Played Any Classic Battles Yet?

[AggonyKing]

Tomi we tried classic mode today with some friends and here's how it went:

Attempt 1: 1 player got stuck and couldn't pick an army
Attemp 2: 1 player couldn't pick a faction
Attempt 3: Players dropped soon after joining the game
Attempt 4: We actually made it into the match, everyone dropped 2 mins into it

attempt 5: "**** it! lets go do normal mode"

thats how it went :P

[Tomisama]

attempt 5: "**** it! lets go do normal mode"

thats how it went :P

And I assume that the normal game went fine.

They have made "classic" mode games for 11 years, but now this one doesn’t work?

Trying very hard to be positive about this; maybe they will get around to making it useable in the future

Thanks AK!

[Swoosh So]

Tomisawa i suggest the following:

Normal mode for cwc (NOT classic mode)
No vets allowed!
All retainers and general skills allowed as normal

Imo at the moment thats going to be the best format along with any unit restrictions u may want to add.

We did alot of such games u know when and peeps loved it.

[AggonyReborn]

Normal mode would work if it werent for the general costs. unless everyone was level 10 in the tourny.

[Nigel]

Tomi we tried classic mode today with some friends and here's how it went:

Attempt 1: 1 player got stuck and couldn't pick an army
Attemp 2: 1 player couldn't pick a faction
Attempt 3: Players dropped soon after joining the game
Attempt 4: We actually made it into the match, everyone dropped 2 mins into it

attempt 5: "**** it! lets go do normal mode"

thats how it went :P

Make sure you post a description of these problems (without the **** words) at the official forum.
At the moment they are still in the process of patching the game. In 6 month times I guess they will be hard pressed to release any more patches, so what does not get fixed in the next few months will most likely never get fixed. And what you describe is serious enough to be something they cant ignore, just as long as they have read about it.

After that we will be left with whatever game mode actually works and make the best of it.
And I am not saying that that is a bad thing, just now we still have the chance that they will get the Classical Mode to work as it should.

[Chimpyang]

Friends can't see when I have hosted classic mode battles, I presume a lot of other people can't see them either, since nobody has ever joined a game, no matter how long i leave it. The game will also CTD or lag badly even in the setup screen, but only if I have classic mode selected (self hosting Normal Mode causes no problems as far as I can see myself)

Also, more maps for classic mode please (I mean the ones without key buildings on them), when hosting, if you deselect key buildings, the number of MP maps drops by 1/2, the option to play those maps without key buildings would be very welcome and add longeivity and purity to the game.

So yeah, classic mode is pretty broken. Normal mode without retainers or vets would probably be the fairest thing.

[Dionysus9]

Just for the record, I'm having similar problems in Classic mode.

[UglyJun]

plz stop calling avatar normal mode its not !!! classic is and they screwed it !!! lol

[Kocmoc]

We tried yesterday a classic battle, this is what happened:

1. colors are a problem still, we had 3 times red, its a nightmare! If we ever play on classic, we need to ensure, that we wont see same colors.... in 3v3 it will be impossible
2. Lag. heavy lag, already in the setup-phase, during game is was really bad as well
3. General. there seems to be no difference between the 300 and the 600 general
4. unitchoice, I checked all clans and i couldnt choose loan swords.
5. upgrades, as AMP already pointed out, upgrading missles isnt really an option.


Well, it was just one game, this need more testing, especially the lag (could be possible, that this isnt normal). Also we should invest some time to check out the stats and how its actual working. I myself have no idea whats going on with classic, never spend time into this.

If this is normal, than I dont see us playing classic, this is no fun and we hardly will find enough player, who like this.
The lag, the colors and the unit-system needs patching, else I see no point to play classic.

I will test a few more this weekend and will report here. One game is a not enough, so see this as my first experience, but not my final statement concerning classic.

[Magyar Khan]

We tried yesterday a classic battle, this is what happened:

1. colors are a problem still, we had 3 times red, its a nightmare! If we ever play on classic, we need to ensure, that we wont see same colors.... in 3v3 it will be impossible
2. Lag. heavy lag, already in the setup-phase, during game is was really bad as well
3. General. there seems to be no difference between the 300 and the 600 general
4. unitchoice, I checked all clans and i couldnt choose loan swords.
5. upgrades, as AMP already pointed out, upgrading missles isnt really an option.


Well, it was just one game, this need more testing, especially the lag (could be possible, that this isnt normal). Also we should invest some time to check out the stats and how its actual working. I myself have no idea whats going on with classic, never spend time into this.

If this is normal, than I dont see us playing classic, this is no fun and we hardly will find enough player, who like this.
The lag, the colors and the unit-system needs patching, else I see no point to play classic.

I will test a few more this weekend and will report here. One game is a not enough, so see this as my first experience, but not my final statement concerning classic.

will the banner colours be patched?

[Tomisama]

plz stop calling avatar normal mode its not !!! classic is and they screwed it !!! lol

So true Jun

Classic is currently unstable; so many people are proposing a no-art, no-vets,
Avatar 3v3 contest.

If there is no relief or promise in the next week, we will probably go that way.

The recurring question is the balance of Generals.

[Kocmoc]

I dont think that it will be possible, to balance it for the different styles.
Once vets come in, the balance becomes tricky, if you take vets out, it will change again.

Imo there should be one working way in the first place, after that we can work on other things.
The Avatar-MM is the way most people play and that should be the first thing to balance and work on. If its sorted, than we could go and fix classic.
I see many who like the MM way and I dont see classic becoming mainstream at all.

You can maybe get a tourney going on classic, but you will leave a whole new generation of TW player out.

[jackie_fish]

i have played classic battle but to be honest i think it is dead

[Dionysus9]

Spoon-- Hmmm... I played some last night and had fun but I didn't check valor upgrades to see if they worked. I'm wondering if your crashing and game creation problems might have been associated with a particular player's connection? I'll play a few more tonight and see how they go. As far as I can tell they are only "dead" because people want to rank up their avatar and vets by playing non-classic.

[Swoosh So]

The generals are well balanced tomi, and at the end of the day everyone has the same trees to construct their general from so no problem there. I actually think more and more each day that we should just do tournaments with vets as its getting more and more fun when were hosting clan v clan matches. i was a big fan of doing no vets games u know when but tbh it kinda feels like id be going back to some dusty stifled mode without vets ofc i will if the cwc is set that way which im sure it will be. Id say med or large funds with avatar mode and all retainers usable should be quite fun.

[Tomisama]

I am reposting this here for any who have not had the opportunity to see it.

Why do we need a Classic Battles mode?

The seriousness with which most Total War veteran Clans approach international long term Team competitions can be, and most often is extreme!

The commitment in man hours in practice and playing many Matches, and managing your real life around competition dates, can put a heavy price tag on participation in these events.

The smallest details come under the magnifying glass, and with everyone ramped with anticipation, and can often get blown out of proportion in importance.

And it can only take a single word like “cheater”, or a Match situation that is so close that both sides come back raving about how they were the actual winners, to blow a whole contest.

To minimize the volatile potential that these major Team contests have, both Teams must have access to exactly the same resources in both quantity and at the same time, not just potentially.

And here’s the hard part; everything must be completely up front and fully visible at the start; and completely reviewable after the Match is over, so that any questions as to the correctness of the result can be verified to be legitimate.

Avatar does not have the transparency necessary for contest administration to be able insure fair play for global level multi-partner multiplayer events.

Avatar is great fun and I have nothing against it at all. But there is no competitive sport anywhere in the world that would allow various entry levels of contestants, or a pre-accumulation of game advantages, for a definitive head to head test of skill.

[Dionysus9]

I know exactly where you are coming from Tomi and as a tourney admin (and the best tourney admin out there, mind you) you have to look out for your contestants. We all respect you for your fairness!
I'm sorry, though, I just can't help but be a gadfly, its part of my fundamental nature.

What about boxing? In boxing you have weight classes. Sometimes a guy is at the top of his weight class (almost in the next one) and he's fighting a guy who is at the bottom of the weight class (almost in the lower one). Their height and weight, reach, fitness and training will differ-- which of course makes a difference in the outcome of the sporting event.

Similarly, in the Olympics-- contestants from developed nations have a substantial advantage in training and equipment that athletes from developing nations don't have because they can't afford superior equipment and training. Again those advantages accumulate and make a difference in the result.

I understand it is your goal to minimize those sorts of differences and advantages - but try as we might, they will always be present. Someone who can play Shogun 2 full time 60 hours a week is going to have a massive advantage against me if I'm only playing 10 hours a week.

All of that said, I tend to agree that Avatar does not have the level of transparency neccessary. You can't tell in a replay what retainers the avatars both had. That alone is probably a deal-breaker.

Keep striving for the ideal, Tomi, it makes your tournies a success.

[Graphic]

Since avatar conquest is a futile endeavor right now, I guess I'm down for some classic battles.

Just add me on steam and we'll play sometime.

[Swoosh So]

Cant believe cwc is gonna be ruined with classiic mode i was so looking forward to it :( i dont see any sense in using this crap mode, just go with no vets im telling u its way better than classic, if generals are different levels (most will be level 10 anyway) the lesser player gets more cash to spend so its all good there.... did u vote on classic mode v avatar mode or something? who the hell would vote for this mode? somone who hasent played much?

[AggonyReborn]

the main issue with playing avatar mode is the general cost due to retainer costs. Those retainers wont be used in this type of format. so technically the lower level players will have that money advantage. If avatar mode is used then all players should be level 10 in order to participate. Classic mode is buggy indeed, but its the best alternative to no advantages for any side. plus its interesting to play without the option of using loan swords, and monk matchlocks, can make for some different army builds.

[Swoosh So]

I mean play avatar mode with everything including retainers just missing vets.

[RTKAbu]

Cant believe cwc is gonna be ruined with classiic mode i was so looking forward to it :( i dont see any sense in using this crap mode, just go with no vets im telling u its way better than classic, if generals are different levels (most will be level 10 anyway) the lesser player gets more cash to spend so its all good there.... did u vote on classic mode v avatar mode or something? who the hell would vote for this mode? somone who hasent played much?

It is chosen by people who reject innovation and more strategy options. O wait, i cant say that otherwise i may get banned even on the .org. Instead of looking to find solutions (which are easy, you even give a good solution) and include the advantages of the avatar game, they went a step back, but well, thats CWC, walking 2 steps forward, and go 3 back in the end in the name of 'perfect balance'. Lets hope the other large tournament CWB got some sense though.

[ELITEofWARMANGINGERYBREADMEN88]

It is chosen by people who reject innovation and more strategy options. O wait, i cant say that otherwise i may get banned even on the .org. Instead of looking to find solutions (which are easy, you even give a good solution) and include the advantages of the avatar game, they went a step back, but well, thats CWC, walking 2 steps forward, and go 3 back in the end in the name of 'perfect balance'. Lets hope the other large tournament CWB got some sense though.

Guess you have a point,Abu.

[Swoosh So]

All im saying classic mode is not "classic mode" the avatar mode with vets does the same thing but is much better - i really doubt theres some serious clan member out there less than level 10 thats gonna participate.

[Marshall Louis-Nicolas Davout]

Since avatar conquest is a futile endeavor right now, I guess I'm down for some classic battles.

Just add me on steam and we'll play sometime.

will do.