Faster Battles (temporary submod for EB 2.0.0)

[Moros]

If you want faster battles, but not quite as fast as vanilla try out this mod, it sets it to a middle ground:


Version 2 (second attemp less fast):
http://megafileupload.com/en/file/56...onfig-xml.html

Has kill ratio's of 0.35 for both melee and missiles.

Version 1 (first attempt, rather fast):
http://www.megafileupload.com/en/fil...onfig-xml.html

Has kill ratio's of 0.44 for melee, 0.5 for missiles.

Just copying the file into the mods\EBII\data folder and renaming it (remove the mega file part) should do the trick.

save game compatible!

Feedback welcome so you can help it get tuned for the mod itself!

[mikeboix]

Great, battles were extremly slow. What have you done here? Change troops in order to have more attack points?

[QuintusSertorius]

What does it change?

[Moros]

It doesn't change stats, it merely changes the kill ratio of hits.

While vanilla has a 1.0, factor the first release has a factor of 0.22. I doubled it to 0.44 making it less extreme.

[QuintusSertorius]

I quite liked the slower melee kills, it was everything else (cavalry, missiles) that seemed off to me. I'll give it a try in any case, this is the beta after all, where we're supposed to be trying things out.

[Twonk1972]

If you want faster battles, but not quite as fast as vanilla try out this mod, it sets it to a middle ground:

http://www.megafileupload.com/en/fil...onfig-xml.html

Just copying the file into the mods\EBII\data folder should make it work.

save game compatible!

What it does?
The kill ratio of EB2.0 is currently set at 0.22, compared to a 1.0 in vanilla and mods like TATW.
This mod sets it a less extreme 0.44, resulting in battles that are slower paced, but more reasonable. A middle ground let say.
It also improves the lethality of missile from 0.22 to 0.5, making them more effective, but they still shouldn't be overpowered.

Thank you. Just noticed that when i save this file it saves as Megaupload-Battle config and not Battleconfig as per the original file.

Will this make a difference and will i need to delete the original file?

[QuintusSertorius]

Thank you. Just noticed that when i save this file it saves as Megaupload-Battle config and not Battleconfig as per the original file.

Will this make a difference and will i need to delete the original file?

You need to rename it, the game is looking for the original filename, not the new one with Megaupload inserted into it.

[QuintusSertorius]

Someone's just made a submod that increases the range of javelin-skirmishers (but not other javelin-wielders) and changed their formation to that of Akontistai, which apparently fixes the "never throws their missiles" issue they had. I'll give this a try in combination with the increased kill ratios here (not the one there that raised missiles to an excessive 1.0!), and report back.

[Moros]

Someone's just made a submod that increases the range of javelin-skirmishers (but not other javelin-wielders) and changed their formation to that of Akontistai, which apparently fixes the "never throws their missiles" issue they had. I'll give this a try in combination with the increased kill ratios here (not the one there that raised missiles to an excessive 1.0!), and report back.

Note that the ranges and the likes concerning skirmishers should be fixed in the first patch we release.

[QuintusSertorius]

Not that the ranges and the likes concerning skirmishers should be fixed in the first patch we release.

Excellent! Great to hear you guys are still working on things behind the scenes.

[Moros]

Of course we are.

Also might update the post to include a version with speeds in between the original and the first update. That way I and some of our members are not the only to test this (hopefully). So feedback would be welcome.

[QuintusSertorius]

Of course we are.

Also might update the post to include a version with speeds in between the original and the first update. That way I and some of our members are not the only to test this (hopefully). So feedback would be welcome.

I'd gladly test a slightly slower one than the doubled version above - perhaps 0.3 or 0.33 for melee/cavalry and 0.4 or 0.44 for missiles? So a halfway house to the halfway house.

EDIT: You did one while I was replying! I think I'll try that first.

[Moros]

Missiles were a bit strong to my feelings. Ibrahim (who does our unit stats) even suggested setting them lower than melee. I'd like to give this a try. Though missiles can only be really tested when they all work (referring to skirmisher problems). If this makes arrows to strong, but not javelins we may need to fine tune attack ratings rather than the missile factor.

[Twonk1972]

You need to rename it, the game is looking for the original filename, not the new one with Megaupload inserted into it.

Ok thanks mate will try it now.

[QuintusSertorius]

Missiles were a bit strong to my feelings. Ibrahim (who does our unit stats) even suggested setting them lower than melee. I'd like to give this a try. Though missiles can only be really tested when they all work (referring to skirmisher problems). If this makes arrows to strong, but not javelins we may need to fine tune attack ratings rather than the missile factor.

I've edited mine thus:

<combat-balancing>
<missile-target-accuracy>
<infantry>0.4</infantry>
<cavalry>0.33</cavalry>
<elephants>0.4</elephants>
</missile-target-accuracy>
<melee-hit-rate>0.25</melee-hit-rate>

I've only tweaked melee up a tiny but, and made foot missiles more effective than mounted missiles (barring elephants; I'm guessing that was left higher because there are fewer of them in a unit?). I'll find out tomorrow evening when I get back home what it's like.

[kdrakak]

I quite liked the slower melee kills, it was everything else (cavalry, missiles) that seemed off to me. I'll give it a try in any case, this is the beta after all, where we're supposed to be trying things out.

Same here. Slower rate seems more realistic to me. Cavalry needs to really charge.

[Hennin]

Hello to everybody, it's my firt post and I have a question, why I can't download the file?, (sorry, if my english is not so good)

[QuintusSertorius]

Hello to everybody, it's my firt post and I have a question, why I can't download the file?, (sorry, if my english is not so good)

They were both working before.

If you can't, you can always edit your own yourself (make sure you copy it first as a backup) with Notepad or Notepad++. The file is in [M2TW]\mods\EBII\data and it's battle_config.xml. There's just four numbers to edit to whatever your preferred ratio is, located at the top of the file.

In the original (fast) one they are:

<combat-balancing>
<missile-target-accuracy>
<infantry>0.5</infantry>
<cavalry>0.5</cavalry>
<elephants>0.6</elephants>
</missile-target-accuracy>
<melee-hit-rate>0.44</melee-hit-rate>
</combat-balancing>


In the second (not-as-fast) one they're:

<combat-balancing>
<missile-target-accuracy>
<infantry>0.35</infantry>
<cavalry>0.35</cavalry>
<elephants>0.45</elephants>
</missile-target-accuracy>
<melee-hit-rate>0.35</melee-hit-rate>

[Hennin]

They were both working before.

If you can't, you can always edit your own yourself (make sure you copy it first as a backup) with Notepad or Notepad++. The file is in [M2TW]\mods\EBII\data and it's battle_config.xml. There's just four numbers to edit to whatever your preferred ratio is, located at the top of the file.

In the original (fast) one they are:

<combat-balancing>
<missile-target-accuracy>
<infantry>0.5</infantry>
<cavalry>0.5</cavalry>
<elephants>0.6</elephants>
</missile-target-accuracy>
<melee-hit-rate>0.44</melee-hit-rate>
</combat-balancing>


In the second (not-as-fast) one they're:

<combat-balancing>
<missile-target-accuracy>
<infantry>0.35</infantry>
<cavalry>0.35</cavalry>
<elephants>0.45</elephants>
</missile-target-accuracy>
<melee-hit-rate>0.35</melee-hit-rate>

Thanks, when I don't like it and I put the old one, I need to strar a new campaing or not?

[QuintusSertorius]

Thanks, when I don't like it and I put the old one, I need to strar a new campaing or not?

You shouldn't need to, again it's not a material change.

[Hennin]

You shouldn't need to, again it's not a material change.

Thanks

[Nightshift]

Hi I was redirected here from the general impression post and just changed the missile values to 0.35 as I liked melee as it is. Cavalry is ok for me to since it's more about morale dropping when beeing charged but maybe it could be a bit higher - not sure myself yet.

Anyway to test those values a started a custom battle with one Saka archer unit against one Sweboz skirmisher unit and while I think arrows feels quite right now (killed about half of them before beeing out of ammo), it seemed to me that 90% of the javelins were flying over the archer file landing behind their ranks. Meaning they are still pretty useless but maybe this could be changed with one of the throwing arc values wich is now 45° I believe (in projectile_descr). Sorry I just started looking into these files so I don't really know whats going on. Otherwise I like the throwing animation and everything, but maybe they shouldn't hesitate to throw if enemy is closing in as they do now and maybe throw more directly towards the targets since I guess this would in reality have more impact too. Anyway as it is now they just throw them over the heads..

-> 3 archers were killed by Javelins - no more! (and I believe missile and arrow kill ratio are affected likewise by this value)

[Nightshift]

Ok did some testing in custom battle changed max_angle from 55 to 35 but it seemed like it only decreased throwing range, not sure yet. But doubling accuracy to 0.10 helped a bit.



around 30 of the 80 archers were killed wich is still too low in my opinion, since they have no armor and were pretty close. As you can see the javelins on the ground are still distributet in quite a big area. AI was stupid too as they could have shot way more of my men by that time but thats a different storry (maybe because of their skirmish mode).

Maybe this value should even be like 0.07 or something. Problem is you need to disable skirmish mode, get in pretty close so every file in your rank can throw. So its only usefull when supporting an allready engaged unit. But I think if you get spears thrown in your back while fighting an enemy in front at least every second, well ok third spear should kill or disable a guy.

Don't know how this is handled by the engine if thrown from front and having a shield as protection, than maybe every 8th spear or so would do it. (Someone should calculate this-how many spears to break a shield, how many missing small romans, etc.pp. ;)

I mean at the time given the throwing spear was so popular as we can see ingame too, thats quite important!

And maybe horse-javs should have higher velocity since normal because of well velocity of horse and if standing higher position to throw from but I dont know if this messes up some formula..

Maybe someone more experienced could figure something out I would gladly test.

[Not_a_Strategist_yet]

The angle only changes the trajectory together with speeds and determines if soldiers will fire javelins.
If you need more accuracy then the accuracy factor should suffice.

I've actually tested with that while fixing skirmishers not firing javelins. Put the values even to 0.12 like you also found out and a lot of javelins will find the mark.

[Ibrahim]

just so you guys know--this is to help with testing: "accuracy" is a bit of a misnomer: found that out with Paedric at the twcenter a while back.

what it really is is the "scatter" of the missiles in radians to each side. If you guys want to get super pedantic (like I did with the archers and slingers), you can try to figure out a historic accuracy using that, and then tweak how deadly the hits are with battle_config.

[Not_a_Strategist_yet]

what it really is is the "scatter" of the missiles in radians to each side. If you guys want to get super pedantic (like I did with the archers and slingers), you can try to figure out a historic accuracy using that, and then tweak how deadly the hits are with battle_config..

That will; explain the smaller scatter with smaller values! , thanks.
Anyway was not intending to do that. Too much work + you need time to research those things.

[QuintusSertorius]

What are the new default values in 2.01?

[Nightshift]

I'm actually quiete happy with the (slightly adjusted) values now as a javelin throwing unit may just get the edge needed over another one that doesn't throw.
After some campaign battles I must say archers are just good too since they don't do as much damage against units with shields or armor (even naked fanatics=shields sufficent).

So what I said before was kind of bullshit, since the game allready calculates from where a shot has been taken (at least it seems to me) and wether or not the unit has a shield.

Is this hardcoded and just reads some values (for amour for example) from files or is it handled in another config?

And does it make sense to put elite units on right flank, since the right side is more vulnerable?

[Cybvep]

I suspect that it's the same as in RTW1, i.e. the armour protects from all sides, the shield protects the front and the left sides and the defensive skill protects the front and the right sides, but doesn't protect against missiles at all.

[joshmahurin]

What are the new default values in 2.01?

I believe so yes. @Moros can you confirm?