Mass Shooting in Orlando become's USA's worst.

[Beskar]

I'm reminded of Orwell's comment about a certain tendency of the left to identify itself with Communism, resulting in whitewashing (redwashing?) anything the USSR does whilst portraying anything the liberal democracies do as in the wrong. The USSR is dead, but that tendency is still there, but their ideological ally of choice is now the anti-Christian-Jewish religious fundies. For the most part, this means allying with Islamism.

Whenever Fragony or someone brings this up, I have to admit, it sounds like crazy-talk. Then again, there are probably a subset of strange individuals where this applies.

[Pannonian]

Whenever Fragony or someone brings this up, I have to admit, it sounds like crazy-talk. Then again, there are probably a subset of strange individuals where this applies.

The people at the top of the Labour party, for one. Orwell noted that these sections of the British Left saw the imperialists as the enemy, and therefore anyone who was the enemy of the imperialists was their friend and ally. Meaning they identified themselves with the Communists. Orwell, as we know, was a socialist and therefore of the Left, but he saw the error, which is obvious to us in hindsight, in allying with the Communists. Hence Animal Farm. He was no fan of imperial Britain either, certainly not after his experiences in Burma, but he also know enough to know that there were worse things in the world.

Our liberal democracy is not perfect by any means, but there are much worse things in the world. Unfortunately, parts of the British Left, nowadays in charge of the Labour party, see the world in the way that Orwell decried, except with Islamists in the place of Communists. If they oppose the imperialists then they must be friends. And I suppose, judging from Husar's posts, that there are equivalents in other countries too.

[Fragony]

shut up and kiss me

[CrossLOPER]

OK, even I didn't expect this one.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36527946

And what exactly does deranged mean? Could someone who joins a terrorist organization to cut off heads and be a murdering superhero not be called a deranged man? Does religious association override psychological conditions? Are terrorist organizations the only organizations on earth with perfectly sane members?
And why does the rise of terrorist organizations coincide with the rise of veganism?

Two things: 1) IS is extremely violent, and attracts violent people. 2) Believing in an omnipotant all-creator who guides all creation and sets strict moral standards under threat of eternal agony can make you do strange things.

And deliberately missing my definition, which is peace time, which is what westerners are used to, and in living memory, which I stretched to mean post WW1. Even WW2 veterans count peace as the default state of being in the west, which is all that the vast majority of us have ever known.

OK. Why only the West?

[Pannonian]

OK. Why only the West?

I live in the UK. I've been around areas that are generally considered the west, and from my experience and what I've read, the experience is similar, as per a generally law-abiding liberal democracy. With little variations on the same theme, the west's societies generally breed people who are respectful of human life and tolerant of social differences. That's the liberal part. The democratic part instils a willingness to accept that one may not necessarily be right. Combined, they produce people who are generally unwilling to kill, and even when they do so as part of a faction, they observe certain limitations on what they do. That is what peace has done to western society. I like it that way.

Why do I only talk about the west? Because that is where my experience stretches. I don't want to speak for other societies and countries. As has been pointed out many times since Iraq, intervention can be painted as imperialism. Therefore we shouldn't intervene, but should let other countries sort things out for themselves. We shouldn't speak for them, and they shouldn't speak for us.

[Lizardo]

Looks like a couple of people on here also want some sharia law by the back door. Allahuhaha

[Slyspy]

The people at the top of the Labour party, for one. Orwell noted that these sections of the British Left saw the imperialists as the enemy, and therefore anyone who was the enemy of the imperialists was their friend and ally.

You would have to be blind if you fail to see that this worked the other way as well. It is one of the reasons why Republican Spain was hung out to dry by those self-same liberal democracies.