Crusader Kings II

[rvg]

Any tips for who to go on my next attempt?

King of Scotland, of course.

[Chaotix]

I finally caved in and got this game, and have just lost at my first attempt!

I played as the elderly King of Iceland. I married, has lots of kids and ensured my heir did the same. I had only one vassal. Since I was part of the de jure Norwegian Kingdom, the King of Norway attacked me to make my vassal his own, which he easily did, since I could only raised 1,200 men to his 4,000+ that arrived on my shore. So, I was reduced to one province. My king then died, and the heir took his place, only to convert to Catharism, become posseessed, have his entire court hate him, and generally go insane. The King of Norway then declared a Holy War, I surrendered thinking I might just be vassalised. But I was not, and I didn't stand a chance anyway. So ended my game!

Any tips for who to go on my next attempt?

Well...

Ireland is a better 'tutorial island', if that's what you were looking to find in Iceland.

William the Conqueror is good if you want to get right into the action and start with a powerful kingdom in a decent position.

If you want to try the vassal-intrigue-faction game, pick someone in the HRE.

Not sure how many DLCs you have, but that covers the base game pretty well for early picks.

[Myth]

Iceland is actually a hard start. That was my first start too. Then I moved on to Antioch in 1187. Word of advice: don't.

I'd tell you to go for Jorvik, Jylland or Ostlandet if you want to be Norse, any of the Karlings if you want to be Catholic or Venice in the Old Gods start date.

[Rhyfelwyr]

Yeah I was going for a sort of 'tutorial' faction. I think Ireland looks good for a next attempt, I've heard that Dublin is a good choice for beginners. Or perhaps Munster/Connaught, since they are rated as easier to play. No overlords to worry about!

[Myth]

Yeah but in the 1066 start. The Old Gods start will see you raided into oblivion by the vikings. FYI a human controlled Ivar the Boneless can take out Scotland, then Ireland all by himself and have free troops to spare.

[AntiDamascus]

I have also just gotten this game. We will see how well I do.

[Monk]

Yeah I was going for a sort of 'tutorial' faction. I think Ireland looks good for a next attempt, I've heard that Dublin is a good choice for beginners. Or perhaps Munster/Connaught, since they are rated as easier to play. No overlords to worry about!

Ireland is a wonderful start to learn the ropes of the game. You have room to experiment with the features but aren't going to be facing much outside danger. A 1066 start will be best so you don't have to worry about raiding.

After that, William the Conqueror, as others have suggested, is a great next step which will teach you the importance of vassal relations. You'll have the chance to fight an invasion and then deal with subjugating the people you've conquered. France is the only main concern for you. You will likely lose Normandy but after you've solidified your position in the isles you can get it back as well as go Crusading.

Once you've mastered William the sky is the limit. You should have the know how to play and do whatever you want in CK2. If you're looking for the ultimate challenge then might I suggest Herbert, Count de Vermandois in the 1066 start date.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

You are the last descendant of the Karling House and start as a one province count on the borders of France and the HRE. Your liege is the Capet King of France. You have decent stats but no claims of your own. Recapturing a King-tier title will take hard work and a little bit of luck, but restoring the Karling dynasty to its 'rightful' place makes for some really fun times.

[Ishmael]

Yeah I was going for a sort of 'tutorial' faction. I think Ireland looks good for a next attempt, I've heard that Dublin is a good choice for beginners. Or perhaps Munster/Connaught, since they are rated as easier to play. No overlords to worry about!

Ireland has always been my favourite start - I've probably played as much there as with all others put together. I'll also add Poland (in 1066) to the suggestions for after that - you start near pagans, so you can use the holy war casus belli to expand quickly, but the Romuva religion is small enough that you wont get dogpiled by too many others of that faith. If you ally with the HRE it's almost too easy. That then puts you pretty close to creating an empire title, which is always satisfying.

[rvg]

I'll also add Poland (in 1066) to the suggestions for after that - you start near pagans, so you can use the holy war casus belli to expand quickly, but the Romuva religion is small enough that you wont get dogpiled by too many others of that faith. If you ally with the HRE it's almost too easy...

Does the pagan defensive bonus and ultra low supply limit not pose a challenge, or do you wait until your MO tech level is at 4 before tackling the Romuvans?

[Ishmael]

Does the pagan defensive bonus and ultra low supply limit not pose a challenge, or do you wait until your MO tech level is at 4 before tackling the Romuvans?

This was a couple of patches back, so I may be out of date. The supply limit was ridiculously low when I started, but if I paced myself and attacked one or two province states at a time I could usually assault their castles, since they tended to have low garrisons due to the low development of the pagans. My allies often took care of their standing armies for me.

[Myth]

With the changes to the levies the new patch introduced the Kingdom of Jerusalem got transformed from basically a suicide mission of "how long can I endure the sunni and shia jihads?" to a glorious slaughter of hordes of light Muslim troops with the two vassalized holy orders and the Teutonic Order which spawns soon after campaign start.

I crushed and eradicated the hashashin and then went and took the best duchy from the egyptian caliphate just like that. Three holy orders absolutely crush face. Now I've picked another holy war and am yet to be thrown off. I can't wait to vassalize the TO (I need an empire level title however). And if I beg/borrow/steal my way into the crown of castille I'd get the already vassalized knights of Santiago and Canatabria, meaning I'd have 5 holy orders to use and massacre ALL the heathens.

[xploring]

All DLCs except the latest SoA ones 75% off on Steam
http://store.steampowered.com/app/203770/

There's a pre-Old Gods DLC pack for $12.49

[Monk]

With the changes to the levies the new patch introduced the Kingdom of Jerusalem got transformed from basically a suicide mission of "how long can I endure the sunni and shia jihads?" to a glorious slaughter of hordes of light Muslim troops with the two vassalized holy orders and the Teutonic Order which spawns soon after campaign start.

I crushed and eradicated the hashashin and then went and took the best duchy from the egyptian caliphate just like that. Three holy orders absolutely crush face. Now I've picked another holy war and am yet to be thrown off. I can't wait to vassalize the TO (I need an empire level title however). And if I beg/borrow/steal my way into the crown of castille I'd get the already vassalized knights of Santiago and Canatabria, meaning I'd have 5 holy orders to use and massacre ALL the heathens.

[Veho Nex]

Ive got 2 CKII 50% off coupons. Anyone want them?

[rickinator9]

I have one as well.

[Arjos]

Crusader Kings 2 is getting Rajas of India, which, as you might expect, expands the map. With India included, the game's map becomes 50% bigger, incorporating an extra 300+ provinces. And Europa Universalis 4? That expansion will be called Wealth of Nations, and it'll focus on improving and expanding trade.

Will they ever stop with all these expansions? I sincerely hope not! ^^

[Buzghush]

Is this game really that good? Seems to much strategy but no 3d -or even 2d- battles, right?

[Ishmael]

Is this game really that good? Seems to much strategy but no 3d -or even 2d- battles, right?

The key thing to understand about this game is that it's not about the battles, or even necessarily conquering land. It's all about the characters and the interactions between them, and the stories that creates. I know that sounds rather cliched, but it's the only way I can phrase it. Put it this way - it's definitely worth trying out, even with just the base game.

Will they ever stop with all these expansions? I sincerely hope not! ^^

Great, just when I'd nearly found time for EUIV. They're shooting themselves in the foot - at this rate I'll never need to buy another game again, thus depriving them of future profit.

[rvg]

The key thing to understand about this game is that it's not about the battles, or even necessarily conquering land. It's all about the characters and the interactions between them, and the stories that creates. I know that sounds rather cliched, but it's the only way I can phrase it. Put it this way - it's definitely worth trying out, even with just the base game.

Battles are lots of fun though. Correct composition of the army flanks combined with a careful choice of generals would result in a very vs seemingly overwhelming (2:1 and even worse) odds. Very satisfying. Warfare in CK2 is NOT the "put together the largest stack possible and chew up everything in your path without giving any thought to what's in that stack", as that kind of thinking can easily get you killed. Unless you're Byzantine of course, in which case you just crank out the cataphracts and watch them destroy everything regardless of tactics/generals/terrain/whatever. Well, almost. But Cataphracts are very forgiving in terms of bad army management.

[Myth]

Any specific tips on army composition?

[Kekvit Irae]

Any specific tips on army composition?

Lots and lots of archers if you want to kill. This is the glass cannon approach, as you will get absolutely decimated if you get in the Melee phase. Also, don't use these on the defensive. Running with all Longbowmen retinues, you can absolutely devastate armies. They will also wreck sieges if you use them to assault, as assaulting uses the Skirmish phase to determine enemy losses.

Pikemen are the standard defensive unit, but they pale in comparison to Heavy Infantry. Still, they come cheap.

Heavy Infantry is balanced enough to see you through both the Skirmish and the Melee phase, but don't expect miracles or auto-wins. These guys are wonderful if you want to win while keeping your own losses down. Mostly useful on the defense, they are also pretty good on the offense.

Light Cavalry, despite their stats, actually fares decently in Skirmish and Melee, but it absolutely shines in the Pursuit phase. Just be sure to add in some heavy hitters into your army so you CAN get to the Pursuit phase.

Heavy Cavalry is the king of the battlefield. Expensive and comes in small numbers, but their stats are beautiful all across the board. If you can afford them and have the appropriate culture, Cataphracts are THE go-to retinue. The only reason I favor Longbowmen over Cataphracts is because Longbowmen cost only 500 retinue cap. For levies, you will need a LOT of tech and buildings to get a decent amount of Heavy Cavalry.

Light Infantry is garbage. Nothing more needs to be said, other than they are cheap if you need enough men to start sieging.

As for army composition, I would suggest either 1) a balanced army, or 2) a specialized army for attacking/sieging/defending. Just take a look at what you want to accomplish, then take a look at the stats of the units, and build around that.

[rvg]

Any specific tips on army composition?

A lot depends on your culture. For example, if you run with the Italians, Pike and bow is a great overall combo.

Example #1: mostly Defensive Retinue + some Skirmish retinue + a couple of Italian pure Pikes for the morale bonus. Led by an Italian/Scottish/English/Welsh general.
Pros: Archers do great in the Skirmish phase. Pikes will break any charge.
Cons: Does not (and should not*) contain any cavalry, does terribly in the pursuit phase, i.e. you can't catch the fleeing enemy.

*This composition will be severely compromised if it contains cavalry, because that introduces all kinds of bad tactics for the general to pick. This combo is great for the army center, but flanks are better off with something different.


Example #2: Straight up melee. The Norse of all kind excel at this
Mostly Norse Huscarls + some Shock retinue + a sprinkle of Defensive retinue. Naturally, led by a Norse general.
Pros: Do well defensively in the skirmish phase if the general puts up the shield wall. If a Norse general orders the berserker charge, this combo will slaughter the above Pike/Bow combo. Does exceptionally well in protracted melee.
Cons: Knights will ride them down like grass. Not great at pursuit, does hardly any damage during skirmish.

Note: minimize the presence of archers and cavalry in this combo to prevent bad tactics.

Example #3
Cavalry. This more than other combos depends on culture: if you have Knights, then great, They can handle themselves well and keep their Light Cav component alive as well. Naturally, Frankish and German generals are the best. You can mix in a few pikes, but avoid Archers or Heavy infantry. Best at charging and overall does well against everything except pikes.
Altaic group Horse Archer combo (Horse archers + Light Cav). When Led by a Turkish or a Mongol general these guys are close to unstoppable. their HA's can swarm the enemy archers, the general's cultural tactic can keep combat in the perpetual Skirmish phase, and when it's all said and done, the light cav will make short work of the routers. Weaknesses: terrible in melee. They need to get charged and forced into melee. Repeatedly. Knights are optimal for this.

Cataphracts: the ultimate I win combo. Knights + Horse archers is a damn near perfect combo that needs no additions. Led by a competent general of pretty much any culture these can do well. The good old Pike/Bow combo does well against them though.


A few final thoughts:
1. Diversify your flanks unless you're Byz or Mongol. You only need one flank with cavalry. Center flank should generally be infantry+Archers, and lots of both. The remaining flank can be whatever floats your boat.
2. Specialize the flanks. Based on your cultural units, the generals that you have (including their traits and such), etc.
3. Avoid mixing in too many troop types. Retinues slaughter levies. Why? it's not because of numbers or because retinues have better men, it's because a general levy army is a confused mishmash of all kinds of troops jammed together into a flank. Supposedly good at everything, but because of bad tactics ends up being bad at everything.
4. Tactics. I'm talking about the choices that your generals will make. They're more important than unit quality and to a large extent more important than quantity. Unless you're outnumbering the enemy by 10:1, tactics will matter. Cultural tactics can make a lot of difference.
5. ckiiwiki has a wealth of information on battle tactics. After I read it and implemented some ideas in practice, it gave me a brand new understanding and appreciation for combat in CK2: it's extremely detailed, and if you happen to be a quality vs quantity kind of guy, you'll love its intricacies.

Hope this helps.

[Chaotix]

Finally got the Khan of Khans achievement. A good 50 hours sunk into that campaign, at least. Not to mention some googling to determine what exactly Paradox considers "continental Europe".

Screenshot:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[Myth]

How do you keep this afloat? Don't you get factions and rebels out the wazoo?

[Kekvit Irae]

How do you keep this afloat? Don't you get factions and rebels out the wazoo?

North Korea mode. AKA, holding every single province for yourself and banishing all your vassals for their land and gold.

I never did that with my Khan of Khan game, mostly because I never needed to. I never gave out kingdom titles. Keep your vassals small, never hold a kingdom title, and you'll be able to blitz through without a problem. If there is a problem, your retinues will clean up any messes that occurs.

[Chaotix]

North Korea mode. AKA, holding every single province for yourself and banishing all your vassals for their land and gold.

I never did that with my Khan of Khan game, mostly because I never needed to. I never gave out kingdom titles. Keep your vassals small, never hold a kingdom title, and you'll be able to blitz through without a problem. If there is a problem, your retinues will clean up any messes that occurs.

Didn't do North Korea mode at all.

Interestingly, factions were never a threat because I made lots of kingdoms - I was always either in a defensive war (+50 relations) or conquering, and after each conquest I would typically have enough land to make a new kingdom. I would then grant this kingdom along with most of the land to a generated character, who was instantly loyal for the next 20 years or so. By the time the bonuses for that ran out, long reign bonuses would start to kick in. Once I had a ton of land, Kingdoms became as numerous as Duchies in a normal realm, so they weren't much of a threat, and they never got enough of them banded together. The only faction was ever independence, and it was only the few non-Mongol, non-Tengri characters left over from subjugation.

I had a succession crisis with my first succession, Genghis Khan's son, because it was Ultimogeniture still and I had some strong older sons. After that I managed a small window where I got it to Primogeniture, and then didn't land my other sons. No problems with the second succession. This guy in the screenshot was my fourth ruler, I probably got lucky with his succession because it occurred during the Abbasid Caliphate's Jihad - a blessing in disguise, the only legitimate threat I ever faced simply because I couldn't move my troops fast enough in large numbers to Persia. It lasted at least 15 years, providing an ample window for my new ruler to get settled.

Now as for peasant rebels, I had a ton of those. Towards the end of the game I was getting a new Catholic Uprising every month or two, and the game actually stopped numbering them after it got to 30. They were a pain in the ass, but since I was always using my Horse Archer retinues to conquer I had liege levies free to take down rebels at all times. Once, also during the Jihad, I had a bit of a crisis where about 5 or 6 stacks spawned in a single uprising before I was able to put it down. Besides that they were never too bad to deal with, and since Catholic moral authority was devastated (I even made the Pope my vassal so they couldn't crusade me) the provinces started converting to Tengri on their own very quickly.

Other difficulties - those damned independent baronies! First, finding them was enough of a pain, but then the invasion CB doesn't work on them, so if they are multiple baronies spread out under the same ruler, you have to take them one at a time and wait for truces (or start hiring assassins, which I almost never do as a personal rule, but I made an exception here). On one occasion, I took the last barony of a former Spanish king, who then proceeded to become the new leader of the Knights of Calatrava, who also owned a barony that I needed to take.

Oh, and the Lords of the Sky. Their leaders are always Cuman (new leaders will even convert to Cuman upon inheritance), so there is no way to vassalize them as a Mongol ruler. AND for some reason there is no county-claim Casus Belli against them if you are Tengri. I used a magnificent exploit to take their land - first I set my Court Chaplain to Research Cultural Tech and waited for the heretic spawn event. For some reason, the game doesn't consider Old Tengri, so he can only suggest that you convert to Tengri (which I already am). Then I used my concubine to convert to Sunni (I imagine christian works as well), immediately declared war, and used the heretic event to convert back to Tengri before unpausing. The war continued (didn't end inconclusively) and I was able to conquer the Lords of the Sky.

[naut]

How do you lads and ladies deal with Dukes marrying into each-other's houses and forming super duchies? Revoking and plots?

[Chaotix]

How do you lads and ladies deal with Dukes marrying into each-other's houses and forming super duchies? Revoking and plots?

Keep your crown authority at Medium or lower, so that your vassals can't switch to Primogeniture succession (If you moved it to High to get Primo for yourself, drop it again at the earliest opportunity). This makes it much more difficult for one son to inherit all the lands of both parents. Once they already have Primogeniture or Super-Duchies, there's not a whole lot you can do besides revoke Duchies after rebellions. There is a plot to make a super-duke give up one of his titles, but I believe only fellow vassals can get it. They will bring it to you and you can support it, though. Otherwise definitely make sure you revoke lands if they rebel. If you have big long-reign bonuses and can afford the tyranny hit, you can also just try flat-out revoking titles. Sometimes that's the best idea if they are in a powerful faction, as you will likely have to fight the faction anyway but you can take the threatening ones down individually and without event troop spawns. If they're not rebelling... don't worry too much about it? Make sure your own troops plus your loyal levies can handle any combined threat, and you are set.

EDIT: Agnatic succession also prevents women from inheriting and therefore from a kid inheriting duchies from mother and father. That's a valid way to do it. But I generally don't use it because I think it's boring.

[rvg]

EDIT: Agnatic succession also prevents women from inheriting and therefore from a kid inheriting duchies from mother and father. That's a valid way to do it. But I generally don't use it because I think it's boring.

I don't believe that works on a Duchy level, only kingdoms and empires. I usually run Agnatic (my favorite), but that doesn't prevent the appearances of unmarried childless duchesses.

[Beskar]

CK2 is getting India expansion!

Dust off your jewelled turban and defend dharma as a mighty Indian Raja, conquering in the name of Indra! Raise war elephant units and fight in the dense jungle terrain. Make Siddhartha proud as a Buddhist and advance your technology or maintain a harmonious stable realm as a Jain. Raid your neighbors as a warlike Hindu of the Kshatriya caste!

Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India introduces a wealth of new cultural and religious events that would appease even the ferocious goddess Kali, including meeting yogis and sadhus, celebrating Diwali and thinking about your reincarnation. Be careful, the Wheel of Life keeps on turning and those karmic forces can be equally cruel!

With all eyes on Hindustan, the map has been extended far to the east to encompass hundreds of new provinces in Central Asia as well as opening up the ports of The Red Sea and Indian Ocean for navigation by your fleets.
Read more here: http://www.paradoxplaza.com/games/cr...rajas-of-india

Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India will be available to download from digital portals this spring