Another School shooting in Finland

[Martok]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Well, Finns are finno-ugrians (just like Hungarians, Karelians, Estonians etc.) while Swedes, Danes and Norwegians are germanics (just like Germans). Scandinavia is a geographic entity consisting of the peninsula formed by Sweden and Norway, and really has nothing to do with ethnicity.

Exactly. Which again, is why don't really understand why Finland has always been lumped in with the rest of the Scandinavian nations. For convenience's sake, probably, but that's only a guess on my part.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Are you sure they didn't call it a Nordic country? Finland is a Nordic country (1 of 5) but not part of Scandinavia (3 nations).

Yep, I'm sure. My geography textbooks actually labeled Finland as a Scandinavian country, even though it's not part of the peninsula proper.

I also heard that the police officer that had questioned this madman the day before he killed 10 people and let him go and let him keep his weapons are under psycriatic help. Too much for the poor guy.

Gah. Yeah, I can't imagine how he feels right now. Talk about guilt....

[Husar]

Only to have the same thing happening in the less protective realm that is profesional life, you will always have bullies and victims c'est la vie. Take it for what it is, it's just a copycat. Dead one now. bye.

And you will always have people who are against bullies and don't accept your conservative stance on this, c'est la vie. Deal with it.

[Adrian II]

The names of these killers should never be spoken, no images should ever be shown or analysis into their lives proclaimed, no writings of theirs should be released to the public, no grave should be allowed them. Their lives should be blanked out so that they have less lasting impact on the world than a minimum wage janitor.

Which is totally at odds with your views about individual freedom. Time for a rethink.

I agree with the view that if youngsters perpetrate such horrible crimes it is usually because society has either failed them, failed to stop them, of failed those who would have been able to stop them. But there is no way to build watertight guarantees into society without destryig its very fundament of liberty and individual responsibility.

Crime is here to stay. It will always be a problem. All we can do is try to contain it in such a way that neither crime nor law enforcement stifle the healthy functioning of society.

[Koga No Goshi]

You have to remember that we, as Americans, live in a society where half the people who have some position of power or authority don't even really believe in mental illness. A few years ago I saw a Congressperson refer to panic disorder as being "a nervous son of a (female dog)." With those kinds of attitudes around it honestly is not difficult for social networks and society to fail to intervene in the case of troubled kids.

[Fragony]

Great. This piece of ^%*%^* called a friend before ending his miserable life, 'I have just killed 10 people, going to kill myselve now'. According to eye-witnesses he started shooting blindly, and finnished of the wounded with a shot in the head. He said he 'enjoyed seeing people bleed'. How narcistic can you be, disgusting. So angry.

[Husar]

Sounds like me.
I mean when I was still young and stupid and someone annoyed me greatly I wanted to see them bleed or I wasn't satisfied, maybe someone annoyed him greatly and he never grew up like I did?
(I'm nice like a little kitten now, no really. )

[Koga No Goshi]

Great. This piece of ^%*%^* called a friend before ending his miserable life, 'I have just killed 10 people, going to kill myselve now'. According to eye-witnesses he started shooting blindly, and finnished of the wounded with a shot in the head. He said he 'enjoyed seeing people bleed'. How narcistic can you be, disgusting. So angry.

*Shrug* You can despise them for being so mentally imbalanced, but I think that no one gets that far without a lot of people turning a blind eye, not caring, and not stepping in. I felt the same anger you seem to feel about school shootings until I read the Time (or was it People? I think it was Time) front feature about the Columbine shooters. Both kids, but the "leader" kid, Eric, in particular, had a very long history of troubled behavior that his very authoritarian military father pretty much ignored, covered up for, and refused to consider therapy for.

[Guildenstern]

I think that no one gets that far without a lot of people turning a blind eye, not caring, and not stepping in.

I think that the warning signs may be very vague and it's hard to find a potential time bomb such as this one.

[Koga No Goshi]

I think that the warning signs may be very vague and it's hard to find a potential time bomb such as this one.

I don't think that's true in the big majority of cases. Look at the Virginia tech kid. On meds, even his roommate said he NEVER TALKED, was on antidepressants and antipsychotics yet walked straight into a gun store and, perfectly legally, walked out with firearms with no sort of check. No one can say the system didn't drop the ball in cases like that.

[Guildenstern]

If you're saying you need new restrictions on guns, then I agree with you.

[KrooK]

We have ideal results of "non stress education". Children is educated without any stress so it can't ... overcome stress into its adult life. Then instead of react normally it explodes.

[ELITEofWARMANGINGERYBREADMEN88]

I can see one connection... if you dont have a gun, you cant shoot anyone...

Doesn't matter.... He can still kill with a Knife. Yeah, you can disarm him, but he can still kill.

http://gaming.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=13807

He killed people WITH A KNIFE.... I didn't see normal people disarm him (unless I am wrong)....




(article is about if games cause it, but still explains what happened).

[Husar]

We have ideal results of "non stress education". Children is educated without any stress so it can't ... overcome stress into its adult life. Then instead of react normally it explodes.

So the answer is to make life more stressful for everybody and learn children to get used to stress.
Sounds good, more heart attacks at 14!

[KrooK]

No - stress on low level teach people how to overcome it, how to work under pression and how to cope with problems. I think I should explain.

I had a teacher at university. Almost all the teachers did not expect anything before the exam.
You could be unprepared, you could know nothing and everything was all right if you pass exam.
He was completely different. All the lessons started from small exams - everyone was asked about something from previous lessons. If you did not know, you had to correct exam into harder conditions.
People were afraid of him, we had 2 really hard months but then... we started preparing ourselves on every lesson, we started learning. And then .... everything became easier. Before the exam we knew much more than rest of students of our year and what is more important, we knew how to connect parts of our knowledge.
At the exam worst mark into my groups was "4 + ", when best possible is 5 +. With smiles on our faces we saw others thrilling before exam. We simply could not understand why they don't know so easy things. Exam on that year was easier into my life. Just like signature after long essay.

This is good stress.

[Kadagar_AV]

Doesn't matter.... He can still kill with a Knife. Yeah, you can disarm him, but he can still kill.

http://gaming.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=13807

He killed people WITH A KNIFE.... I didn't see normal people disarm him (unless I am wrong)....




(article is about if games cause it, but still explains what happened).

You argue that it is as easy to kill people with a knife as with a gun? Or what?

[Husar]

Thanks for the explanation Krook, I wouldn't call it stress anymore once you cope with it but you're right, that kind of thing sounds sensible, would probably work for me as well.

[ELITEofWARMANGINGERYBREADMEN88]

You argue that it is as easy to kill people with a knife as with a gun? Or what?

I argue it is easy to kill anyone with both a knife AND a gun, just a bit more easy with a gun then a knife, that's is what. And besides, if someone sneaks up on you with a knife and he is good... well who wins?

[Viking]

I argue it is easy to kill anyone with both a knife AND a gun, just a bit more easy with a gun then a knife, that's is what. And besides, if someone sneaks up on you with a knife and he is good... well who wins?

Compare the two scenarios:

1. a student with a gun enters a room and starts firing

2. a student with a knife enters a room and stabs a fellow student, and then tries to make his way to his next victim.

now give it a thought. A bit more easy you say?

[Koga No Goshi]

No - stress on low level teach people how to overcome it, how to work under pression and how to cope with problems. I think I should explain.

I had a teacher at university. Almost all the teachers did not expect anything before the exam.
You could be unprepared, you could know nothing and everything was all right if you pass exam.
He was completely different. All the lessons started from small exams - everyone was asked about something from previous lessons. If you did not know, you had to correct exam into harder conditions.
People were afraid of him, we had 2 really hard months but then... we started preparing ourselves on every lesson, we started learning. And then .... everything became easier. Before the exam we knew much more than rest of students of our year and what is more important, we knew how to connect parts of our knowledge.
At the exam worst mark into my groups was "4 + ", when best possible is 5 +. With smiles on our faces we saw others thrilling before exam. We simply could not understand why they don't know so easy things. Exam on that year was easier into my life. Just like signature after long essay.

This is good stress.

I'm not trying to be difficult or anything-- I think I see the point you are trying to make. But, in effect, the practical translation of this is "Mental illness isn't a real issue, what's really going on here is just some kids are weak and can't hack it." Which is one opinion, but I am not sure how adopting this as the explanation to the school shooting phenomenon, which is increasingly becoming worldwide, helps us find solutions to it. I think it falls under the category of reaction of "just chiding the shooters after the fact."

[Kadagar_AV]

I argue it is easy to kill anyone with both a knife AND a gun, just a bit more easy with a gun then a knife, that's is what. And besides, if someone sneaks up on you with a knife and he is good... well who wins?

That is absurd.

As Koga no Goshi stated, imagine if someone enters a classroom and stabs someone... Then he goes on to the next... How long would it take for 2-3 guys to jump him and wrestle him down? You can only do so much with a knife... Also, the initial victims would most likely survive. You have to be really good with a knife (or lucky) to kill someone fast.

Like the way you see in the movies, that is BS...

Now, I have trained Silat... There we practise anti-knife drills hard.

If a knife expert would sneak up on me I wouldnt have a chance.

If a 22 year old punk would enter my classroom with a knife he'd very soon be sprawling on the floor with a broken arm. If I was in a bad mood, he'd have a punctured lung too:)

Imagine the same 22 year old punk with a gun, now, all my training wouldnt help me (well, tbh, actually i would have a reasonable chance fighting a guy with a .22 in above scenario, if he didnt shoot me first).

But that is beside the point.

[Ferret]

Truly sad, looked a nice college as well