Considering Ptolomai campaign at some point

**Titus Marcellus Scato** · 01-19-2012, 15:57

My two tips for starting an AS campaign are:

Turn 1. Move your archer unit out of Asaak and attack the nearby Pahlavan army. Either fight this hopeless battle or withdraw immediately. Because you attack first, proving your determination to fight, this allows you to keep Bactria, Pontos and Hayasdan as your allies instead of them all deserting you when Pahlava attacks you first at the end of the first turn. Also, recruit a diplomat in Antiochia-Margiane.

Turn 2. Destroy all buildings in Marakanda and Alexandria-Eschate and pull out the garrisons. Move the new diplomat to Bactra and give the rebellious, worthless towns to your Bactrian allies. (You may need to use Force Diplomacy to get them to accept.) Now defending those towns from the Saka juggernaut is Bactria's problem, not yours - and you can make peace with the Saka since you don't have a border with them anymore. And this will keep Bactria occupied too.

**Stark** · 01-19-2012, 17:26

What's the benefit of being allied with someone? They don't go to war with you, which would be the obvious perk. I know you can fight battles together, but that's extremely rare situation. I assume you get some relations bonus, but does someone know the exact benefits of alliance status?

**Titus Marcellus Scato** · 01-19-2012, 17:55

Originally Posted by Stark

What's the benefit of being allied with someone? They don't go to war with you, which would be the obvious perk. I know you can fight battles together, but that's extremely rare situation. I assume you get some relations bonus, but does someone know the exact benefits of alliance status?

Military access, allowing you to move armies through their territory without them getting upset, seems to me to be the main benefit of having allies.

**seleucid empire** · 01-19-2012, 18:46

i think you start off with military access to pontus bactria and parthia but if you break alliance with them it is almost impossible to get access back even if you ally with them again. i dont see why you would need military access tho, has anyone here found it useful? i imagine there would be some trade bonuses if you border them? but im just guessing

**athanaric** · 01-19-2012, 18:54

Originally Posted by Titus Marcellus Scato

Turn 2. Destroy all buildings in Marakanda and Alexandria-Eschate and pull out the garrisons. Move the new diplomat to Bactra and give the rebellious, worthless towns to your Bactrian allies. (You may need to use Force Diplomacy to get them to accept.) Now defending those towns from the Saka juggernaut is Bactria's problem, not yours - and you can make peace with the Saka since you don't have a border with them anymore. And this will keep Bactria occupied too.

Better idea yet - leave those garrisons where they are and offer the settlements to Baktria as a gift, along with a small sum of money or map information. For some reason, the AI only accepts this if the garrison is in place and not roaming around the province. If Baktria accepts, your garrisons will pull out automatically.

**Nightmare** · 01-19-2012, 21:23

So I gamed this out a bit just to see what was possible. My objective this test session was to simply see if I could shore up my borders without a fight. Of course Pahlva attacks you at Asaak the first round. How to avoid this? By giving it away, but how? Your only diplomat must get to another faction before this round is over, and the only faction in range is... the Ptolomies! So I went to him and asked him to take it. He refused, so I asked him again, also offering 3000 credits (all I had) plus map. He took it, LOL.

After giving Marakanda and Alexandria-Eschate to Bactria the next round as suggested above, that almost shored me up completely. Unfortunately, within a round or two Pahlva attacked a guy I had standing outside Antiocheia-Margaine and another guy I had at the border of Zadrakata. This tells me that I need to attempt giving away those cities to Bactria as well, and see what happens.

I'll game it out later and report back, unless someone here already knows what happens.

**Sapper** · 01-20-2012, 08:38

Originally Posted by athanaric

Better idea yet - leave those garrisons where they are and offer the settlements to Baktria as a gift, along with a small sum of money or map information. For some reason, the AI only accepts this if the garrison is in place and not roaming around the province. If Baktria accepts, your garrisons will pull out automatically.

Now this is very interesting. As someone who does not use Forced diplomacy I always offer money along with a settlement as a gift. No chance of the AI accepting without the money it appears. But I had not considered that the garrison would also have an effect. Thanks.

**Brennus** · 01-21-2012, 19:19

Originally Posted by athanaric

the AI only accepts this if the garrison is in place and not roaming around the province. If Baktria accepts, your garrisons will pull out automatically.

Ahhhh. Learn something new every day.

**Nightmare** · 01-22-2012, 03:35

Are jew spearmen any good? Are they similar to those spearmen that can throw javelins that the hellenic powers can recruit, or are they something different? Since they have around the same cost as a levy pike, I just jeep recruiting levy pikes, but I'd like to know.

**Lysimachos** · 01-22-2012, 05:41

Originally Posted by Nightmare

Are jew spearmen any good? Are they similar to those spearmen that can throw javelins that the hellenic powers can recruit, or are they something different? Since they have around the same cost as a levy pike, I just jeep recruiting levy pikes, but I'd like to know.

They are a decent unit. They are indeed spearmen who also have javelins and being cheaper and more numerous (I'm not sure about this; I'm answering from memory) they can be a budget alternative to Thureophoroi or Thorakitai. Compared to levy pikes they are less suited for the centre of the line, but more versatile and still able to hold their ground well.

**seleucid empire** · 01-22-2012, 07:47

more vulnerable to missiles but better morale than thureos

**Blxz** · 01-22-2012, 11:35

Definitely one of my favourite units in the area.

**Sapper** · 01-25-2012, 08:54

Originally Posted by Nightmare

Are jew spearmen any good? Are they similar to those spearmen that can throw javelins that the hellenic powers can recruit, or are they something different? Since they have around the same cost as a levy pike, I just jeep recruiting levy pikes, but I'd like to know.

Ioudaioi Taxeis, aka Jewish Spearmen, are an excellent unit to recruit in the Levant. They are indeed similar to Thureophoroi and Thorakitai (those spearmen that can throw javelins that the hellenic powers can recruit) having javelins and a spear but they also have a few differences. Their cost lies between the two Hellenic troop types, as does their morale. They have the same number of javelins, 3, but they are slightly weaker, 5 as against 6 attack, but longer range, 45 as against 35. They have the same melee attack and charge bonus as Thureophoroi and are therefore a bit weaker than Thorakitai. Their defence is weaker than Thureophoroi, but is the same as Peltastai, who of course have swords and not spears as their secondary weapon. But there are two areas where they really score: they only require a level 2 Native MIC to recruit, as opposed to level 3 or 4 for T & T, plus you get more men, 200 on huge as opposed to 160 for T & T, or P! You can recruit them in Sidon, Heirosolyma, Antiocheia, Damaskos and Petra and in my view, you should! The AI tends to like them too.