The Morality of Petty Theft

[rory_20_uk]

At the risk of getting another warning: you're an idiot.

If you report them missing they can look for them. It's not accusing anyone, but pointing out the temporal relationship when they disappeared.

But if you'd rather apologise for existing, then why not leave your watch / ipod / laptop around next time they're cleaning? You'd be breaking the cycle of crime and poverty by ensuring that crime pays...



I didn't issue a warning as per TC's request. You could have skipped the shot though.

[Strike For The South]

At the risk of getting another warning: you're an idiot.

If you report them missing they can look for them. It's not accusing anyone, but pointing out the temporal relationship when they disappeared.

But if you'd rather apologise for existing, then why not leave your watch / ipod / laptop around next time they're cleaning? You'd be breaking the cycle of crime and poverty by ensuring that crime pays...

It was a pair of headphones

Crime certainly doesn't pay in this scenario, crime probably won't even play music in another 3 months

Sure he could report them lost but then he has to deal with "Bro they were headphones" from all his coleagues (whom I'm sure would assume TC is either the cheapest man alive or has an ulterior motive at that point)

[TinCow]

At the risk of getting another warning: you're an idiot.

Hopefully no warning is forthcoming, as this pretty much states in simple terms, half of my conflict. My anger about this is because I feel like I'm being taken advantage of due to (ironically) my own advantageous situation... I'm letting myself be a door mat simply because it doesn't really matter to me. And yet I just can't overcome the feeling that it's not worth it for me to pursue this.

If you report them missing they can look for them. It's not accusing anyone, but pointing out the temporal relationship when they disappeared.

It doesn't work like that, because in order to report the events, I have to say that they went missing right after the cleaning lady was in my office. There is no way to report the event without accusing her, even if I don't name her specifically, because she's the only cleaning lady on our floor today. If I omit the reference the the cleaning lady, I might as well just say I lost them in the bathroom or something, it defeats the whole purpose. It's kind of an all or nothing situation. I accuse her or I don't.


I will heed your request this time and not issue a warning.

[Beskar]

Moral of the story, she shouldn't have stole headphones and broken the trust you had in her.

[Hosakawa Tito]

How many people have access to that cubicle? Was there any time lapse between when the cleaning lady finished and left and your return to that cubicle? Could the headphones have been accidently knocked into the waste basket and then thrown out with the trash? Ask around the office and see if other items have gone missing.

[TinCow]

How many people have access to that cubicle? Was there any time lapse between when the cleaning lady finished and left and your return to that cubicle? Could the headphones have been accidently knocked into the waste basket and then thrown out with the trash? Ask around the office and see if other items have gone missing.

No one else was in the room except myself, two other attorneys (who share the office with me), and the cleaning lady. The other attorneys (both friends of mine) definitely did not take them. The headphones were not knocked into the trash, I checked thoroughly. The timespan between me leaving the cubicle with them there and me returning to find them gone was about 5 minutes; I never left the room, I just went over to another cubicle and was chatting with that attorney about movies. There's really only two explanations: she stole them or she misplaced them while cleaning. I scoured the place without finding them, which seems to remove the latter as an option. No other items went missing in the office; the other attorneys checked their spaces thoroughly after I started a major WTF rant. A mini-version of this thread conversation occurred in our room after this event, so they're well aware of it.

[pevergreen]

Next time, leave something else that a person may steal out in the open, if she takes it again, lodge formal complaint.

Your firm shouldn't have to deal with a cleaner that thinks its ok to steal stuff from their employees.

[Hosakawa Tito]

No one else was in the room except myself, two other attorneys (who share the office with me), and the cleaning lady. The other attorneys (both friends of mine) definitely did not take them. The headphones were not knocked into the trash, I checked thoroughly. The timespan between me leaving the cubicle with them there and me returning to find them gone was about 5 minutes; I never left the room, I just went over to another cubicle and was chatting with that attorney about movies. There's really only two explanations: she stole them or she misplaced them while cleaning. I scoured the place without finding them, which seems to remove the latter as an option. No other items went missing in the office; the other attorneys checked their spaces thoroughly after I started a major WTF rant. A mini-version of this thread conversation occurred in our room after this event, so they're well aware of it.

I'd file a complaint then and ask for a different cleaning person.

[HoreTore]

I've been in a similar situation, though in my case it was a recently hired co-worker, and the person wasn't poor or a refugee or anything like that.

I decided to give the person a second chance, while at the same time, I let the person know that I knew. Basically I came to the conclusion that I just didn't care enough.

[Furunculus]

At the risk of getting another warning: you're an idiot.

If you report them missing they can look for them. It's not accusing anyone, but pointing out the temporal relationship when they disappeared.

But if you'd rather apologise for existing, then why not leave your watch / ipod / laptop around next time they're cleaning? You'd be breaking the cycle of crime and poverty by ensuring that crime pays...



I didn't issue a warning as per TC's request. You could have skipped the shot though.

i'm with rory here.

stealing/damaging other peoples property is a rage-inducing act as far as i am concerned.

[al Roumi]

i'm with rory here.

stealing/damaging other peoples property is a rage-inducing act as far as i am concerned.

As one shopkeeper said to the other.

That said, being the victim of theft etc is aggravating, but you'd want to be doubly sure they were stolen by the individual in question, right?

[Furunculus]

sure, but report it, don't ignore it.

[al Roumi]

sure, but report it, don't ignore it.

Report the fact that they are missing, not that they have been stolen. There's a fine line between declaring theft and a spontaneous congregation of pitchfork enthusiasts.

[Andres]

Your colleagues are greedy lawyers; it has to be one of them. And he who did it, knows you were going to blame it on the cleaning lady, so there was no risk whatsoever to steal your headphones. Steal something back from their desks next week

Meh, if you're 100 % sure that the cleaning lady did it, but you would feel bad to report it, because of Christmas and you being a good person, then why don't do something completely unexpected: give her a Christmas present: an i-phone with headphones.

Before you all start thinking I'm a saint: I would first have thoroughly looked everywhere in the office, even at my colleagues' desks. If no headphone, I would have talked to the lady. I would have told her I would report it, to see if she would admit it and give back the headphones. And I would have actually reported it, even if she would have given the headphones back. Regardless of social background: you don't steal. It doesn't matter if the thief is a highly-paid lawyer or the cleaning lady. I have a pretty modest background myself. My grandfather was poor and my father grew up in poverty the first 10 years of his youth. They didn't steal. My grandfather worked hard, every day, and he himself (not his wife and children!) ate dry bread most of the time, so he could save money to buy a house. Even for the smallest lie, my grandfather would get upset and would punish me. He had a house, two pieces of land, a decent amount of savings and no debts whatsoever at his dead. Being poor doesn't mean you have to steal. As far as I'm concerned, the sole fact that a person is poor, doesn't gain my sympathy. The attitude of people who are proud and decent while being poor, that's something that makes me bow my head in deep respect. But that's just me.

But maybe giving her an i-phone for Christmas instead of reporting it will have better results to change her attitude in life. Personally, I believe in the harsh approach, not the soft one.

[Louis VI the Fat]

The proper legal course of action to take is straightforward.


For $8950 I'll advice you about it. Mind that's $8950 an hour. If you pay, you get your $30 headphones back. If you don't pay, we'll then you just got legally robbed of $30 and there's nothing you can do about it.

[Furunculus]

Report the fact that they are missing, not that they have been stolen. There's a fine line between declaring theft and a spontaneous congregation of pitchfork enthusiasts.

ah, i see, report it missing, explaining how there is no reason you can think of for it not to be exactly where you left it; on your desk.

[Rhyfelwyr]

I would just let it go. But if anything happens again just let her know that you know. If I was very well off I would feel very bad risking that person losing their job.

Yes theft is bad but **** happens and people need to get over it, how can you feel bad for long when you walk back into your luxury house. It's just not worth it.

[al Roumi]

ah, i see, report it missing, explaining how there is no reason you can think of for it not to be exactly where you left it; on your desk.

Yes. That way you have stated no-more than you actually know to be fact. The accusation of theft immediately implies wrong-doing which, unless you can prove, you have no right to go spreading.

I would say that a neutral message put around the office saying "have you seen a pair of white headphones, last seen [here] at [this] time, please return to me if you find them -thanks!", would be the way to go. That way if they were stolen, a) the culprit will know they are missed (and should feel a dollop of guilt); b) the cuplrit will be less confident of repeating the feat if they know missing items are reported so widely each time. And importantly, you won't have launched into a morale eroding clamp-down, only for the headphones to turn up.