Using -mod:my_mod

[Epistolary Richard]

A map.rwm will generate in your :mod folder. I know thing that music.dat has to be deleted or renamed in your vanilla folder for new music to take effect.

[Teleklos Archelaou]

I cannot see that a descr_vegetation.db file regenerates though. Is there a way to force it to? I would guess probably not, but just asking.

[Stuie]

The biggest drawback of -mod:my_mod is that while it works nice for pure RTW mods, it's horrible for BI mods.

Since BI itself is sort of "RTW -mod:bi", in order to make -mod:my_mod work for BI you need to copy entire BI folder to your mod folder in order to make it work.

I think I finally figured this out. You need to put your mod folder in the BI folder, and then use this on the command line:

"C:\Program Files\Activision\Rome - Total War\RomeTW-BI.exe" -mod:bi/modname

I tried it real quick with TFT, and v1.6 shows on the Options screen, and I can start a campaign. Didn't go much further than that due to time constraints, but it looks promising.

[Dol Guldur]

Hmmmm...thanks Stuie...I will look into this next week perhaps.

[Makanyane]

"C:\Program Files\Activision\Rome - Total War\RomeTW-BI.exe" -mod:bi/modname

Would be really pleased if I could get this to work, have tried setting up file structure have copied in all text files from data and data/text and my mods /world folder and some other changed files but am getting crash on 1st loading screen, i.e. before any menu.

Any idea yet what minimum files / folders are?

EDIT: am now trying to work back from pasting in entire bi folder (re-named to modname) into bi/modname folder it definitely loads initially, trying to see what can be deleted, taking out all model folders, show_err is moaning about models_building/spot_fx, models_strat/symbol_faction.cas, models_engine/heavy_onager.cas and models_effects/torches.cas
if anyhone knows how to correct path names in appropriate files please post, otherwise I'll keep experimenting, (this is not for changed files just trying to get vanilla back to working via fewer files in -mod)

[The_White_Knight]

Good guides!

How can you make a -mod switch for a mod which changes UI files like general portraits and more without interfering with vanilla? I can't find the .txt-file associated with it.

I know of descr_agent_ancillary.txt, so I could potentially change the ancillaries-UI, but not the generals'/civilians' portraits.

I'm currently in the proces of making a -modswitch for Blue Lotus as a personal challenge and as a means to save HD-space.

Edit: Never mind, examination of Chiv - TW learnt me that you don't need to alter any .txt for that.
Edit2: I'm experiencing unexplainable ctd's when loading the campaignmap (imperial campaign). Any ideas here? Do I need to alter the files in imperial_campaign in any way or can I just pop the world-folder in the my_mod/data folder without changing anything? (apparently not)

[Makanyane]

Returning to implementation of

"C:\Program Files\Activision\Rome - Total War\RomeTW-BI.exe" -mod:bi/modname

I've got it working for my mod that was previously overwritten onto a different BI installation. Seems to work with minimal editing of the mod files but required folder still seems very big - unless I'm missing something.

Biggest space hog is that all UI folder still seems to be required. ??

As compared to the BI data structure I can omit all models_unit except unique skins etc. which need path in descr_model_battle.txt altered to bi/modname/data..... I seem to be able to omit sprites (no unique sprites), animations and sounds folders; and items folder if descr_items.txt and db are taken out as well. The models_strat 'officer' etc .cas files and textures can go (unless unique then path change in descr_model_strat as above) but the banner textures and .cas are required.

Trying to omit text files (have tried descr_sounds_.. and export_descr_advice) gives culture not recognised errors, as it seems to still be referencing directly to RTW/data for missing text files. This makes me worried that it may be referring to RTW/data for items & sounds folder content and could fall over later when/if it gets to missing BI elements.

Any one else made any progress on this???

[Dol Guldur]

I've just managed to get some time to look at this and after 45 minutes or so have only been able to launch the targeted shortcut to start up vanilla BI with not a hint of the mod :(

Hmmm...I have obviously failed to understand the above. Makanyane, can you state the steps you took to get it to (at least) start working?

I cannot see what I am doing wrong here.

[Makanyane]

Dol Guldur,
really didn't do anything special,
I'd got to launching vanilla BI stage by making new folder in RTW/BI called 'modname' and pasting entire (BI) data folder into it, if vanilla BI is working off shortcut I assume you got to this stage.

- I already had my mod in a zip folder designed to overwrite a vanilla BI install i.e with data/ structure already in place containing all changed files. I just copied my mods data/ folder over R-TW/BI/modname/data to overwrite files - that got all icons / banners / maps in without any further editing. I just had to change path to textures as they where modded for strat map captains etc. which gave -show_err message during campaign loading bar.

Seems to work regardless of whether campaign folder is named for provincial or main campaign.

Sounds rude to suggest this; but are you sure data folder you put your mod files in is the one the path name is refering to. Also if your approach was similar to mine did it actually overwrite files or did you get modname/data/data?
(yes I missed extraction path and got that first time out)

[Dol Guldur]

I'm late coming to this feature and have never used, explored or paid much attention to it due to the fact that it was my opinion it could never service a full-conversion BI mod (or do it in a manner that would leave the RTW (and now BI we hope) files untouched - which really is the whole purpose of the thing in ther first place).

Let me comment on your post, so as to clarify what you did:

Dol Guldur,
really didn't do anything special,
I'd got to launching vanilla BI stage by making new folder in RTW/BI called 'modname' and pasting entire (BI) data folder into it, if vanilla BI is working off shortcut I assume you got to this stage.

You posted your entire modded BI folder in or the entire vanilla? What did you do with the RTW data folder for your mod?

I was actually getting RTW vanilla and not BI vanilla. Sorry.

- I already had my mod in a zip folder designed to overwrite a vanilla BI install i.e with data/ structure already in place containing all changed files. I just copied my mods data/ folder over R-TW/BI/modname/data to overwrite files - that got all icons / banners / maps in without any further editing. I just had to change path to textures as they where modded for strat map captains etc. which gave -show_err message during campaign loading bar.

Ah, so you did put vanilla in first - did not read that in the BI tutorial above.

Seems to work regardless of whether campaign folder is named for provincial or main campaign. Sounds rude to suggest this; but are you sure data folder you put your mod files in is the one the path name is refering to. Also if your approach was similar to mine did it actually overwrite files or did you get modname/data/data?
(yes I missed extraction path and got that first time out)

I always avoid those problems by stubbornly refusing to use installers - or using them to extract to a "safe" place and the copying manually - because I really only trust what I can see ;)

I must admit to a distinct weakness in being able to think on more than one level at a time and am just about able ot cope with the idea that BI draws off some RTW data files. This will challenge me. But then, does not all coding...? ;)

I need to get my head around this though I have a horrible feeling that it will be more work than it is worth; but I need to see it for myself ;)

[Makanyane]

You posted your entire modded BI folder in or the entire vanilla?

I actually pasted in entire vanilla BI folder (renamed to modname) into BI folder to test that I at least got vanilla BI then pasted mod files over it and got mod. (tutorial above wasn't implying you needed whole folder but when I tried with just mod files and clicked shortcut, for my mod it attempts to start but doesn't reach any selection screen so then tried using entire BI folder to see if I could get path working at all; I think my mod may not have modified some of the files needed to get this working so it does not work on its own.)

If your mod is currently overwritten on a bi folder; you can copy that entire folder into a seperate installation of vanilla RTW/BI so structure goes
R-TW/BI (vanilla)/BI (your mod) and make the shorcut
"C:\Program Files\Activision\Rome - Total War\RomeTW-BI.exe" -mod:bi/bi
that shorcut will then load your mod, and a shortcut without the -mod bit will load vanilla BI. Flaw is, at this stage you've still got 2x BI folder size on hard disc - the only thing I'm so far convinced you can remove from your modded (bi/bi) folder is the vanilla bits of models_unit, animations and sprites (unique bits can stay in bi/bi but you need to change your descr_model_battle and strat to find them)

You don't do anything at all to RTW/data.

To release as a mod this way; at least you're not disabling normal BI campaign and it doesn't require complete new RTW & BI install - but you'd still either need a read me that specifies which vanilla files have to be copied to the bi/modname (or bi/bi whatever.. ) structure, or an installer that copies the missing vanilla files over.

[Dol Guldur]

Indeed, copying over the entire vanilla was not in my head simply because I thought the purpose of -mod was to avoid the need to take up unnecessary hard-disk space. ;)

But will vanilla remain untouched even if this is done?

The vanilla BI draws off the main rtw data for certain elements and it would seem some of these will not work from inside BI.

My rome data folder element of my mod folder structure, for example, includes:

Music packs (cannot get these to work outside of the rome data folder)
Entire UI elements for the creation of an additional new culture
pack files
vegetation files (and db)
terrain files
modded resources & wonders
loading screens & loading bars etc

I have not thoroughly looked into their importing into BI but some I know will not import, and these will affect vanilla.

The vegetation issues, for example, will cause crashes if not placed in BI (and my tests show it does not port). Music will not port, though I have heard some say it does (I have set up every path imaginable!); loading bars will not work in BI; terrain files will not work I am told but I have read about a possible workaround for that one; I am not sure if my mod_0.pak file will work outside of the rome data pack folder (and if it does not it may override other pack folders and cause problems in vanilla)...I have not packed the unit voices yet...there will I fear be a horrific amount of repathing on all these packs and files.

It seems, as things stand, that the -mod feature for BI is not making the installation of the mod any easier for the player.

EDIT: OK, basic mod working as far as loading, graphics and menus are concerned. Rome data folder elements currently merged into Rome data. Over next couple of days will look at repathing issues in order to get CBs, campaigns etc. working .

[Makanyane]

I'm starting to believe that the -mod:bi/modname actually just does the same as -mod:my mod in terms of getting a BI mod to work under BI.exe: ie. you need to copy in everything from the BI folder that's required for BI except things like textures that can have a defined relative path, or things that got duplicated into RTW with the post BI patches everything else I'm pretty sure (unless I'm doing something wrong -help?!) its still only looking for in modname/data first then rtw/data. I suppose that does at least mean BI vanilla folder should be able to remain untouched!

(Also recently realised that TFT mod Stuie mentioned having working via modname, is I think for RTW not BI unless there's a second version of it.)

It still could be worth getting this to work even if its not as neat as RTW mod -mod solution. Unfortunately I know no-where near enough to advise on music pack issues etc.

[Dol Guldur]

Ah, well wait 'til you get to the strat map cas files and have no 3ds max to see which memory textures go with each model ;) (fortunately the show_err seems to report these well enough).

I am still proceeding slowly but need to get all my rtw bits working in bi first before I continue on the mymod folder.

I think this will involve several phases of completion. I will see how far I can get in the next 24 hours or so before I make a decision as to whether it is really worth it.

Many mods are not for BI, and many mods are roman-era and maybe do not mod certain elements that no-roman-eras do. This is probably not taken into account with such things as the -mod switch (for BI at least), but we will see...

Now I must work on ground type TGAs for the aerial map....

EDIt: Yep, Foot is quite right - the ground type TGAs will not repath neither does there seem a reference to the text file in order to repath it from there. Our TGAs are already renamed, but of course any mod using the -mod switch with modded ground type TGAs where they have left the names the same as vanilla or where, by coincidence, have called them the same as another mod using the switch; well, the map's not going to look like it ought to ;)

So the first rule for mod switch users is definitely to use unique TGA names here - I'd suggest Foot's approach of using the mod abbrev. prefix. We use "4a_" (helps see everything listed in the same place in files too for viewing and manipulation!), Foot above is using "eb_".

Now on to loading bars where, alas, the same method cannot be implemented I believe...

EDIT 3: Nah, as already mentioned, loading bars seem quite stubborn. This means mids with modded bars and overlays will overwrite each other, so each mod you play will have the latest mod's loading bars ;) There are ways around it but they all involve the player having to rename files so it might be best just to have the variety of bars :) Something to put in the install notes though.

EDIT4: Music seems impossible to move down to the bi folder unless it is unpacked.

EDIT5: Tile pieces may be problematic. I am trying to move down a modded texture file for the volcano_dormant.tga but can see no reference to it in the text files; I suspect it must be a memory texture for the dormant volcano cas file and so may need to copy it to bi and repath that. Nope, no go - no path reset in file by the looks of it. May well have to copy over the entire file and all associated elements.

Now, what about the intro movie (into mymod)?

[Dol Guldur]

OK.

Now working (and appears to be complete).

I have made no attempt to identify what can be removed as of yet, and indeed may not do so as I do not really have the time atm.

I also had to repath custom_locations.txt (for tgas), desc_cultures (here you must copy the cas files over even if only the texture has changed because of the cas memory; still, can give some potential variation to your cities in terms of textures at least), descr_sm_landmarks, and descr_beliefs (repathing the pips).

Has anyone ever got a modded trailer video to work from a mod folder? And if so, how? Thx.

[kburkert]

will this work with Alexander TW?

[Teleklos Archelaou]

Dol Guldur, did you find a way to make the palms you had gotten to work with FATW to work in the mod with the -mod format?

[Dol Guldur]

I've no idea if it will work with A:TW but one must assume it is the same principle; I do not have the game yet as my Eras pack has not yet arrived. Still, games are but a distraction to the serious modder ;)

Teleklos, I'm afraid I did not factor the palms in simply because they failed the first test of actually working once I had copied over the files to a new installation of bi (with the rest of the build). Leaving them in was causing any battle on the strat map or CB to load up a little and then hang and freeze. I was having to use CTR+ALT+DEL to exit. I copied over all the files (inc. the db one and even messed around with rwms generated from the original), but nothing worked and I had to restore a vanilla db file and veg file which seemed to do the trick. I think the sprites are still in so it may give the appearance of palm forests until you get too close and they turn into deciduous trees ;)

I do want them in, but not at the cost of messing up my build at present. I will probably make them an item for a not-too-distant patch. A quick look at the files does not hold out much hope for repathing, so you might want to try copying the entire file set (and related elements such as cas and dds.tga files) into the mod folder.

[Dol Guldur]

Before I dedicate myself to more hours of work next week, has anyone got the tga.dds files running from out of a -mod folder for the climates, e.g. those that would be normally found at:

...\Rome - Total War\Data\terrain\battlefield\test_climate\summer

If so, would you be kind enough to share how it might be done?

[Sir Dinadan]

Has anyone found some files from BI that don't need to be copied? Thanks in advance.

[DaVinci]

Is anywhere a list of mods, that use CA's -mod function?

I know only about Chiv and TFT.

I would like to install other mods, but just only with -mod functionality.

The times, that i used to copying several vanilla directories is gone for me, as i have not longer lust and time to manage this and/or to buy bigger/new hd's due to new mods.

However, i would like to "encourage" all big mod projects to produce actual mod folders, and not overwriting any kind of vanilla TW data. It is so much userfriendly

[swell]

DaVinci,
XGM (Extended Greek Mod) uses also the -mod switch.

[Dol Guldur]

Fourth Age is a BI mod folder.

They are useful and not just for players. However, some elements will be overwritten in your vanilla if the mod is quite "deep" in what it has modded - but these are usually quite small and harmless changes.

[Epistolary Richard]

Napoleonic 2 for example uses a mod folder - but puts the new skies in the main data folder - presumably because they wouldn't appear otherwise.

[Makanyane]

Umm, bump...
As its been a while I was wondering did anyone work out how to get an intro video ('bi_Intro_640x480.wmv' equivalent) to play if placed in -mod folder.

Also any ideas on these bits I can't seem to shift out of RTW, let alone get into -mod;
RTW\data\UI\culture\cities\ .tga's
so far putting them even in BI has corrupted the whole UI with portraits appearing instead of the city logo's etc.

and RTW\Data\terrain\aerial_map\sea\ .tga's (ground types I can find paths for but not these)

Lastly did anyone find any difference between copying BI folder leaving it at the same level and renaming copy for -mod so you get -mod:my_mod or copying BI into itself and naming internal one so you get the -mod:bi/my_mod set up. So far I'm struggling to see difference (except to what you re-path textures etc to).

[Dol Guldur]

I believe RNJ has the structure like that and had some issues - can't remember. I'll ask next time I see kagemusha online.

I cannot get the music (in a packed state) or a game intro movie to work from within the modfolder - but we do not have an intro vid :(

I will get back to you about the other things.

[Dol Guldur]

Many things which mods leave to overwrite vanilla can actually be got into a modfolder, some by repathing. In the case of the CITIES you will need to pack them into mod_0.pak and place that file in your modfolders packs folder. This will probably work for your other folder too. It also works for loading bars btw.

The game will assume what is in the modfolder is the one to be used, taking priority over the vanilla counteprart. This is generally true of all files where filenames cannot be changes and repathing is not possible.

[Makanyane]

Cheers Dol Guldur, many, many thanks.... I wasn't thinking about packs so that one was never going to occur to me!
I just tried and it seems to work fine for both cities and the sea terrain files.

Now just need to find a home for a very nice intro video. Assuming all else fails (which seems likely) think I'll just give instructions for re-instating / switching to the old one as when you copy the BI folder the vanilla one must automatically end up in modfolder, hmm....

[iamphet]

Trying to repeat Stuie's steps for SPQR. All seems working besides loading screens and colours of faction banners. Colours are still vanilla. Any ideas?

[iamphet]

Ok, got it. There is a reference to textures\strat_flag.tga in strat_flag.CAS. So strat_flag.tga.dds is looked up in vanilla folder.