the record, don't let the name fool you, the Jerusalem Post is no Olmert apologist), Hamas has decreed as long as shipments are inspected, they'll consider that a boycott and no goods will be allowed.

This is, for lack of a better word, a self-inflicted 'famine', blamed on who else? Those filthy Jews, yet again.

[Beirut]

Gaza is an independentally controlled area. It's Palestine, if you're looking for a Res Publica to assign it to. Israel has no control there. What Israel has done is establish a wall where no weapons will pass from Egypt to Gaza. Sooner or later, when your neighbor continues to shell you, you try to limit his access to weaponry.

Israel has built a wall to control the people. Period. They want the Palestinians subjegated. Anything less is unacceptable. If the Palestinians "go free", it will show that Israel has been repressing an entire people for generations. Keep them locked up, keep them looking and acting like savages, then they can brutalize them at will and save face with the excuse of, "Oh, but they want to kill us all. Poor, poor us!"

This is, for lack of a better word, a self-inflicted 'famine', blamed on who else? Those filthy Jews, yet again.

A self-inflicted famine?

That's as extraordinary a statement as I have seen in my five-years at the Org.

And would you please stop calling them filthy Jews. The three kindest, gentlest, most humane people I have ever known were all Jewish, and none of them were filthy in any way.

[Crazed Rabbit]

Israel has built a wall to control the people. Period. They want the Palestinians subjegated. Anything less is unacceptable. If the Palestinians "go free", it will show that Israel has been repressing an entire people for generations. Keep them locked up, keep them looking and acting like savages, then they can brutalize them at will and save face with the excuse of, "Oh, but they want to kill us all. Poor, poor us!"

Geez, Beirut. Do you really think all that BS is real?

They built the wall to stop the Palestinians from sending suicide bombers into Israel. And guess what - it works. What have Hamas and Fatah done after the recent unilateral concessions by Israel? Continued the terrorism. What makes you think they'll stop before they kill all the Israelis? If they had the power Israel had over Palestine, they'd kill every Israeli.

And would you please stop calling them filthy Jews.

How nice of you only to slander Israelis as pure evil.

CR

[seireikhaan]

Gaza is an independentally controlled area. It's Palestine, if you're looking for a Res Publica to assign it to. Israel has no control there. What Israel has done is establish a wall where no weapons will pass from Egypt to Gaza. Sooner or later, when your neighbor continues to shell you, you try to limit his access to weaponry.

But if anybody read the link I posted (and for the record, don't let the name fool you, the Jerusalem Post is no Olmert apologist), Hamas has decreed as long as shipments are inspected, they'll consider that a boycott and no goods will be allowed.

This is, for lack of a better word, a self-inflicted 'famine', blamed on who else? Those filthy Jews, yet again.

Hmm? Did YOU read the article? A) I'm not sure I trust the Jerusalem post on an issue regarding Palestinians, B) It never stated ANYWHERE that Hamas inflicted any kind of famine on the people, only blackouts, and C) ITS HAMAS' JOB TO HELP THE PEOPLE THERE! OF COURSE HE'S GOING TO WANT THE SANCTIONS LIFTED, PEOPLE ARE GOING WITHOUT FREAKIN' FOOD, WATER, AND GASOLINE! Would you not expect your own regional leader to stand up for you if you were in the Palestinian position? And before you even go on about Hamas not being elected, how far do you think he'd get if he didn't get support from the populace?

[woad&fangs]

This will never get solved by politics. This ends when the country's youth look at each other and judge, not on the other persons religion, but on the content of each others character.* If the Palestinians are Ghettoed inside a wall(that bitter taste in your mouth is called hypocrisy. The remedy is to apologize and to tear down the wall) than the Israelis will see rockets instead of the people behind the wall. Rockets don't create friendships, people do.


*I'm on a MLK Jr. binge right now. Isreal could really benefit from a King Jr. like figure right now.

[woad&fangs]

This will never get solved by politics. This ends when the country's youth look at each other and judge, not on the other persons religion, but on the content of each others character.* If the Palestinians are Ghettoed inside a wall(that bitter taste in your mouth is called hypocrisy. The remedy is to apologize and to tear down the wall) than the Israelis will see rockets instead of the people behind the wall. Rockets don't create friendships, people do.


*I'm on a MLK Jr. binge right now. Plus, Isreal could really benefit from a King Jr. like figure right now.