New factions?

[MeinPanzer]

Their material culture, as in use of plaids and conical hats for religious figures, was similar to the Celts. Their use of funerary masks was similar to the Greeks. Their centum language was quite distinct as the Indo-Iranians speak a satem language. So all of that would make them a unique faction in that region. The Tarim Basin (which is on the EB map).

The use of conical hats and plaids was noted by professor Mair, head of East Asian studies at U Penn, as being something similar in dress to what the Celts wore. The funerary masks were seen by his team as also being reminiscent (sp) of Mycenaean (sp) culture. There are material similarities. As far as language all three groups speak a centum, as opposed to satem, languages, which are related albeit distantly.

Firstly, the Tarim mummies that have been found wearing clothing decorated in plaid patterns date to well before the EB timeframe (some 400 years or more earlier), and their identification as Yuezhi or the ancestors of the Yuezhi is highly speculative. Secondly, even if those mummies could be identified with certainty as Yuezhi, their wearing plaid does not in any way connect them to the Celts. Thirdly, what conical caps were worn by Celts? As for the funerary masks, that connects them as much with China as it does with Greece. Tocharian was an Indo-European language, so it was closely related to the Iranian languages spoken by the other steppe nomads and would not be that unique (plus we know very, very little about it during the EB timeframe). Finally, only a portion of the Tarim basin is represented on the EB map, and like with the Indians, the Yuezhi and Wusun would not be able to be properly represented on the map as they were located c. 272 BC.

As far as an emerging faction, they forced the Saka out of the Illi Valley and Lake Issyk Kul circa 175 BC, so they were a regional force with a distinct culture that was more urbanized than that of the Saka.

I don't know about being more urbanized, but yes, they were a distinct culture and a regional force, as were the Mauryan Indians, but like the Indians, it simply isn't feasible for them to be implemented in EBII.

The same professor Mair believes that the Wusun and Yuezhi were a very closely related people, and that their cultures probably became even closer following the Yuezhi migration. It might also explain why Pompeius Trogus associates the Asiani (Asin/Wusun) with the Tocharians (Tukhara) in his writings.

We know so little about the Yuezhi and the Wusun that we can't even say with any certainty who they were ethnically and culturally, let alone how similar or different they became over time.

[Meroveous]

Firstly, the Tarim mummies that have been found wearing clothing decorated in plaid patterns date to well before the EB timeframe (some 400 years or more earlier), and their identification as Yuezhi or the ancestors of the Yuezhi is highly speculative. Secondly, even if those mummies could be identified with certainty as Yuezhi, their wearing plaid does not in any way connect them to the Celts. Thirdly, what conical caps were worn by Celts? As for the funerary masks, that connects them as much with China as it does with Greece. Tocharian was an Indo-European language, so it was closely related to the Iranian languages spoken by the other steppe nomads and would not be that unique (plus we know very, very little about it during the EB timeframe). Finally, only a portion of the Tarim basin is represented on the EB map, and like with the Indians, the Yuezhi and Wusun would not be able to be properly represented on the map as they were located c. 272 BC.



I don't know about being more urbanized, but yes, they were a distinct culture and a regional force, as were the Mauryan Indians, but like the Indians, it simply isn't feasible for them to be implemented in EBII.



We know so little about the Yuezhi and the Wusun that we can't even say with any certainty who they were ethnically and culturally, let alone how similar or different they became over time.

I never said they were Celts. I said their culture is a related one, as are all Indo-European cultures, and the conical hats were found in France, I believe, and are believed to have been used by priests.

As far as language, no they are more closely related to Celtic, Greek, Italic or Germanic as those are centum as opposed to satem languages, the Indo-Iranians speak a satem language and Tocharian is a centum language.

We are actually not as woefully ignorant about them as you make it seem. The Chinese had written about them extensively, and as China has become more open we have learned much more about them as an ethnic group. Their culture is still a bit of a mystery, but the Chinese and Trogus tied them to the trading cities encircling the Taklamakan desert.

True only part of the Tarim is seen on the map. However if the map is expanded, considering the Americas would be gone, the entire Tarim could be included and the Saka removed from Issyk Kul and placed further west by the Illi Valley, which is a bit more accurate.

[Foot]

True only part of the Tarim is seen on the map. However if the map is expanded, considering the Americas would be gone, the entire Tarim could be included and the Saka removed from Issyk Kul and placed further west by the Illi Valley, which is a bit more accurate.

The EBI map has 199 provinces. M2TW maximum allowed provinces is 199. We cannot include anymore, regardless of america being gone or not.

Foot

[MeinPanzer]

I never said they were Celts. I said their culture is a related one, as are all Indo-European cultures, and the conical hats were found in France, I believe, and are believed to have been used by priests.

Plaid clothing, conical hats, and death masks are aspects of material culture that can and do appear independently in different cultures simply because they are basic concepts. These do not make their cultures related, even if those mummies could be identified as Yuezhi.

We are actually not as woefully ignorant about them as you make it seem. The Chinese had written about them extensively, and as China has become more open we have learned much more about them as an ethnic group. Their culture is still a bit of a mystery, but the Chinese and Trogus tied them to the trading cities encircling the Taklamakan desert.

The problems is that many declarations are made about linking archaeological finds to ethnic groups, like the Yuezhi, but this is difficult with sedentary groups in a region like the Tarim basin where different groups mixed, let alone a group like the Yuezhi who moved quite a bit. They are still very mysterious, and what little the Chinese have written about them in the Shiji and the Hanshu is enlightening but often lacking in details.