State of the Mod Address, Fall 2013: We're Almost There

[Kull]

At the risk of universal opprobrium, I'll pose an old question: when's this damn thing gonna be released? I'm not asking for an exact date, I'm asking for a rough estimate. If the EB Twitter is any indication, most of the major bugs have been ironed out and the game is almost finished. Assuming that the current rate of development continues, when can we expect a release? In a month? Sometime in summer?

Don't take this as ingratitude. For the modders that have devoted months and years of their life to making EBII happen, I thank you from the depths of my admittedly shallow heart. I appreciate your sacrifice and dedication, and I'm not trying to be impatient. I just want to know if I should get excited yet. I understand if you can't give a straight answer to the question. But given the vague parameters, I believe you should be able to.

Here's the thing. We have ironed out the horrific bugs that caused the game to CTD and resolved others that severely hampered playability. What we are still working on are the MULTITUDE of factors that combine to make the game interesting - or not. Things like recruitment, the economy, AI faction survivability, and a host of related, complex interactions, could not be tested and addressed until the worst of the stability issues had been resolved. The good news is, we are there. The bad news is, those are major issues, and none of them are subject to quick fixes.

When the original announcement was made last fall, there was a feeling that the mod had been in process for far too long, and it was better to release an alpha than to just keep moseying along forever. But since then we have made quantum leaps in many areas, and have a deeper team working in a larger number of areas. That has allowed us to "raise the bar". Rather than dropping a half finished, barely playable mod on those who've long awaited it, the goal is to deliver a product that is historically rich in detail AND interesting and exciting to play.

We are also painfully aware of the Total War community's reaction to the playability issues affecting R2TW. For us to do the same thing to our fans? That would be unconscionable. So when will it be released? Hard to say. This year absolutely. In the next few months, probably not. There truly are too many variables at play to say any more than that. You can be confident however, that a large team is working every single day to get this done. It will be worth the wait.

[Shadowwalker]

You, the staff, have been working off your backsides for 7 years (I think the first announcement of an EB II actually being worked on was in spring 2007).
You did so despite all the obstacles real life or hardcoded limits threw at you.
We, the drooling fans, have been waiting - more or less patient - for the same time.

And I honestly think that neither you nor we will die if the game (I'm deliberately avoiding the term "mod", for obvious reasons) is delayed for some months more.
Suffering may happen (more serious at your than at our end, as I suppose), but there are no lives in danger from any such delay, as far as I'm aware.

In other words: take your time. I expect the game to keep me busy for several years at least. Probably it will - for me - be the ultimate strategy game, replacing my alltime favourite Civilization II.

What are a few more months (or even one or two years?) of waiting compared to that perspective? Nothing, seriously.
To quote you: "It's done when it's done."
To quote me: "Whenever EB II is ready, I'll be here to appreciate it." And I'm pretty sure there are many others who feel the same.

[Ca Putt]

Sounds great actually!

And I can agree with Shadowwalker, If it takes the time then take the time, Rome 2 has shown how it's not done, your move :D

quantum leaps

you know that that actually is an euphemism ;)

[abou]

To add to Kull's post, you guys should also know that there have been many things that we want to change or include, but that the team has democratically elected to be for a second release. We are aware of feature creep and have been limiting it.

[Grimmy]

To add to Kull's post, you guys should also know that there have been many things that we want to change or include, but that the team has democratically elected to be for a second release. We are aware of feature creep and have been limiting it.

Yeh here that guys! We're gonna get some creepy features in EB2!

Werewolves?
Vampires?
Zombies?

[Titus Marcellus Scato]

Kull,

From my point of view, the longer the team takes in getting AI faction play balance right, the better.

I never finished a campaign in EB1 due to frustration with AI factions like Seleukia and Ptolemies becoming uber-powerful with stacks of elite units while I was trying to play a slow, role-playing campaign on Medium. My EB1 experience is one of playing the first 50 years of a campaign with all the various factions, then starting again - the game only remained 'historically balanced' (but still interesting and challenging) for me in the early years.

So please take your time and beta-test to the max with long test campaigns! After 6 years of waiting, what's 6 months more?

[Ice]

Kull,

So please take your time and beta-test to the max with long test campaigns! After 6 years of waiting, what's 6 months more?

This sums up my thoughts as well.

[fireblade]

Yeh here that guys! We're gonna get some creepy features in EB2!

Werewolves?
Vampires?
Zombies?

My personal guess is flaming pigs to be honest

Anyway, i can only concur with shadowwalker, i'll be patiently waiting and can only appreciate all the great work you guys have been doing

[Rex Somnorum]

Snip

Thanks for the honest answer. Although I'm sorta disappointed that the mod isn't coming out in the next month or so (especially since I was expecting it sometime in early 2014), I'm content that the extra time for development will be spent improving the game. And compared to seven years, a few more months isn't that much time anyway.

So, what's mostly left is game balancing and adding shiny features, then?

[Kull]

Thanks for the honest answer. Although I'm sorta disappointed that the mod isn't coming out in the next month or so (especially since I was expecting it sometime in early 2014), I'm content that the extra time for development will be spent improving the game. And compared to seven years, a few more months isn't that much time anyway.

So, what's mostly left is game balancing and adding shiny features, then?

The modding group is working pretty closely with the Beta Testing team (and we have a FANTASTIC group who are all active and contributing - just a huge plus) to identify problem areas with game balance/playability. There is a LOT to that, because there is so much interaction among all the elements that comprise EB2, so it can get pretty complicated. The good thing from the fans perspective is that allows the artists to spend more time adding "polish" and likewise, the historians have time to add to the immense amount of historical text that is going to accompany this mod. There is so much to love about EB2, but I'm in awe at the incredible ability of our historians to immerse you in all the cultures of this period.

[moonburn]

my only regreat about the entire waiting time is that due to shortage of time and lack of usefull skills i was not able to contribute and therefore if i can´t help i don´t think i can ever have the morals to put into question those that work hard to furfill something that i hope will bring me much joy

[fulcrum]

So when will it be released? Hard to say. This year absolutely. In the next few months, probably not.

Well then, how about December 2014? It would make a fine christmas present.

[fallen851]

When the original announcement was made last fall, there was a feeling that the mod had been in process for far too long, and it was better to release an alpha than to just keep moseying along forever. But since then we have made quantum leaps in many areas, and have a deeper team working in a larger number of areas. That has allowed us to "raise the bar". Rather than dropping a half finished, barely playable mod on those who've long awaited it, the goal is to deliver a product that is historically rich in detail AND interesting and exciting to play.

Scope creep (also called requirement creep and feature creep) in project management refers to uncontrolled changes or continuous growth in a project's scope. This can occur when the scope of a project is not properly defined, documented, or controlled. One of the many downsides of scope creep is that it delays release of the product.

Despite the fact that this is clear evidence of scope creep, it's fine. This is volunteer work and I'm sure it will be worth the wait. Actually, that it is lie, that stuff does matter. Even volunteer projects should be managed well, but I've got a really nicely modded version of EB to play that is tweaked just to my liking, and I am not sure the first releases of EBII can touch it.

[Kull]

Scope creep (also called requirement creep and feature creep) in project management refers to uncontrolled changes or continuous growth in a project's scope. This can occur when the scope of a project is not properly defined, documented, or controlled. One of the many downsides of scope creep is that it delays release of the product.

Despite the fact that this is clear evidence of scope creep, it's fine. This is volunteer work and I'm sure it will be worth the wait. Actually, that it is lie, that stuff does matter. Even volunteer projects should be managed well, but I've got a really nicely modded version of EB to play that is tweaked just to my liking, and I am not sure the first releases of EBII can touch it.

Scope creep is when you add things to a project that were never part of the original plan. There's nothing we are doing now that wasn't intended all along. The difference is that circumstances changed, and we were able to get the mod to a point where it was possible to do a lot more for the first release. Keep in mind that the mod had many bugs which had been there from the beginning, and one reason for the "early release" idea was to get more eyeballs on the problems - that need no longer exists.

[Empire*Of*Media]

I'll keep it, just as a reminder of darker times, times that are nearly over...

lol indeed yes. but i just like Animations of Rome II. and i think its the only Advantage and nothing more.

Personally I already left R2. I reallly prefer to play M2TW mods like IB2 or just enjoy the early spring we have in western europe atm than give anymore of my time this non-immersive flat piece of software.

And dreaminfg while watching at the fantastic screenshots of EB2 on twitter.

yes indeed. i played Rome I for more than 9 years, and still i love playing it online and custom battles. and thats because of Conquering everywhere so many times! but still tired of it generally!

i personally love the gameplay of Rome I and a bit of Med2 and Empire & Napoleon. the Shogun II anything except the gameplay its exactly like Rome II. but there's something you want to play it sometimes !!


its strange people never left Rome I & Med2!! someone made a thread in totalwar.com's forum that say goodbye to Rome I. well he was attacked by so many Rome I lovers including me!! hehe !

i think only Rome I and Med2 will be somehow Immortal!! and the other are just released and should be abandoned.

but EB is something else.

besides, i couldnt run IB! dont know why! when i click on CAMPAIGN button it says "select a faction from the list" sadly.....



anyway...... i think there is something in this world that everything good is From Past and its First! its not just about Games but Movies Musics memories and..............dont you agree?!

[Maeran]

anyway...... i think there is something in this world that everything good is From Past and its First! its not just about Games but Movies Musics memories and..............dont you agree?!

Not just nostalgia. The present, even allowing for a certain fuzzyness, is much smaller than the past. Anything good in the present soon joins the ever increasing past.
The present just can't keep anything. Which might be why it seems to be sulking so much of the time.

[Empire*Of*Media]

Not just nostalgia. The present, even allowing for a certain fuzzyness, is much smaller than the past. Anything good in the present soon joins the ever increasing past.
The present just can't keep anything. Which might be why it seems to be sulking so much of the time.

but i guess nowdays "Presents" are getting more & more rubbish than it was in the past "Presents"!!

[Hamburger]

but i guess nowdays "Presents" are getting more & more rubbish than it was in the past "Presents"!!

Indeed, i felt that too.

[Alcibiade]

anyway...... i think there is something in this world that everything good is From Past and its First! its not just about Games but Movies Musics memories and..............dont you agree?!

It's true that last time I started a EB campaign after a long time, the flute notes from the campaign screen music sent me directly into a warm section of my memory.

But I think that the awesomeness of RTW and M2TW is something real that doesn't need any help from a nostalgia effect. It's just plain, objective awesomeness.

To me, the fact that the game industry created a game that could be modified by the talent and passion of some modders and become such a fun and immersive type of wargame is almost miraculous. A perfect blend of fun and simulation obtained by serendipity.

And when I see the road CA is taking with R2 I feel like this kind of miracle won't happen twice.

After R2, I tested numerous strategy games and a long succession of disapointment brought me back to M2TW and RTW mods. All the way back to... EB.

[moonburn]

once eb2 is out expecially the future versions wich should be better balanced and more primped i don´t think i will ever need to play another strategy classical game since taking account of eb1 i think eb2 will be the closest to perfection one will ever get without like icharus being burned to the ground

[joshmahurin]

such a fun and immersive type of wargame

I think it's a tribute to EB that the war aspect is my least favorite part of these games now :P

[Maeran]

Total Economics

[Eastern Foot-Rocker]

All the way back to... EB.

The same here. I was so disapointed by r2 that i got back to EB. I bought myself the Alexander Addon and installed jirysis mega mod pack. Its a bit different from BI.exe now, but the AI is not that enhanced. Still i play EB again since months.

I am so disappointed that there is no development on Novus Ordo Mundi anymore. I was really waiting for playing the hasmoneans and kick ass the Roman empire. Unfortunately this mod really is dead.

[Alcibiade]

The same here. I was so disapointed by r2 that i got back to EB. I bought myself the Alexander Addon and installed jirysis mega mod pack. Its a bit different from BI.exe now, but the AI is not that enhanced. Still i play EB again since months.

I am so disappointed that there is no development on Novus Ordo Mundi anymore. I was really waiting for playing the hasmoneans and kick ass the Roman empire. Unfortunately this mod really is dead.

Yes, well the EB uchronia mod looks promising and in the meantime, I really enjoyed using jirisy's mega mod for alex.exe.