Total War: Rome 2 Announced

[Monk]

I think you're judging it a bit too harshly based on their comments so far.

Maybe, but i remember very similar early information about ETW's system. It sounded good in theory but what we got was awful.

CA have rather boldly stated that the map is much larger than RTW, and has "hundreds" of regions. They don't typically give out campaign map info like that on release day, which indicates this is a big change in some way. It sounds to me like it's meshing with the province management system. Essentially, it sounds like they're combining the ETW/TWS2 system with 'dispersed' production within a region, with the system used by all the other games. Take the existing TWS2 system, but then make all of the individual 'buildings' in its own region, and allow that region to be conquered by an enemy, not just 'damaged.' Simply repairing the building would not restore your production, you'd have to send units out to get the thing back. So, probably more field battles, which is a good thing.

Similarly, loss of the capital may prevent you from producing anything in the province, but controlling nothing but the capital of the province would probably have a similar impact on your enemy. So, you would not see provinces instantly churning out troops for the other side... that ability would only start showing up after all the associated regions are conquered as well. In general, it sounds to me like a way of reducing the frequency of siege battles. Sure, there will probably be many to take whatever the 'capital' of the province is, but the fate of the province might actually hinge on field battles fought in defense of the regions long before the capital is threatened. That's a change that I'm at least optimistic about. Sure, they could implement it in a manner that is poor, but it could also be a welcome improvement.

If they actually did something like that it wouldn't be that bad depending on how they do the implementation. As i said before, though, less micro isn't necessarily a good thing. There's a special kind of charm to building up both your provinces and your armies, building by building, unit by unit, ect.

[TinCow]

Maybe, but i remember very similar early information about ETW's system. It sounded good in theory but what we got was awful.

True, but ETW was clearly their low-point in a lot of respects (sales not being one of them). I think we all agree that CA pulled up their shorts for TWS2 and delivered a game which was one of the best showings, even if it wasn't perfect. For that reason, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on future refinements. In fact, they've already clearly made one change that I think is a huge improvement: traits for armies. It's unclear whether this will only apply to Roman Legions, or whether non-Roman factions will get it as well, but I really, really like the fact that they are making efforts to give individual armies their own flavor, not just generals.

[Monk]

True, but ETW was clearly their low-point in a lot of respects (sales not being one of them). I think we all agree that CA pulled up their shorts for TWS2 and delivered a game which was one of the best showings, even if it wasn't perfect.

Yes that is one thing we can both agree on. Shogun 2 stole my heart away and inspired me to write my first two TW related AARs in years. It captured my imagination in a way that I didn't think the TW series could anymore and i give CA all the credit in the world for that. I didn't mean to come off as Scrooge in my earlier posts. I'm skeptical, but very much intrigued.

For that reason, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on future refinements. In fact, they've already clearly made one change that I think is a huge improvement: traits for armies. It's unclear whether this will only apply to Roman Legions, or whether non-Roman factions will get it as well, but I really, really like the fact that they are making efforts to give individual armies their own flavor, not just generals.

It all depends on how far they go honestly, but there are some things about Rome 2 that sound absolutely fantastic and one of those is what you mentioned. In the Total War series the character leading the army has always endeared himself to me. The army was just the extension by which that character expressed himself on the battlefield. If they could somehow extend that characterization into the army itself, well.. Rome 2 could very well be the best game in the series. I am a huge fan of ANY game that takes on a life of its own in those ways. Shogun 2 did it with its eloquent yet simple RPG system for characters.

We'll have to see how things shape up. If they can somehow combine the macro organization of Empire with the micro elements of Shogun 2 I think we're all in for a real treat.