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  1. #1
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    Our problematic immigrants come from outside the EU. One of the "desi" arguments I've seen is that we should exit the EU as a clampdown on EU migrants will make getting visas for Indians and Pakistanis easier.
    Everything changed since Merkel's birdcall and the consequences, I don't think many people mind guest-workers from the EU, and I don't see how actually do having a problem with it could ever be racist anyway, it's not about them, it's about people from out of Europe who want to have the furniture changed.
    Last edited by Fragony; 06-30-2016 at 16:41.

  2. #2
    Headless Senior Member Pannonian's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    Everything changed since Merkel's birdcall and the consequences, I don't think many people mind guest-workers from the EU, and I don't see how actually do having a problem with it could ever be racist anyway, it's not about them, it's about people from out of Europe who want to have the furniture changed.
    Even before the referendum, we had the powers to deal with extra-EU migrants. Our borders are relatively easy to keep track of, and laws exist that keep them from establishing themselves de facto. The remote threat was that Turkey could be admitted, which would make it an intra-EU problem, but that possibility was remote given that we'd rejected them in the past and they'd gone even further from our standards since. If there was a non-refugee problem, it wasn't one that significantly touched the UK.

    But then, like I'd said, most of the arguments for exiting the EU could well apply to many countries in the EU, but they didn't apply to the UK. Eurozone-related problems certainly didn't apply, yet they were apparently given by some as the reason for voting Leave. Similarly for the possibility that the accession of Turkey could lead to an influx of Muslims (Greyblades raised this in one of his posts, and there are accounts that people voted Leave to "get the Muslims out"). Which didn't make sense for the goal and the action we were taking. Meanwhile, the majority of Remainers just wanted tomorrow to be largely like today, without anything that we couldn't adequately plan or allow for. Instead, we've torn up everything, and, as the Leavers here have stated, there are no plans for what happens now, as it's not their responsibility to plan for the aftermath of their decision.

    Ugh.

  3. #3
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    It was the responsibility of the government to plan for both results in a referendum they had planned to hold for over a year, that they didnt plan for the outcome they didn't want is thier failing, not the failing of the people who voted that way in the referendum.

    Evidently a change in government is in order, and as labour is tearing itself apart and the conservatives are looking like idiots I expect the next government will look nothing like the last, thank god.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


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  4. #4
    Headless Senior Member Pannonian's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Quote Originally Posted by Greyblades View Post
    It was the responsibility of the government to plan for both results in a referendum they had planned to hold for over a year, that they didnt plan for the outcome they didn't want is thier failing, not the failing of the people who voted that way in the referendum.

    Evidently a change in government is in order, and as labour is tearing itself apart and the conservatives are looking like idiots I expect the next government will look nothing like the last, thank god.
    It's not the failing of the people who campaigned for Leave either, but the failing of the people who campaigned for Remain, to not plan to Leave. It's always someone else's responsibility.

  5. #5
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    It's not the failing of the people who campaigned for Leave either, but the failing of the people who campaigned for Remain, to not plan to Leave. It's always someone else's responsibility.
    The prime minister and his cabinate are responsible, that they campaigned for remain is largely immaterial.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Don't be scared that you don't freak out. Be scared when you don't care about freaking out
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  6. #6
    Headless Senior Member Pannonian's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Hate Crimes Soar Since Brexit Vote - Police

    "Leave the EU
    No more Polish Vermin"

  7. #7
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Pretty tame as hate crimes go, and 331, wow, that's truely a great amount in a nation of 60-70 million, assuming multiple crimes arent being done by the same people.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Don't be scared that you don't freak out. Be scared when you don't care about freaking out
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  8. #8
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    Hate Crimes Soar Since Brexit Vote - Police

    "Leave the EU
    No more Polish Vermin"
    Kinda sceptical because Polish vermin is so specific, but I am often wrong. But over hete at least these things almost always turn out to be not what it initinally looked like, antifacistslol have been busted sooo many times that I am on hold when I read these things

    'leave the EU, no more Polish vermin' is also odd, wouldn't it be 'Leave England', why would nationalist say 'leave the EU' after the referendum, makes no sense
    Last edited by Fragony; 06-30-2016 at 19:20.

  9. #9
    Clan Clan InsaneApache's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    Hate Crimes Soar Since Brexit Vote - Police

    "Leave the EU
    No more Polish Vermin"
    Reported mate reported. Not the same thing at all.

    Still that 'appeal to authority' is endemic on the left.
    There are times I wish they’d just ban everything- baccy and beer, burgers and bangers, and all the rest- once and for all. Instead, they creep forward one apparently tiny step at a time. It’s like being executed with a bacon slicer.

    “Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedy.”

    To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticise.

    "The purpose of a university education for Left / Liberals is to attain all the politically correct attitudes towards minorties, and the financial means to live as far away from them as possible."

  10. #10
    Voluntary Suspension Voluntary Suspension Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    Hate Crimes Soar Since Brexit Vote - Police

    "Leave the EU
    No more Polish Vermin"
    It's distressing - to be sure. Obviously the majority of the diot racists voted Leave (clever racists would vote to stay) and now they feel empowered. It will take a few weeks to sink in but then they'll slink back to their holes once they realise they're still loathed.

    Of more import: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politic...endum-36678222

    "Under EU law, the bloc cannot negotiate a separate trade deal with one of its own members, hence the commissioner's insistence that the UK must first leave.It is also against EU law for a member to negotiate its own trade deals with outsiders, which means the UK cannot start doing this until after it has left the EU."

    Rather begs the question of why we need the complex exit negotiations, really, if they're just going to screw us anyway.

    I rather think that this circumstance is unlikely - if the EU does choose to punish the British people en masse with this then it's just another argument for leaving as quickly as possible.
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."

    [IMG]https://img197.imageshack.us/img197/4917/logoromans23pd.jpg[/IMG]

  11. #11

    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Quote Originally Posted by Greyblades View Post
    It was the responsibility of the government to plan for both results in a referendum they had planned to hold for over a year, that they didnt plan for the outcome they didn't want is thier failing, not the failing of the people who voted that way in the referendum.
    Why would leavers accept a plan by a remain government? I don't follow extremely Eurocentric issues like this but sounds like "give me some matches so I can light a fire under your ass for takeoff."

  12. #12
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Because it's not supposed to be a remain government, they got in on the promise of the referendum.

    That they now want to go back on it probably tells you how electable they will be in 2020.
    Last edited by Greyblades; 07-01-2016 at 22:24.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Don't be scared that you don't freak out. Be scared when you don't care about freaking out
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  13. #13

    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Make of it what you will:

    Ja-mata TosaInu

  14. #14
    Clan Clan InsaneApache's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Quote Originally Posted by HopAlongBunny View Post
    Make of it what you will:

    I met Joe Strummer in Liverpool in '77 and ended up sleeping in his bed. True.

    I prefer this one though.....

    Last edited by InsaneApache; 07-02-2016 at 13:36.
    There are times I wish they’d just ban everything- baccy and beer, burgers and bangers, and all the rest- once and for all. Instead, they creep forward one apparently tiny step at a time. It’s like being executed with a bacon slicer.

    “Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedy.”

    To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticise.

    "The purpose of a university education for Left / Liberals is to attain all the politically correct attitudes towards minorties, and the financial means to live as far away from them as possible."

  15. #15
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: UK referendum: Out and Lied to

    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    Even before the referendum, we had the powers to deal with extra-EU migrants. Our borders are relatively easy to keep track of, and laws exist that keep them from establishing themselves de facto. The remote threat was that Turkey could be admitted, which would make it an intra-EU problem, but that possibility was remote given that we'd rejected them in the past and they'd gone even further from our standards since. If there was a non-refugee problem, it wasn't one that significantly touched the UK.

    But then, like I'd said, most of the arguments for exiting the EU could well apply to many countries in the EU, but they didn't apply to the UK. Eurozone-related problems certainly didn't apply, yet they were apparently given by some as the reason for voting Leave. Similarly for the possibility that the accession of Turkey could lead to an influx of Muslims (Greyblades raised this in one of his posts, and there are accounts that people voted Leave to "get the Muslims out"). Which didn't make sense for the goal and the action we were taking. Meanwhile, the majority of Remainers just wanted tomorrow to be largely like today, without anything that we couldn't adequately plan or allow for. Instead, we've torn up everything, and, as the Leavers here have stated, there are no plans for what happens now, as it's not their responsibility to plan for the aftermath of their decision.

    Ugh.
    It's Germany who screwed up not the UK, the Merkel is only making things worse for herself as the Visegrad-countries just disregard her threats. The Brits are in a pretty comfortable position.

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