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Thread: Books to read before Empires is released

  1. #1
    Member Member batemonkey's Avatar
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    Question Books to read before Empires is released

    I love a good history book (I'm sure I'm in good company round here!)

    So i thought we could compile a list of good books about the general history and tactics deployed in the time period to be covered by Empire.

    I'll start off:

    Command of the Ocean - N.A.M. Rodgers

    As you would expect by the title this is a book (part of a trilogy) about the Royal Navy, this particular volume is esp concerned with the time period covered and is bloody ace.

    I read it when it came out a couple of years ago, but will defo read again before Empires is released.


    Cheers


    Alex
    Last edited by batemonkey; 08-14-2008 at 17:25.
    ...whoever commands the ocean, commands the trade of the world, and whoever commands the trades of the world, commands the riches of the world, and whoever is master of that, commands the world itself..


    "... it is a good thing to kill an admiral from time to time to encourage the others." Voltaire, Candide.

    http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198006556106

  2. #2

    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Empires of the Sea: the Siege of Malta, the Battle of Lepanto and the contest for the center of the world


    I read the whole book. About as exciting as action movie script, with plenty of historical details, written like some intense AAR.
    This is a little before ETW's time era, from the early 1500s to the late 1500s. The book is made in three parts, a bit like a trilogy.
    1 - Siege of Rhodes
    2 - Siege of Malta + pirate wars
    3 - Siege of Cyprus + Battle of Lepanto

    Those who played RTW would know exactly where Rhodes is (with one of the Seven Wonders of the world). Malta is a little island south of Syracuse; the distance between Malta and Syracuse is about the same as from Lilybaeum to Carthage, and closer than from Crete to Sparta. In other words, very close. Cyprus, well, every RTW fan knows where that is. And Lepanto is a bay on the Greek coast, roughly around Thermon.

    Siege of Rhodes, Siege of Malta and Siege of Cyprus are all land battles, and each one is like Alamo, multiplied a thousands times. It's siege warfare with arquebus and cannons, trench battles and a lot of sword and hand-to-hand battles. Different ways of resisting a massive Ottoman amphibious invasion. Some won and some lost. For spoilers I won't say which one (though you can simply find out by Wikipedia, but it's better to not know and read the book).

    Battle with the pirates and battle of Lepanto were naval wars, and very exciting to read. Also, the book talks about the origin and rise of the Barbary Pirates, also the origin of the vestigial fear&awe associated with pirates. They were, in the mediterranean at least, Islamic jihadis and raided coast destroying towns and carrying captives to be sold as slaves in North Africa. Barbarossa (red-beard) was a actual person, a Turk by the name of Orcun with red hair. Orcun however was enslaved by the Knights of St-John, so the sides are not all black and white, unfortunately. The states of Europe were very weak at that time, and the Ottoman Empire (named after Osman, or Uthman, the 3rd original Caliph of the Muslims) was expanding till the gate of Vienna. It had roughly the land area of East Roman Empire at the start of BI, plus North Africa because of Barbary pirates. In the Mediterranean, the Ottomans were expanding till the coast of Italy.

    It's a very well written and researched book of epic battles, both land and sea.


    Excerpt that I don't remember word for word, so I paraphrase:

    during the battle of Cyprus:
    Venetian (from city-state of Venice) commander decides to lay an ambush for the Ottoman Turks after several days of siege. In the meantime, a Venetian fleet came rampaging through the Ottoman fleet off shore, but the Venetians didn't have enough ships to end the blockade of Cyprus. After some combat, the Venetian fleet left during the night.
    Before daybreak the Venetian commander (in a besieged city on Cyprus) ordered that all the flags be taken down and no one is to stir and no smoke or any sign of life be revealed. After sunrise, the Turks saw that no one was on the city ramparts, no flags were flying and there was no sound whatsoever. They then assumed that all the Venetians were evacuated by sea during the night with the departing Venetian fleet. There was a massive rush towards the city walls.
    When the Turks were in firing distance, the entire Venetian garrison stood from behind the ramparts where they were hiding, and sent volleys into the massed ranks of totally surprised Turks....And that way they beat back another attack on the besieged city.

    during the battle of Malta (or, should I say, Thermopylae):
    It was terrible trench warfare and tunneling (RTW vocabulary: sap point) by the Ottomans to take over the fort of St. Elmo (lol, several hundred years ago, they probably didn't expect a stuffed animal to be named after the same name). The Turks had many hundreds of sharpshooters aiming their arquebus all day ready to shoot anything poking over the ramparts. Anyone firing muskets or throwing hand-grenades (they actually made those) or trying to halt the construction of siege equipment had high probability of getting shot. The casualties were mounting and each dead Turk had another ten stepping up to take the place, but each dead defender of St. Elmo fort had no replacement. They used fire rings (I forgot the name in the book), rings that were used around wine barrels, were dipped in tar, dried, painted over with flammable substance, dipped in tar again, dried, painted over again, dipped in tar again, and so on. The result were rings thick as tires. [some pages in between I don't remember] The Ottomans mounted another assault with the elite janissaries troops leading, the defense was breached and innumerable Turks poured over the outer wall, the combat went by the sword and hand to hand. Fire rings were lit, and thrown among the assault waves. It lit the Turkish soldiers on fire, then screaming and running they lit others on fire. The fiery rings went rolling and bouncing among the Ottomans....and they somehow drove back the Ottomans. Some hundreds of janissary troops lay dead in the ditch, along with a substantial portion of the defenders.

    during the battle of Lepanto (of 1571), the largest naval battle in the world at that time, and the largest casualty rate until WWI:
    The Italians, Spanish and Venetians had musket soldiers on their ships. The Ottomans had soldiers with musket as well as many archers. The archer can fire 30 arrows during the reload time of a firearm. In battle [some ship from Europe] was struck by some many arrows that they seemed to grow out of the mast. [pages in between] Then moorings were thrown and soldiers from both sides swung aboard the other ships with swords and scimitars. The admiral (or some general, I think Don Juan)'s pet monkey was seen, during the rain of arrows, pulling them out one by one from the mast with its teeth.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Birth of the Modern World, 1780-1914
    Ja-mata TosaInu

  4. #4

    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Rifles by Mark Urban. Written mainly using the letters and diarys of 6 members of the regiment of Rifles, in a style very similar to Band Of Brothers, it follows them from formation in England, to fighting in the Peninsular War, to Waterloo. Because so much of the book quotes directly the words of the men themselves, it has a realism that is unforced. And if you ever read Sharpe and thought it was far-fetched, think again. Those boys were proper soldiers.

    Also 1812, about Nappys invasion of Russia (and the retreat). Again, quotes a lot of primary sources, and the story of the retreat is very harrowing - human tragedy on an epic scale which only reinforces by lack of admiration for Napoleon.
    "I request permanent reassignment to the Gallic frontier. Nay, I demand reassignment. Perhaps it is improper to say so, but I refuse to fight against the Greeks or Macedonians any more. Give my command to another, for I cannot, I will not, lead an army into battle against a civilized nation so long as the Gauls survive. I am not the young man I once was, but I swear before Jupiter Optimus Maximus that I shall see a world without Gauls before I take my final breath."

    Senator Augustus Verginius

  5. #5

    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    The military experience in the Age of Reason by Christopher Duffy. Excellent small book. Also, for readers more interested in Seven Years War all other Duffy´s works, especially his new By force of arms.

  6. #6
    Member Member batemonkey's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Some great suggestions so far, i've got my holiday leave coming up so i think a trip to the bookshop is in order.

    Rifles sounds good, esp if i team it up with the Sharpe boxed set i've just bought ;)
    ...whoever commands the ocean, commands the trade of the world, and whoever commands the trades of the world, commands the riches of the world, and whoever is master of that, commands the world itself..


    "... it is a good thing to kill an admiral from time to time to encourage the others." Voltaire, Candide.

    http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198006556106

  7. #7
    lurker Member JR-'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Dreadnaught: Britain, Germany, and the coming of the Great War
    Robert K. Massie

  8. #8

    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePianist View Post
    Empires of the Sea: the Siege of Malta, the Battle of Lepanto and the contest for the center of the world
    [IMG]http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51vuXEhyr%2BL._SS500_.jpg[IMG]

    I read the whole book. About as exciting as action movie script, with plenty of historical details, written like some intense AAR.
    This is a little before ETW's time era, from the early 1500s to the late 1500s. The book is made in three parts, a bit like a trilogy.
    1 - Siege of Rhodes
    2 - Siege of Malta + pirate wars
    3 - Siege of Cyprus + Battle of Lepanto

    snip.
    All fascinating stuff, that I'd recommend anyone read up on. But thats actually stuff that can be recreated in Medieval 2, which lasts well into the late 1500s.

    Another good book I read on the seige of Malta was "The Great Seige: Malta 1565".
    Last edited by DisruptorX; 08-23-2008 at 02:51.
    "Sit now there, and look out upon the lands where evil and despair shall come to those whom thou lovest. Thou hast dared to mock me, and to question the power of Melkor, master of the fates of Arda. Therefore with my eyes thou shalt see, and with my ears thou shalt hear; and never shall thou move from this place until all is fulfilled unto its bitter end". -Tolkien

  9. #9

    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    I would add "Master and Commander" although it takes place after the time of the game, it is informative about naval warfare.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master_and_Commander

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    Time Lord Member The_Doctor's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Sharpe.

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    Member Member Sol Invictus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    I agree, Wellington's Rifles by Urban is a really good book. The Military Experience in the Age of Reason by Duffy is also excellent. From Flintlock to Rifle by Steven Ross is a small book that I never tire of re-reading. I also really like The Age of Battles by Russel Weighley and With Musket, Cannon, and Sword by Brent Nosworthy.
    "The fruit of too much liberty is slavery", Cicero

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    Member Member Ishmael's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    "Turn around and run like hell"

    its a book of unortodox miltary tactics, and two or three apply to or are set in the time period of empire.

  13. #13
    Hope guides me Senior Member Hosakawa Tito's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Here's an interesting history on the privateer war on British shipping during the American Revolution. I enjoyed it and would recommend this book by Robert Patton.

    "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." *Jim Elliot*

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    Camel Lord Senior Member Capture The Flag Champion Martok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Thanks for the reference, Hosa. I take it I'd be able to find this under non-fiction/historical, then?
    "MTW is not a game, it's a way of life." -- drone

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    Hope guides me Senior Member Hosakawa Tito's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Quote Originally Posted by Martok View Post
    Thanks for the reference, Hosa. I take it I'd be able to find this under non-fiction/historical, then?
    Yes you should Martok. Here's a link to Barnes & Noble: Patriot Pirates
    "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." *Jim Elliot*

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    Camel Lord Senior Member Capture The Flag Champion Martok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released



    Will see if I can find myself a copy, methinks....
    "MTW is not a game, it's a way of life." -- drone

  17. #17
    Freedom Fighters Clan LadyAnn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    For one of the most famous battles of the Era:

    The Battle, by Alessandro Barbero

    The book is not an easy read, but it shows the circumstance of the battle. English Empire fans take note: the author wasn't too kind on the notion of "English supremacy" in the battle, nor on Sir Wellington. While Napoleon did make several mistakes that day, the book also shows why he made some of these mistakes. The book only focus on the days of the battle, not the entire Napoleonic Wars.

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  18. #18
    kwait nait Member Monsieur Alphonse's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    C. S. Forrester Hornblower the entire series. Nice fiction but an excellent account about naval warfare and sea men's life during the Napoleonic era.
    Tosa Inu

  19. #19

    Post Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    The book I'm reading right now might in fact be relevant here. It's called Religion, Commerce and Liberty: 1683-1793 by J. W. Jeudwine. Just started it myself. Of course its out of print and might be hard to find but I'm using it as a primer for ETW too since my knowledge of the 18th century post-Spanish Succession War is sketchy at best. I could also recommend A History of Europe 1715-1814: by W. F. Reddaway. That's also out of print but it is quite relevant to ETW's time frame.

    I might also mention one other book, but it could be even more difficult to come by. This one is called Rise and Fall of the Mughal Empire by R. P. Tripathi. I haven't had a chance to read it yet and my copy was printed in India (first such book I've come across). It covers a period proximate to 1500-1800. Since ETW deals with India and the Mughals in one sense or another this might be worth looking into.
    Last edited by Julius_Nepos; 09-25-2008 at 07:06. Reason: More content.
    "Religion is a thing which the king cannot command, because no man can be compelled to believe against his will..."

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    Member Member ljperreira's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Doctor View Post
    Sharpe.
    I agree, Cornwall's "Sharpe" series is great. Im actually reading them through again (Im on "Sharpe's Battle"). Ive read them all once before, but since theres 20 books Ive forgotten enough details to make the second time through just as interesting as the first (its been a while since reading them the first time).
    Marines never die, they just go to hell and re-group.

  21. #21

    Cool Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Clausewitz's on War, "Horatio Hornblower", "Rifleman Dodd", Moltke "On the Art of War"

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    Hope guides me Senior Member Hosakawa Tito's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Six Frigates :The Epic History of the Founding of the U.S. Navy
    Ian W. Toll

    A good read, and not just the founding of the US Navy. There's lots of information on the global political climate as well.
    "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." *Jim Elliot*

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    Member Member Oleander Ardens's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released


    On War, Clausewitz

    Yeah, Clausewitz is always a fine and entertaining read. "On War" is an evergreen and ever lasting work about war, with the added premium that Clausewitz had hand-on experience with Napoleonic warfare. Without any shade of doubt the most influential treaty on warfare and its implications ever written.
    Last edited by Oleander Ardens; 10-27-2008 at 21:07.
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  24. #24
    Provost Senior Member Nelson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    The Campaigns of Napoleon by David Chandler.

    If you read just one book about Napoleonic warfare this ought to be it. Chandler covers strategy and tactics in detail.
    Time flies like the wind. Fruit flies like bananas.

  25. #25
    Member Member Ituralde's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    I'm currently reading: "Iron Kingdom, the Rise and Fall of Prussia, 1600-1947" by Christopher Clark.
    A lot of it is outside the timeframe, but man do I want to play Prussia now!
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  26. #26
    Hope guides me Senior Member Hosakawa Tito's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Just started Champlain's Dream by David Hackett Fischer.
    "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." *Jim Elliot*

  27. #27
    Senior Member Senior Member Fisherking's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    If you like a good narrative history and want background on North America then try The Winning of America Series by Allan W. Eckert.

    It is mostly pre-American Revelation and very readable.


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    Member Member Eusebius86's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    These lists have been rather helpful. I just created an amazon wishlist for Christmas with many of these books in it.

    What do people consider to be the BEST book on 18th century naval tactics? I want to learn them like the back of my hand so that I can try to implement them in ETW...

  29. #29
    Member Member Alexander the Pretty Good's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Almost done re-reading another David Hackett Fischer book, Washington's Crossing. Not only does it describe in detail the battles of Trenton and Princeton, but much of the New York campaign leading up to it, as well as the guerilla war in New Jersey following the crossing. A very good read, I wonder if ETW will deal with guerilla warfare at all...

  30. #30
    Hope guides me Senior Member Hosakawa Tito's Avatar
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    Default Re: Books to read before Empires is released

    Quote Originally Posted by Hosakawa Tito View Post
    Just started Champlain's Dream by David Hackett Fischer.
    I'm a little over 100+ pages in and am thoroughly fascinated with this book. There is a wealth of information on the European colonization of the New World, concentrating on but not limited to New France and the part that Samuel Champlain played in this. There are many maps & diagrams of the period penned by Champlain & others included in this work. History buffs rejoice. I definitely recommend this book; especially for those that are interested in ETW and the period in history this covers. Looking for a good Christmas gift for yourself? Ask for this book.
    "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." *Jim Elliot*

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