SYRIA thread

[Montmorency]

It takes about ten seconds to say, "No, comrade, it was a rebel cache of toxic gas!

To be fair, bureaucratic details won't be known by every member of the organization, and even important information could take longer than you expect to transmit to those who need it.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

To be fair, bureaucratic details won't be known by every member of the organization, and even important information could take longer than you expect to transmit to those who need it.

So we have incompetence vs the Kremlin policy to just lie, lie, lie.

[Brenus]

So we have incompetence vs the Kremlin policy to just lie, lie, lie.

The problem here, at least for me, is, as French, the experience of US and UK lying lying lying in several occasions in order to justify illegal wars and is still alive in my memory.
The smear campaign against France before and after Iraq II "the Return with a vengeance" and the robust flow of insults (firstly against intelligence) are still in my mind. Russia didn't participate in this, but our "allies" did.
So my experience and point of view is a bit different, I admit.

[Beskar]

The problem here, at least for me, is, as French, the experience of US and UK lying lying lying in several occasions in order to justify illegal wars and is still alive in my memory.
The smear campaign against France before and after Iraq II "the Return with a vengeance" and the robust flow of insults (firstly against intelligence) are still in my mind. Russia didn't participate in this, but our "allies" did.
So my experience and point of view is a bit different, I admit.

They renamed French Fries to Freedom Fries and banned French Mustard (which is an English Mustard brand). Things got pretty serious.

[Brenus]

They renamed French Fries to Freedom Fries and banned French Mustard (which is an English Mustard brand). Things got pretty serious.

Yeah, and this kind of things and as well "we will forgive Germany and punish France".
And the usual joke about French militaries...
If you think I forgot...

[Shaka_Khan]

The problem here, at least for me, is, as French, the experience of US and UK lying lying lying in several occasions in order to justify illegal wars and is still alive in my memory.
The smear campaign against France before and after Iraq II "the Return with a vengeance" and the robust flow of insults (firstly against intelligence) are still in my mind. Russia didn't participate in this, but our "allies" did.
So my experience and point of view is a bit different, I admit.

They renamed French Fries to Freedom Fries and banned French Mustard (which is an English Mustard brand). Things got pretty serious.

It happened at totalwar.com, too. There was a lot of French-bashing until a mod put a stop to it.

[AE Bravo]

So we have incompetence vs the Kremlin policy to just lie, lie, lie.

I don't understand this. They are asking for an investigation, give it to them if they're such liars...

http://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-g...411-story.html
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...llerson-237097

Rather than breaking national (US) and international laws.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

The problem here, at least for me, is, as French, the experience of US and UK lying lying lying in several occasions in order to justify illegal wars and is still alive in my memory.
The smear campaign against France before and after Iraq II "the Return with a vengeance" and the robust flow of insults (firstly against intelligence) are still in my mind. Russia didn't participate in this, but our "allies" did.
So my experience and point of view is a bit different, I admit.

The only incidence of out-and-out "lying" I can think of from the UK/US is Gulf War II and then the lie was essentially turning "he might have WMD, but probably not, but he's blocking inspections" into "He probably has WMD and he's blocking inspections!"

This is what is known in Blighty as "being economical with the Truth".

Compare to Putin in Crimea "we have no troops in Crimea."

See the difference?

Added to which, both the UK and US have been through TWO political leaders since where Russia is still ruled by Putin's iron fist, just like 2003.

I don't understand this. They are asking for an investigation, give it to them if they're such liars...

http://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-g...411-story.html
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...llerson-237097

Rather than breaking national (US) and international laws.

When the enquiry implicates Assad's regime Russia will call it filthy lies, just like the enquiry into the downing of MH17.

[Brenus]

See the difference?

Not really.
And for forgot "the Operation Horse Shoes" in Kosovo, the bodies piling-up in the Coal Mines, mass-graves to justify the final destruction of what left from Yugoslavia.
Plus I find a bit of irony for a country that use massively the Orange Agent (TCDD is the most toxic of the dioxins) in Vietnam to be the chief prosecution...

[Tristuskhan]

Plus I find a bit of irony for a country that use massively the Orange Agent (TCDD is the most toxic of the dioxins) in Vietnam to be the chief prosecution...

A war that got hot following the Tonkin Gulf Incident. Blattant lie.
What could we say about 89' intervention in Panama?
""necessary to safeguard the lives of U.S. citizens in Panama, defend democracy and human rights, combat drug trafficking, and secure the neutrality of the Panama Canal as required by the Torrijos–Carter Treaties" (Pdt Bush). The part about drug trafficking is not a lie. The rest.... more than so-so.

The overthrow of Juan Bosch of Dominican Republic in 1965 was made under allegations of communism and "foreign support", both a lot unsubstanciated.

What else....?

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Found this via BBC:

https://assets.documentcloud.org/doc...hite-House.pdf

The US has declassified a four-page report on the attack, just skimming it shows there's a lot there to indicate Sarin and regime involvement.

Now, it could be a lie but cui bono suggests not, as without the report there's no discernible motivation for the US strike.

[Brenus]

What else....?

Granada? Chile? Nicaragua? Iran?