Improved more realistic cities!!

[Space_Ed]

I dont know anyyythhiinnggg about how this might be done but I think it would be good if the cities and settlements could be given more character...

For example: Rome was founded on 7 hills and had rich areas and very poor areas.

I think it would be good if some cities had run down slums with graphitti on the walls etc, maybe messy streets and that type of thing.

I don't think you guys would be able to do this but to me it seems obvious that the appearence and realism of the cities would be improved if some had historically accurate rivers running through them and streams.

I think it would be possible to design slums as one 'building.' Slums should have unorganised messy streets and so the slums shouldnt be organised neatly into a grid like richer parts of some of the settlements.

Would it be possible to have a forum in Rome etc?

[stupac]

I believe work is being done on customizing the cities to make them fit the period, but I don't think custom cities are possible due to the culture slot limitations. Correct me if I'm wrong.

[Incitatus]

You are probably right that it is not possible to customize all the cities in the game, but would it be possible to make a realistic version of major cities (Rome, Alexandria, Carthage, etc.) in the map editor and implement them in game?

[Foot]

Learn how and help us. Its pointless requesting something, its not like we don't think a lot about this game. Realistic cities is an obvious area where we could improve, we just don't have the manpower or skills to do this.

Foot

[Space_Ed]

So where can I learn to edit housing structures in cities?

[Foot]

First you will need access to a modelling program, such as 3DS Max or Milkshape. You will then need some tutorials on how to use it, the internet is rife with them so a quick google search will help. You will also need a image editing program to skin the buildings, and Adobe Photoshop is the best for that. Once you've created a building you will need to convert it into something the game can use, this thread details that:

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...=166329&page=2

Foot

[Bellum]

Are there any building artists on the team at all? The medieval buildings just don't fit. :P

[Foot]

We've only recently found out that battle map buildings could be modded at all! Buildings are not our top priority. If that means that the first release of EBII comes with medieval buildings in its settlements, I can live with that.

Foot

[Space_Ed]

Woah Medievil buildings in EB2? No way. I might have a go actually. Can someone introduce me to someone who has modded buildings in the past so I can ask them a few basic questions? After that I'll just steam ahead on my own.

[Ibrahim]

Woah Medievil buildings in EB2? No way. I might have a go actually. Can someone introduce me to someone who has modded buildings in the past so I can ask them a few basic questions? After that I'll just steam ahead on my own.

the modeller in Inca total war is doing that (or was..)

[||Lz3||]

I'm yet to see a mod that changes the buildings... >.>

I know a lot of -very IMO- skilled modders and all of them agree that modding buildings is one of the most hard things to do in RTW

[Che Roriniho]

I'm yet to see a mod that changes the buildings... >.>

I know a lot of -very IMO- skilled modders and all of them agree that modding buildings is one of the most hard things to do in RTW

What do they say is hard about it? I would imagine the hard bit being the scripting it afterwards, with setting the rotation, their location, etc. The modelling itself proobably wouldn't be too hard, likeiwse the skinning.

[Puupertti Ruma]

What do they say is hard about it? I would imagine the hard bit being the scripting it afterwards, with setting the rotation, their location, etc. The modelling itself proobably wouldn't be too hard, likeiwse the skinning.

I think you hit the nail with that. Modelling work is easy, the hellish nightmare called settlement plans are the main destroyer of minds here. I quess, never tried it myself as I know I couldn't do it.

Also there is the small thing that it was just recently discovered that modelling battlemap buildings is even possible! Before the breakthrough it was deemed totally impossible. And as far as I know the modding wizards are still deciphering the code and trying to make model adding easy enough to be a viable option for mod groups to do in less than, say, a decade.

[Bellum]

Seems like just enough time to mod all the buildings before EBII is released. :P

[cmacq]

Can major settlements be designed to look similar in plan, to their historic counterparts? If so, I may be able to provide the basic architectural and street plans (of course simplified and reduced in overall scale) for a number of select settlements.


CmacQ

[Mediolanicus]

I'm yet to see a mod that changes the buildings... >.>

In Chivalry TW all European culture cities are changed into castles, that look nothing like the original RTW cities.

Just to name 1 mod...

[satalexton]

it'll be nice if somebody cracks the bulding files.....tho it's gonna be a LOT of work just doing eaching building for each culture....

[abou]

Can major settlements be designed to look similar in plan, to their historic counterparts? If so, I may be able to provide the basic architectural and street plans (of course simplified and reduced in overall scale) for a number of select settlements.


CmacQ

In RTW it was possible to provide different plans for individual cities; however, only a few ever took advantage of it (waiting to hear people cry about why Rome wouldn't have been made a unique city even though we have a better idea about the development of Antiocheia).

I suppose it could be possible in M2TW, but with the change in system I'm not sure.

[Foot]

iirc, unique city plans means that regardless of the upgrade level it will always look the same, so what stage in development between 272BC and 14AD would you like our cities to represent. That problem plus the heavy workload associated with the task makes such things a minor consideration at best.

Foot

[cmacq]

iirc, unique city plans means that regardless of the upgrade level it will always look the same, so what stage in development between 272BC and 14AD would you like our cities to represent. That problem plus the heavy workload associated with the task makes such things a minor consideration at best.

Foot

Is the reason that upgrades wont take, because each of the architectural components that compose a given city, for a given faction must be changed? For example; a wall tower, a gatehouse, a wall segment. If so, then any modification must be standardized within a given faction, and each city, or faction capital must be composed of these components?

In RTW it was possible to provide different plans for individual cities; however, only a few ever took advantage of it (waiting to hear people cry about why Rome wouldn't have been made a unique city even though we have a better idea about the development of Antiocheia).

I suppose it could be possible in M2TW, but with the change in system I'm not sure.

I agree about those that cry, I'm just wondering if its doable. If the answers to my above questions are yes, then there must be a set number of architectural components for each faction? Plus, within the plan of a given faction's capital there must be space for the common buildings. If so, then the plan would include the walls, towers, and gates; followed by the domestic architecture, then space for the common buildings and central plaza/forum. Does the size of a city change when it upgrades?




CmacQ

[Tellos Athenaios]

AFAIK, in RTW the reason is that the dynamic but simple city plans (or actually, the various levels of city plans) are traded for the complex (at least if we aim for complex) but static 'bookmarks'.

Compare it to a historical battle: the battle and terrain are not 'determined on the fly', instead these have been designed beforehand by someone; it's the same with 'bookmarks' which are basically prepared battlefields that remains the same throughout the game.

[Aemilius Paulus]

Is there any way to use RTW cities in M2TW? Is there any way to sort of "transplant" city layouts and/or building models? I know that at least the city layouts can, if I am not mistaken. They are simply text files that can be modified to fit M2TW, can they not?

[satalexton]

that might work....seeing that the m2tw engine is actually a modified BI engine....=/

[cmacq]

If anyone is interested and willing to try to reproduce architectural models for EB2, I've modeled the basic wall plans of several Punic cities, based on archaeological maps and Google Earth photos. Form these final occupation models, I guess I could extrapolate several developmental stages for each, say 4 or 5. I could also modify and rescale these to fit EB. To some degree, I may be able to do this for any ancient city if I have its location and some idea of how it was laid out. If the modification of M2TW city plans is doable, these might be used as a 3D template to develop cities for EB2, so contact me and I'll send.







CmacQ

[/Bean\]

Does anyone else think that the cities should be on a corner or side of the battle map, so that they are the same size as they are now, but with two walls, then it wouldnt look like the largest cities in the world are about 2 square miles.

It would also be better for the battle in my opinion as it would be fought outside the city and then follow into the walls, making the battle much more varied and possible to change the outcome. I dont know anything about the code and whatnot, but would it not be possible to script the buildings and walls positions to a corner of the battlemap, to make it look like it was just part of the city rather than the whole thing being tiny?

If this is at all possible, would it be done?

[satalexton]

i think thats hardcoded....cuz u start wherever ur troops stood on teh campaign map...

[/Bean\]

I dont understand why hard coding exists...all it seems to do is stop better games like this making it even better. Unless its a copyright issue...

[bovi]

There are many reasons for hardcoding all kinds of things. I would not be able to explain it to you, but if you learn programming you would see it.

[cmacq]

For example this is a base wall model of a Late Punic Carthage looking high and east. The overall plan is modified somewhat, in design and scale, for EB. The scale is about 1:10.

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo...03965274UNXPaQ




CmacQ

[Ibrahim]

that settlement will be a nightmare to attack(attacking in game). bring it on!