When choosing between evil and evil, you can always choose good(franco debate)

[InsaneApache]

So to be clear, it's a choice between an authoritarian one party state and a totalitarian one party state. Not much to shout about.

I say damn both their eyes. Socialism and fascism, two cheeks of the same arse.

[Rhyfelwyr]

I always thought that the Republicans were in fact fairly moderate and democratic, but were often misunderstood internationally as the far-left faction, and that was why many workers from the Clydeside and other areas of Scotland went to fight for them.

[LittleGrizzly]

I always thought that the Republicans were in fact fairly moderate and democratic, but were often misunderstood internationally as the far-left faction,

This is what i assumed, the left wingers simply got aid of russia and other kinds of material support in the same way america sometimes support rights wing goverments, i mean if you can get free help because you happen to share an ideaology why not ? it makes them no more lackey's than bolivia to venezula as one example, i think the facists just couldn't stomach the will of the people so tried to subvert the oppositions message

and that was why many workers from the Clydeside and other areas of Scotland went to fight for them.

I think some welsh did as well... from a manic street preachers song "So if I can shoot rabbits, Then I can shoot fascists" and very well said too!

[lars573]

I always thought that the Republicans were in fact fairly moderate and democratic, but were often misunderstood internationally as the far-left faction, and that was why many workers from the Clydeside and other areas of Scotland went to fight for them.

Wasn't quite that clean. The socialists were pro-democracy more or less. Problem is that they were in a coalition with the Spainish communists (the darkside of a PR system). Which really worked against them. The pro-church and pro-monarchy conservative factions really didn't trust the communists. And in the 1935 parlimentary elections there were "voting irregularities." The conservatives blamed them on the government. But really the blame could be put to the really fringe elements of both ruling parties. Which lead to the socialist/communist government becoming more authoritarian. Which led the army in Morroco to revolt. Which led to the civil war.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

I would say that the Republicans were pretty left-wing, not moderate.

[Fragony]

Which led the army in Morroco to revolt. Which led to the civil war.

Well there is lot more going on there if you want to be very specific, but in general that sums it up.

[Guildenstern]

The leftist Popular Front won the election democratically, but several acts of violence were committed against the Church by left-wing supporters following the election. This increased the level of instability. That said, Franco revolted against the elected government, so his actions were totally anti-democratic and authoritarian.

[Louis VI the Fat]

So to be clear, it's a choice between an authoritarian one party state and a totalitarian one party state. Not much to shout about.

I say damn both their eyes. Socialism and fascism, two cheeks of the same arse.

Aye, one would say this would be the inevitable conclusion for those who look back on Europe's 20th century.

When choosing between evil and evil, you can always choose good. Spain didn't have to choose between fascism and communism. It's just that followers of either thought - and persist in thinking - this was the only choice, while laying the blame entirely at the other faction.

[InsaneApache]

Aye, one would say this would be the inevitable conclusion for those who look back on Europe's 20th century.

When choosing between evil and evil, you can always choose good. Spain didn't have to choose between fascism and communism. It's just that followers of either thought - and persist in thinking - this was the only choice, while laying the blame entirely at the other faction.

A bit like two cheeks slapping together to stifle debate?

[Husar]

I guess the problem is that noone dared open a third party, similar to the american two party system where noone dares voting for a third party because "they won't win anyway", so everyone goes with one of the available bad choices.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

I guess the problem is that noone dared open a third party, similar to the american two party system where noone dares voting for a third party because "they won't win anyway", so everyone goes with one of the available bad choices.

That makes sense. If you're looking at two coalitions who do have a chance of winning, and the moderates losing massively, you're probably going to go for the one who you think will do the least harm.

[PanzerJaeger]

Obviously Fascism was the better choice. Even cut off from Europe after a devastating war, Spain was far more successful that the communist states - who were able to coordinate with each other.

[Alexander the Pretty Good]

Wasn't there infighting between the anarchists and the stalinists amongst the left-wing groups?

I imagine the latter won and perpetuated more of the evil on the left side...

[Louis VI the Fat]

My favourite judge, Baltasar Garzón, is at it again. I loved how he gave Pinochet a miserable last few years. Now he's going after Franco's henchmen.

I hope they will put several to trail. I am not one easy to forgive. Just like I rejoice whenever someone hunts down an 88 year old nazi in Paraguay, so I welcomed Garzón's project of stirring up Spain in the last few years. Forgive and forget? Nope. I say trace 'em down and make 'em pay.

A Spanish judge today ordered the grave of poet and playwright Federico García Lorca be dug up as, for the first time ever, the violent repression unleashed by the dictator General Francisco Franco was formally declared a crime against humanity.