Ukraine Thread

[Gilrandir]

I don't know if you had actually seen the entire documentary - that was a small part of a much longer conversation, but shown at the beginning for the WOW factor. That part of the conversation happens around halfway through the documentary where he goes about it at greater length and explains his position fully.

I watched the whole of it. He said what he said whatever may follow or whatever effect it was meant to produce. The fact holds: at 7 a.m. February 23 he proclaimed he "was bringing the Crimea home" on which he decided the night before. And you said I was lying. Your reading of his words again smacks of weaseling out you had applied interpreting his "soldiers' backs" phrase although you seem to dislike that tactics so much.

[Sarmatian]

I watched the whole of it. He said what he said whatever may follow or whatever effect it was meant to produce. The fact holds: at 7 a.m. February 23 he proclaimed he "was bringing the Crimea home" on which he decided the night before. And you said I was lying. Your reading of his words again smacks of weaseling out you had applied interpreting his "soldiers' backs" phrase although you seem to dislike that tactics so much.

You are lying. I'm just not sure if you're doing it on purpose or if you aren't fully aware of it.

Transcript from 1:50 to 3:12 (Putin speaking continuously)

"At 7am, (February 23rd) I've told to my 4 associates: The situation in Ukraine has turned out in such a way that we are forced to begin work on returning Crimea to Russia. Because we can not let the territory and the people there adrift under steamroller of nationalists. And I have set certain tasks and outlined what needs to be done and how. And I have to stress right away, that we would only do it in case that we are absolutely certain that people that live in Crimea want it themselves. We had to give a chance for people to express their opinion. That was our goal, frankly speaking. I thought to myself, that if people want it, so be it. They would have certain additional rights, wider autonomy, but within Ukraine. So be it than. But if they want to go the other way, we can not let them down."

[Gilrandir]

You are lying. I'm just not sure if you're doing it on purpose or if you aren't fully aware of it.

Transcript from 1:50 to 3:12 (Putin speaking continuously)

"At 7am, (February 23rd) I've told to my 4 associates: The situation in Ukraine has turned out in such a way that we are forced to begin work on returning Crimea to Russia. Because we can not let the territory and the people there adrift under steamroller of nationalists. And I have set certain tasks and outlined what needs to be done and how. And I have to stress right away, that we would only do it in case that we are absolutely certain that people that live in Crimea want it themselves. We had to give a chance for people to express their opinion. That was our goal, frankly speaking. I thought to myself, that if people want it, so be it. They would have certain additional rights, wider autonomy, but within Ukraine. So be it than. But if they want to go the other way, we can not let them down."

Where am I lying?

[Sarmatian]

Where am I lying?

You're taking a part of a larger speech and fixating on it, completely ignoring the rest where it is more clearly explained. In this case, Putin explained that he set certain tasks and outlined what needs to be done in case people who live in Crimea want it themselves.

A different, more neutral example for you - EU says: We will help Greece financially. But, only if Greece accepts difficult reforms and extraordinary austerity measures. If you look at everything that's been said, it's clear that EU will give Greece monetary aid if Greece agrees to the conditions. If you choose to ignore the second sentence, it would mean the EU will help Greece without any additional conditions.

That's why it is important to take everything that's been said into account. If you pick only one sentence you like and ignore the rest, you'll get a distorted picture.

This explanation was in case that you b) weren't fully aware of it. In case of a) you're doing it on purpose, there's not much I can do.