IMMIGRATION thread

[Brenus]

"This reminds me something... Ah, yes, Lenin in 1917. Will Marxists ever change their rhetorics of "traitors yielding the national property to international capitalists" and "down with those we don't like"? The USSR story didn't teach them anything."Show me in it "the important part of your sentence" which mentions ANY economy: Underline for you as you apparently suffer of short memory deficiency. As you can see, the part I highlight was part of one of your sentence, which contains my quote.

"It only corroborates my statement that Marxists (and you proudly count yourself as one) are not different from the rest of the scum you are so fond of denouncing. " Expect of course, one, you NEVER denounced nazism, well, generally speaking yes, but in reality no, as you ALWAYS find a good reason why Ukrainian Nazi are not THAT much nazi, and two, you still don't understand what Marxism is. Well, to be fair, you don't seem to understand what Nazism is either.

"Advocating let's-seize-all-property-and-split-it-even- between-all-citizens approach?" Still leaving in the 19th Century? You really should go about your USSR model...

The words "to scrap" and "to take the government down" are very different (to put it mildly) from "a democratic revolution by votes".
So you should be more precise in wording your thoughts if you want others to read them correctly. Not the first time I say that. That is because you still live in the 19th Century early Soviet Union state of mind, so you translate words in something they are not telling. Nothing I can do about it, sorry. I tried and failed miserably.


"You know perfectly well that only a small part of Maidaners were nazis, yet you call it "a nazi coup"." Ahhh.... Finally... We are making progress. So, you are now admitting part that you qualify of small (and I would agree with you) were Nazi. Good. Then, yes, the Coup itself was made by this minority, well organised and highly motivated. Like during the Russian Revolution you always refer to, 2 steps, and the active minority won. In case of Ukraine it went wrong for the Nazi as they failed their target (Former President escaped, and worst, Crimea lost and rebellion of the Russian Ukrainians (or Ukrainian Russian as you please) went berserk and started to fight back again real or perceive ethnic/cultural/political menaces.
As facts for claim of will of ethnic cleansing: Army Unit with 2 SS PZ Division Das Reich, ban of Russian language, and various demonstrations in you country. I linked all this, so go back to the links, provided by BBC and US channels.
You willingness to swallow your own propaganda had yest shown you are not ready for truth, but I am not complete out of hope for you, as you start to accept the Nazi thing. Still a lot of work to do, but I am sure you can do it. We are all behind you, you can do it...

"Ok. Let's now bring up all events of the past someone is upset about." . The English are upset about it. They lost the war...
Care to explain what you were trying to show? Because I fail to see it!

"You will have to explain, though, how all this contributes to this discussion of traitors." Err, it was about 1 year old doesn't make it untrue... Nothing to do with traitors... Hmmm, perhaps you are right. I really have to write in more simplistic way if I want to be understand by you...

"Seeing the corruption in Ukraine I will gladly swap it for what you term as lobbying" I wouldn't disagree with this one...

[Gilrandir]

"This reminds me something... Ah, yes, Lenin in 1917. Will Marxists ever change their rhetorics of "traitors yielding the national property to international capitalists" and "down with those we don't like"? The USSR story didn't teach them anything."Show me in it "the important part of your sentence" which mentions ANY economy: Underline for you as you apparently suffer of short memory deficiency. As you can see, the part I highlight was part of one of your sentence, which contains my quote.

Ok, so you come down to calling names again. Now I can react in kind (if our chauvinist moderator doesn't stop me).

You evidently suffer of eyesight problems. Show me were ECONOMY is mentioned.

Expect of course, one, you NEVER denounced nazism, well, generally speaking yes, but in reality no, as you ALWAYS find a good reason why Ukrainian Nazi are not THAT much nazi, Well, to be fair, you don't seem to understand what Nazism is either.

You evidently don't either when you call Right Sector nazis while their chief spokesman and a parliamentary member is a Russian speaking Jew and they were and are financed by the chief Jew of Ukraine - Kolomoisky. So as Kolomoisky put it, either they are not nazis, or I'm not a Jew. Take a pick.

you still don't understand what Marxism is.

For 20 years I lived in the country which practised Marxism for 70 years, while you seem to know about it only from books. So I know what it is if such an ideology is implemented.

"Advocating let's-seize-all-property-and-split-it-even- between-all-citizens approach?" Still leaving in the 19th Century? You really should go about your USSR model...

It was the corner stone of the ideology by which the USSR lived, and it may be an eye-opener for you, but Marxism IS a 19th century ideology, so the question is who's living back then?

The words "to scrap" and "to take the government down" are very different (to put it mildly) from "a democratic revolution by votes".
So you should be more precise in wording your thoughts if you want others to read them correctly. Not the first time I say that. That is because you still live in the 19th Century early Soviet Union state of mind, so you translate words in something they are not telling. Nothing I can do about it, sorry. I tried and failed miserably.

Being miserable at working with language has always been one of your greatest weaknesses. You don't have to be sorry about deficiencies you can't overcome. A one-legged person shouldn't apologize that he can't run 100 meters like Hussain Bolt.

"You know perfectly well that only a small part of Maidaners were nazis, yet you call it "a nazi coup"." Ahhh.... Finally... We are making progress. So, you are now admitting part that you qualify of small (and I would agree with you) were Nazi. Good. Then, yes, the Coup itself was made by this minority, well organised and highly motivated. Like during the Russian Revolution you always refer to, 2 steps, and the active minority won. In case of Ukraine it went wrong for the Nazi as they failed their target (Former President escaped, and worst, Crimea lost and rebellion of the Russian Ukrainians (or Ukrainian Russian as you please) went berserk and started to fight back again real or perceive ethnic/cultural/political menaces.

It seems that short (and perhaps long as well) memory deficiency is all yours.
I never denied that there were nazis on Maidan, but I did and do deny that it was them who were the only combatants and only them "ousted" Yanukovych. If you want to believe in what you believe, go ahead.
And if they were real nazis, they would never merge into background after they had come to power.

You again try to present the events as an ethnic and/or linguistic conflict, and neither is correct. Ethnic Russians and Russian-speakers were as numerous as Ukrainians and Ukrainian speakers on Maidan, 60% of ATO soldiers now are Russian-speakers, some predominantly Russian-speaking regions (Mykolayiv and Dnipropetrovsk) show a higher percentage of those who were mobilized than some "nationalistic" regions (Ternopil). So you still stay a prisoner of the stereotypes and misconceptions you adopted and are going by with.

As facts for claim of will of ethnic cleansing: Army Unit with 2 SS PZ Division Das Reich, ban of Russian language, and various demonstrations in you country. I linked all this, so go back to the links, provided by BBC and US channels.

So wearing emblems and marching and the ban that was repealed a day later equal ethnic cleansing? Now I see how qualified you were in Bosnia to detect ethnic cleansings.

"Ok. Let's now bring up all events of the past someone is upset about." . The English are upset about it. They lost the war...
Care to explain what you were trying to show? Because I fail to see it!

I followed your way: I gave an event of the past that should have signified something and without an explanation of its relation to the topic of traitors posted it. It seems your way of proving something, so I did prove something, though what I proved is known to you only.